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the TiVo HD XL. The new TiVo is a near twin of the existing TiVo HD, but for three changes: it's got a much larger 1 terabyte hard drive (enough capacity for 150 hours of HD programming); it's THX-certified; and it includes the premium TiVo backlit remote. The package costs $600--about the price that the TiVo Series3 was going for, and twice that of the "standard" TiVo HD. As with any TiVo, of course, you'll also need to budget money for a subscription fee: $13 a month, $129 a year, or $399 for the lifetime of the box

from CNET Crave post

and the following is a link to a review from PC Magazine if you are interested.

PC Magazine Review
 

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CableCARDS

CableCARDS = :(

When will they ditch the CableCARD requirement. I'm not giving up hope that someday they will or at least release a model where we can use your service providers.
 

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TiVo won't, until there is something else to build to.
Sure about that? There has been some rumblings about Tivo creating an HD unit that could be used with both DISH and DirecTV. Certainly those same units could then be used in Canada with satellite or cable HD receivers as well.

Think about all the DISH and DTV customers that Tivo is missing out on. They must be thinking about a way to get to them as customers too. Canada would follow hand in hand with whatever they come out with.
 

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A few comments regarding the CBC article, post 7.

1. Although there are some less expensive TiVo HD recorders, the ones that are similar to the $600 Cable PVRs are not really any less expensive, especially when IPG fees are factored in.

2. CableCARD was forced onto the providers in the US. Had that not been the case, the situation in the US would likely have been the same as here.

3. CableCARD was not introduced into Canada since it wasn't two-way and bombed in the US with extremely low penetration - see the CableCARD thread in this forum.

4. SD TiVo may have a larger following in the US, but it was introduced there much earlier than in Canada.

5. Digital channel penetration in Canada is much higher than in the US, and since the TiVo is kludgy to use with digital, not many people have used it and use the service provider's PVR.
 

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Well, my ONLY comment on the CBC article is this is EXACTLY what happens in Canada due to the CRTC and monopolies. The consumer suffers and competition cannot compete because they can't even be on the same level.

This does nothing but line the pockets of big business here in Canada and hurt us, the consumer.
 

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Actually, it's exactly the opposite. In the US there was government intervention to force CableCARD onto the Cable service providers and TV manufacturers, therefore all television customers ended up paying a lot more for many TVs for several years, due to mandatory CableCARD. Only a very small percentage of the people ever used this expensive mandatory (and outdated since it's one-way) technology. Very few people are mourning the loss of CableCARD.

Tru2Way may be a different matter, but we'll see about that.

Further discussion about CableCARD and Tru2Way should be in the respective threads, since this thread is supposed to be about the new TiVo.
 

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Not sure I underarstand your take on this 57. Tivo HD cannot be used in Canada. It can't be used because there is no way to get the signal through the HD unit WITHOUT cablecard. Since this was not adopted by Canadian cable companies, this in fact made it so there is no competition because the end user needs to purchase their HD PVR from the cable company and cannot use a third party PVR. That was my point.

I don't understand why they simply cannot release an HD Tivo that allows you to connect an HDMI cable or component cable from the HD cable box through to the Tivo like you do to your HDTV right now. Then let the Tivo change channels on the HD STB like it does not with an IR blaster and connect the Tivo to your HDTV using either HDMI or component.
 

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TheIgster Two things.

1. In post 10 I was talking about the fact that it was government intervention that forced the US cable companies and TV manufacturers to include CableCARD (at very high consumer cost, especially for consumers that had no use for it). Had it not been for the US Government, CableCARD would have been a non-starter. Aren't most of the people in this forum usually advocating against this sort of intervention? You mentioned the CRTC in post 9 and I thought you wanted them to stay out of the "marketplace". The CRTC did stay out of the marketplace, hence no CableCARD in Canada.

...connect an HDMI cable or component cable from the HD cable box through to the Tivo...
The stream is too large (over 1 Gb/sec to record and needs to be encoded. TiVo doesn't encode, it records bit for bit the MPEG stream of 19.4 Mbps maximum (almost a factor of 100 less information). Also, DRM makes this unlikely to be a "starter" in a mass-market device.
 

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Well, this is one instance where intervention by the CRTC might have been a good thing because we could have had cablecard and thus more choices when it comes to HD PVR's over what the cable companies offer.

I love my SD Tivo. Simply wish there was a way to have an HD Tivo because in the not to distant future, my SD Tivo will be useless with more and more HD coming.
 

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The stream is too large (over 1 Gb/sec to record and needs to be encoded. TiVo doesn't encode, it records bit for bit the MPEG stream of 19.4 Mbps maximum (almost a factor of 100 less information). Also, DRM makes this unlikely to be a "starter" in a mass-market device.
What do you mean by saying that the stream is too large (over 1GB/sec)? With TheIgster's setup you would only be recording one channel at a time which would be maximum 19.4Mbps.
 

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An HDMI or CV stream that TheIgster wanted to record is over 1 Gbps, not maximum 19.4 Mbps which is the QAM stream. That's why an encoder would be required (not on current recorders and not cheap if you want good quality).
 

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I am confused. Are you saying that the amount of information traveling between the HD receiver and TV is 1Gb/s using HDMI? What about the component outputs?
 

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Same for component video. The original HD programme is over 1 Gbps and is then compressed, by the affiliate or network, to under 19.4 Mbps by MPEG (a compression factor of almost 100). That's why there are macroblocking and compression artifacts on all HD programming when there is a certain amount of movement on the screen.

It's amazing that HD looks as good as it does considering the compression that it goes through. The STB then uncompresses the signal for HDMI and CV to the TV.
 

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So the only way would be for the Tivo to encode (ie compress) the 1Gb/s stream so the file size is smaller and takes up less room on the hard drive. And then uncompress it for playback. I am guessing that the encoding is not easy and would add cost to the Tivo. Is it harder to compress a signal than to uncompress it?
 

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Right on all counts. The other issue that I mentioned earlier in this thread is the one of DRM (Digital Rights Management). Mass market devices like TiVo would never be allowed to input HDMI or CV for HD recording.
 

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TheIgster:
It is not that they cannot (which is part of it, for reasons 57 mentioned), but that they do not want to, becasue the TiVo heads probably feel that a box recording HD DVR would be too expensive for the small number of potential uisers of a system, where a direct cable/OTA recording DVR, which is relatively cheap to develop and build, has a much larger potential user base.

57:
I don't get where Cablecard is a total failure, except perhaps fewer sets including CC slots. Sure, it is not a raging success, but things are getting better. Cable providers now have to use Cablecards in their boxes (although they don't have to field marry the card and box, and can still use a relatively closed 2-way system), and are warming to 3rd party Cablecard gear more.

True2Way next year will hopefully invigorate the 3rd party cable tuner market.
 
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