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Looking at the link of the SC dish setup posted by joshuals it makes more sense. I didn't think that you could fit a standard rectangular "bell style" LNBF on a SC dish. I see now that the larger SC LNBF has a little plastic rectangle to fit on the arm - so mechanically interchangable - electrically, not.

You will need that installer to fly up or you need to find a SC LNBF. I wouldn't tell them about the linear/circular issue, the CSR's can get a little cranky if you know more than they do. You need to release the information to them gradually until they make the decision you want them to. Start by playing dumb and say that your LNB doesn't look like the one in the manual, and someone told you it looks like a Bell LNB.
 

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Discussion Starter #22
i told them that it didn't look like the one in the manuel...she said that they made all different kind of lnbf's before and that if its hooked up to the sc dish it should work....then she started saying that the dish itself is probably broken..it doesn't look like it...anyways the're gonna send me a new dish by mail and said it might take up to 7 or 10 days :( oh and she said that on dishpointer dot com that they use the starchoice satellite that is 4 up from the bottom of the list...never noticed that before.

its still the same info as anik 2 tho
 

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she said that they made all different kind of lnbf's before
They did....but to my knowledge, they never had one that even vaguely resembled the one in your photo.

It is possible to use a linear LNB with Shaw that is pretty much identical in appearance to the one you show in your photo. But again, it will only receive one satellite. At one time I had such a set-up at my winter home in the US because I was only interested in French programming, and that all comes from F2. The advantage was that replacement LNB's of that kind were readily available in the US, whereas the standard Shaw LNB is available only in Canada and only from Shaw.

Sounds like you're on the right track to get a new dish/LNB from Shaw....once it arrives there are enough folks on this forum who can walk you through getting it pointed in the event you run into trouble.....
 

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You certainly need a new QUAD LNB at minimum, a whole new setup would be best though.

The other reason the LNB won't work, aside from the circular polarization vs liner issues are the frequencies.

The circular run at the mentioned 12.2 -12.7 GHz.
A SD linear operates below that in the 11.7-12.2Ghz band.

Your pretty much hooped on both counts then.

In addition, running the lnb, while it does mount on the dish, upsets the focal point by about 2 or 3 degrees.

A SD LNB for that arm uses either a bracket with a ring that chokes the neck of the LNB or has a molded base that aligns everything properly.

I have used the 24 & 33" oval SD dishes with the same DTV32 LNB's for 'other' services very nicely once I compensate for the slight elevation errors.
I find the larger gain in marginal conditions much better than the normal 18" pizza pans.
 

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You certainly need a new QUAD LNB at minimum,
It does appear from the photo that this is a 75e, doesn't it? Therefore, if you decide to go with just replacing the LNB, make sure you get one that is matched with the 75e, and not one that is for the 60e.
 

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satellite tv finder alignment tool software

Hello,

Not sure if this is the place to ask but it is the provider I am with.

Does anyone know of any software version of a finder alignment tool? Something that you could hook up to your laptop and to your dish that would notify you when you are directed at a satellite and which satellite it is? Maybe even tell you your current elevation and such.

I'm curious because I live out in the boonies and for me to get a hand held finder alignment tool would take me a few tanks of gas to get one. It would be easier for me to get a software version.

Respects,

Lhlalyam
 

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There is an ap for the I phone that superimposes the sat arc and which sats are visable. It uses the built in camera.
 

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Thank you JCM,

I've seen that one on the Internet. Unfortunately, I do not have an Iphone.

I did find one while doing some research. This one has some pretty good instructions and details. It allows you to use the sun and daylight hours to assist in setting up your dish.
Link: http://www.al-soft.com/saa/satinfo.shtml

I'm hoping to find satellite finder software that creates an audible sound as the dish is pointed closer toward a satellite. Also, it would be good if the same software could tell you what satellite you are pointed too. Maybe I'm just dreaming.

Respects,

Lhlalyam
 

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Improve alignment on Anik F2?

I'm getting a weak signal on most of my HD channels, while the signal remains strong on the SD channels. I'm guessing that means the alignment is a bit off on Anik F2? Is there a way to adjust alignment independently for the F2 satellite, or is it fixed relative to F1?

I installed my own dish years ago, and it wasn't too difficult to get the angles right with just one satellite to worry about. But when I upgraded to HD, *C sent an installer to put the new dual-satellite head on the end of the arm, and I don't know if any additional alignment steps were necessary. Where would I find the proper procedure? Is it more difficult to get both aligned correctly?

