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First off...

LOVE the change!!!! For the first time, the incumbent will have REAL competition!!!!

As for Hugh's comments on stock, ownership and voting... The US allows for classes of stock that can be set with proportionality. This is how they maintain American control but with foreign ownership. One excellent example is UPS. They only allowed 10% public voting power even with the size of the IPO. The ratio was set as 10 votes for the employee owned stock 1 for public stock.

If there was something ILLEGAL, then there would have been hay on that by now. I will give that there is a BROKEN process in Canada for things like wireless providers. To use the term corrupt would be to say that it was at one time, not corrupt. That is something that I do not believe. The CRTC has been a boondoggle from the get go almost.
 

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My Bold 9000 can see the Wind network (near YYZ airport)
It can see one-half of the Wind network but it will never connect with the Wind network. Wind uses the "AWS" band, which uses UMTS band IV, referred to as the 1700 MHz frequency band. It uses 1710-1755 for uplink and 2110-2155 for downlink. The Wind downlink is within the UMTS band I, referred to as the 2100 MHz (or IMT) band, which uses 1920-1980 for uplink and 2110-2170 for downlink. Therefore many 3G/HSPA phones that support the 2100 band (common in Europe and some parts of Asia and Australia) will "see" the Wind downlink but won't ever connect.

There are no Blackberries, or as far as I know, any phone from Rogers that support the Wind spectrum on UMTS band IV.
 

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Westjet and Air Canada also have proportional voting shares for their share sold to non-Canadians. The voting proportion is automatically adjusted to ensure that foreign shareholders never have more than a 25% voting block.
 

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timlocke. wind does use 2100 in canada, but 1700 is the uplink, 2100 is the downlink. its unusual because its split into two unlike the other bands they use 850 uplink/850 downlink, so we only say 850 once, not twice. otherwise we'd say 850/850, 1900/1900, 1700/2100, but it becomes too cluttered, so instead we will use 850/1900/AWS/IMT, got it?
 

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Fom what I understand, Wind is similar to T-Mobile: both operate in the AWS band. So the Rogers Blackberry Bold 9700 is not functional in the Wind spectrum. Wind will be selling the same model, the 9700 with, presumably, out-of-the box functionality (as does T-Mobile).
 

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Some things make my day. This made my week. I hope this is the start of a flood of choices, and not just on the mobile front.

The existing telecos brought this on themselves. They had plenty of opportunities to provide good service at a fair price, and instead they stacked the CRTC with their own people in order to gouge us. Politicans are not stupid, they can sense discontent.

IMO corporations that use patriotism for their own financial gains are committing treason. We have put up with this for too long.
 

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I wonder when Videotron will ready their 3G network since Wind does not own any spectrum in Quebec. I'm it's soon and Videotron matches Wind and undercuts the big 3.
 

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timlocke. wind does use 2100 in canada, but 1700 is the uplink, 2100 is the downlink. its unusual because its split into two unlike the other bands they use 850 uplink/850 downlink, so we only say 850 once, not twice. otherwise we'd say 850/850, 1900/1900, 1700/2100, but it becomes too cluttered, so instead we will use 850/1900/AWS/IMT, got it?
Thanks Paolo. After my last post I did go and research this. Still seems complex for the number of radios on a chip for a phone with power constrained by a tiny battery. Especially with wifi and bluetooth in there as well... the wonders of modern electronics. The phones may have to have 3 receivers and two transmitters going at the same time ( tx bluetooth and some phone or wifi, rx gps , bluetooth and some phone or wifi)
Anyway... all I care about is that these phones can instantly connect to and work on the best available network when roaming without me having to manually tell the phone to search for a network. AND importantly NOT to have to buy an expensive BB to get this facility.
 

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Hugh, I wasn't trying to mock your comment at all. On the contrary. I used quotations around the word corrupt to recognize your use of the term which (I believe) you meant to indicate a corruption of process. I posited that the process was working as it should as cabinet has always been the final arbiter of an Act even though an arms' length regulator has been ceded that responsibility. I do agree there is 'corruption of process' in terms of two different federal ministries having a say in the matter. That needs to be rectified.
 

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For the record I agree with Hugh on this whole thing. The current government is clearly biased against the CRTC and this whole deal really seems fishy to me.

Don't get me wrong, I welcome competition and I have complained many times on this forum and elsewhere that we Canadians don't have good rates on mobile packages but I'm not ready to see the rules "bypassed" like this to get there.
 

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"The current government is clearly biased against the CRTC and this whole deal really seems fishy to me"

This ruling is only a day old, has anyone actually had the time to do the analysis and determine that is actually the case?

In general I have a problem with quasi-government regulatory bodies like the CRTC - they usually end up serving the industry they are suppose to regulate. They are stacked with appointees from the industry who rotates between these bodies and the industry, and the consumer gets the shaft. An example other than the CRTC is the Ontario Securities Commission. Like the CRTC, they have the authority to send people to jail, but they have never done anything for the consumer. Unless you are a very wealthy investor, the commission you pay today is the same as 20 years ago, while in the U.S. they are significantly less. And those who have had their investment accounts stolen (literally) cannot find support form the OSC who is suppose to protect them.

Bodies like the CRTC is suppose to make them independent from the politicians. But from a consumer perspective, the industry is a far worse enemy than the policitans.
 

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Just my 2 cents but I hope these guys FAIL big time.

Don't get me wrong...I think we need more competition in Canada but WIND doesn't bring this to the second largest market in the country...Quebec.

The earlier they can go bankrupt, the better. Make room for true nation-wide competition. Never thought I'd defend them but at least Bell/Telus/Rogers provides service everywhere.
 

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In my humble experience commissions can rule on their domain but a government body always, always has the right to overturn their rulings. Ask me how I know. :) So I believe this was open to interpretation and it was interpreted differently by Cabinet. The next applicant can have the same process and result occur in the same circumstance.

Rogers, Bell, and Telus look corrupt to me and actually need this wake-up call.
 

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timlocke. wind does use 2100 in canada, but 1700 is the uplink, 2100 is the downlink. its unusual because its split into two unlike the other bands they use 850 uplink/850 downlink, so we only say 850 once, not twice. otherwise we'd say 850/850, 1900/1900, 1700/2100, but it becomes too cluttered, so instead we will use 850/1900/AWS/IMT, got it?
Actually, all the bands are split, just generally not by so much.

The European/Asia 2100 band is 1900 up / 2100 down for instance.

The description on phone spec's is generally more like:

GSM: 850/900/1800/1900 (quadband "world" coverage or some subset for local usage)
UMTS/WCDMA/HSPA: 850/1900/2100 (Common for North America, UMTS bands I, II, V)) or 900/1800/2100 (Common for Europe and other parts of the world). Quad-band UMTS phones are very rare or perhaps even non-existant for models actually in production and distribution but would need 850/1700/1900/2100 for decent world-wide and North American UMTS coverage.

The actual band IDs can be found here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UMTS_frequency_bands
 

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It's about time

Wind its about time! No more gouging from Ma Bell and Rogers and I don't like the 3 yr contract bs. If Clement's decision was corrupt, then corruption in the public interest is most welcome. Let the best company win.
 

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Just my 2 cents but I hope these guys FAIL big time.

Don't get me wrong...I think we need more competition in Canada but WIND doesn't bring this to the second largest market in the country...Quebec.

The earlier they can go bankrupt, the better. Make room for true nation-wide competition. Never thought I'd defend them but at least Bell/Telus/Rogers provides service everywhere.
Err.. it's not like it was by CHOICE.
They didn't win the bids for spectrum in Quebec...
 
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