I realize that signal strength reduction can also be due to something slightly blocking one satellite, but I've sighted from the dish along the proper azimuth and elevation angles, and considering that the satellites are only supposed to be a 4 degrees apart, it doesn't look like blocking could be the problem. Which satellite is further west?
 

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Which satellite is further west?
Anik F2 is further west at longitude 111.1. Anik F1R is located at 107.3.

Is there a way to adjust alignment independently for the F2 satellite, or is it fixed relative to F1?
Is it more difficult to get both aligned correctly?
The arm that holds the LNB should be "looking at" Anik F2, also known as "Sat B" (see markings on the LNB). You should use a website such as Dishpointer.com (see tab on this forum) to determine the azimuth, elevation, and skew for your location. There are other sources of this information, such as Global Communications Website, but in any case, the data that you use should be for Anik F2. When your dish is correctly pointed at Anik F2 and correctly skewed, Anik F1R will then come in "automatically" to the "Sat A" side of the LNB. Note that on the LNB that the receptor for "Sat A" is to the right of the "Sat B" receptor, as the signals cross when reflected off the dish.

I'm guessing that means the alignment is a bit off on Anik F2?
That's possible, since the vast majority of HDef comes from Anik F2. If you want to further analyze this situation, you can make a determination of exactly which channels are weak, and then check the following links to see which satellites those channels come from:

http://www.lyngsat.com/packages/shawf1_chno.html
http://www.lyngsat.com/packages/shawf2_chno.html

I'm getting a weak signal on most of my HD channels, while the signal remains strong on the SD channels
I presume you're using the Ecb/No (Options 6-4-7 Line C) as a measure of your signal strength. Keep in mind that the Ecb/No on HDef channels will likely be 2.0 less than the Ecb/No for SDef channels. You don't state your location, but assuming you're somewhere in Canada, you should be getting an Ecb/No of +9.0 or better on SDef channels unless you have an obstruction to the line of sight.
 

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Thanks. So you are confirming that there is no adjustment to aim for the two satellites independently, and the dish should just be aimed for Anik F2?

My Ecb/No values are about 6 for F2 and 4 for F1 respectively (yes, I had it reversed earlier whether it was HD or SD that was lower, so this is the opposite of the relative signal strength that would be expected). Is it common for a slight mis-alignment to affect one satellite more than the other? Is there any particular type of mis-alignment that is more likely to cause that (i.e., azimuth, elevation or skew?). Looking for any hints from experience that would allow me to zero in on the problem quicker. I'm in Vancouver. It's cold and wet and miserable up there on the roof this time of year. :)
 

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most modern satellite receivers have some sort of beeping or audible tone
in their setup/install screens. What I do is use a cordless phone outside,
and place another phone inside the house near the TV speaker.

Then while aligning or making adjustments outside, you can hear the pitch
of the tone change via the telephone.
 

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So you are confirming that there is no adjustment to aim for the two satellites independently, and the dish should just be aimed for Anik F2?
That's correct. The procedure for doing a new install is to point the dish "boresite" toward F2 and use the signal meter on channel 299 which comes from F1R. Seems incongruous, huh? But because of the properties of the dish, pointing correctly at F2 will automatically get a signal from F1R. Then comes the fine-tuning.....see below.

But note that I'm assuming you are using either a 75e or a 60e Shaw (Star Choice) elliptical offset dish. You didn't state that, so maybe it's a bad assumption. If you're using an older dish, what you are doing by adding the new LNB to the older dish may not work, but I would have thought your installer would have known that. Note also that a 60e dish requires a 60e LNB and a 75e requires a 75eLNB. The type of LNB is printed on its case. The 75e dish measures about 75cm in the horizontal dimension. The dish and the LNB types must match, or you will have trouble.

My Ecb/No values are about 6 for F2 and 4 for F1 respectively
These number sound low, but this information, as you have provided it, doesn't help, really. On which channels are you getting these numbers? Understand that each satellite broadcasts signals for both SDef channels and HDef. That being said, it is true that most HDef is on Anik F2, but not all. See the links that I provided to determine which channel comes from where.

Therefore, I would start by tuning to channel 299 (Shaw Channel) and make note of the Ecb/No. This SDef channel comes from F1R. Do the same for 345 (APTN), which comes from F2 and is also SDef. Both should be in your programming package. If your dish is aligned properly, you should do +9.0 or better on each of those channels. If not, then there is something wrong: dish misaligned, LNB that doesn't match the dish type, obstruction to line of sight, bad cables/connections, etc. Then using the lists in the links, choose a HDef channel in your programming package that comes from F2 and note it's Ecb/No. Do the same for an F1R HDef channel in your package. The SDef numbers you noted should be roughly 2.0 higher than the HDef.

If you have determined, per the above paragraph, that your numbers are too low, then you will have to get on the roof and tweak the dish (or call for service). If you decide to do it yourself, set your receiver to channel 299. Go to the dish and verify visually that the skew and elevation are set correctly and that the mast of the dish is plumb. Without loosening any clamps, twist the dish gently in all directions, one at a time: elevation, azimuth, and skew, noting if this action improves the signal. If it does, loosen the clamp for that direction and tweak in very small increments to get the maximum Ecb/No on 299. (Note that each movement may take a few seconds to show up on the screen. You'll need a friend to help you watch the screen while you make the tweaks.) Once maximized on 299, then check the Ecb/No on 345. It should be nearly equal to what you get on 299.

If you're really into HDef, you can substitute your favorite HDef channels for the ones I've cited above to do your fine-tuning. Just be sure that you know which satellite they're coming from and try to use channels that come from each of the 2 satellites.

Is it common for a slight mis-alignment to affect one satellite more than the other?
I can't answer this one....I think it would depend on your location. In my "Southern Province", F2 is much stronger than F1R, so yes, a misalignment would probably kill F1R before F2. In Canada, I wouldn't think this would be true, but maybe someone else will respond....

Is there any particular type of mis-alignment that is more likely to cause that
. IMHO, they're all equally important
 

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Thanks again joshuals, that's very clear. I know most of this information is available from online documents, but a better explanation is always helpful.

I did look at 299 for the low SD value, and I can easily see that the channels fall into two clear groups on signal strength, with most of the SD channels being around Ecb/No = 4 and most of the HD channels being around Ecb/No = 6. I am just presuming that the two groups represent the two satellites, which I'm sure is correct.

I have an old elliptical dish from the late 1990s, which I inherited from someone else and installed in 2001. I haven't looked for a model number or measured the size, but I presume that the service tech who installed the HD head in 2006 knew which one to use. The signal strength was fine at that time.

I know that I'm losing a little signal strength in the cabling, but that's ok. During my original alignment I ran the 100 ft cable directly through a window to the receiver. Afterward I routed it to the inside junction of my home cable network so I could access the sat signal through my regular cable outlets. That cost me a small amount of signal strength. Then I routed the cable through my surge protector at the TV. That cost me a little more signal strength. But in the end the signal strength was still ok, and the picture/sound quality was solid, so I didn't worry about it. Even now, with the signal strength down, the picture and sound are still solid, with only an occasional glitch when a heavy rainstorm passes over (which is what led me to check the signal strength recently).

I really wish they had designed the dish mounting better for making fine pointing adjustments. Would it have killed them to include something like an offset-cam mechanism?
 

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You sound very knowlegable, so I won't insult your intelligence with any more basics.

What I do not understand is why you get a lower Ecb/No on the SDef channels.

I think you're facing a trip to the roof......can you not call for service? A tech would be able to re-fine-tune your dish, and, if necessary, replace your LNB if it's defective.
 

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Shaw Direct will send a service tech out for $50 (+ 12% HST), but I would always rather do it myself to make sure I know how, as long as it doesn't require special equipment. There's been a lot of heavy construction work going on nearby lately (digging up the sewer line in the street), with constant vibration that shakes the whole house and rattles the dishes on the shelves. It wouldn't surprise me a bit if the dish has shifted slightly.
 

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I drag a satellite receiver and TV out to my dish farm.

You can use a cheap needle meter to get raw signal strength, but it will not identify which satellite you are on, or how well you have the dish fine tuned (you need something which can decode the signal, and provide a quality or EbNo).

You can get USB DBV-S (and maybe DVB-S2) tuner cards, but they may not handle DCII.

Generally though, for a USB tuner, satellite receiver, or smart satellite meter (has a satellite receiver front end and computer), you program it for the satellite and transponder you want, then it tells you if you found it.
 
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