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Rogers Ignite TV (IPTV) Discussions.

322326 Views 1199 Replies 85 Participants Last post by  icemankent, 
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This thread is for Rogers new IPTV (Ignite TV) discussions:

https://www.rogers.com/consumer/about-rogers-iptv

I have been contacted recently regarding Ignite TV (IPTV). I would like to share the following information, which may provide a good summary for those who need to know some of the technical information. The Ignite CSR was very knowledgeable addressing my questions well.

1. Since I currently own 4 Rogers boxes, I wanted to run at least a couple of these in parallel with Ignite. This is not possible. You need to switch completely.

2. I have existing Internet and Home Phone (yes, I still have a home phone) but even those change somewhat and become part of the Ignite bundle.

3. Ignite does not run Navigatr firmware. It runs something different and has numerous “nice to have features” like searches that can include Netflix or YouTube. If you wish to see what the interface looks like, search the web for “YouTube Xfinity” which is the Comcast system. Or go to YouTube and search “Comcast Xfinity.” or use other similar search terms. Rogers is not identical, but similar. If you search the Rogers Website for “Ignite TV”, there are several additional links available.

4. There is one “Modem” that can be placed anywhere in the home (what we usually call the demarcation point). The various boxes that you would use for various TVs in your home are wireless (can also be wired to the modem, but the modem only has 2 Ethernet ports). The “modem” takes care of everything – TV, Home Phone, Internet, however it doesn’t have internal battery backup, so I would suggest a UPS for anyone considering Ignite. If there are issues with the wireless operation, Rogers will supply hardware to make things work (like a switch). A UPS may or may not keep the system up because the battery backup in the Rogers node near your home may be missing or useless. In this case, everything (including home phone) will be down. Most people have a cell phone, but be aware.

5. From the FAQs it looks like you can record up to 8 simultaneous recordings.

6. There is no Hard Drive to save your recordings. Your recordings are allocated to a space “in the cloud” (Rogers Servers?). You can record up to 200 hours before programming would automatically be deleted (oldest first). There also appears to be a one-year time limit, so no archiving beyond that. In the future there may be an option for more storage at additional cost, but this should be more than adequate for most families. It appears that you can download recordings to an app, so there is a bit of archiving possible that way.

7. All the TV set top boxes are 4K and the 4K channels are included at this time.

8. The remote has a voice command option (you press a button and talk into the remote). This allows you to search for programming, set recordings, etc. It also allows “voice guidance” (for visually impaired - see the YouTube Videos, etc.)

9. The FF and REW speeds should be similar to what we have with Navigatr on a NB3/9865, however, I would have to check myself to see how “responsive” the commands are when compared to the 9865, which is “instant” when it comes to pressing Play/Pause, etc. I know I could not put up with the slow response that I see when using VOD for example. I do not watch any live TV, only recordings, so the button presses must be acted on instantly. There is apparently a programmable “skip” feature, which allows you to skip forward various times (in say minutes). I don’t know the limitations of this skip feature, but perhaps we can get feedback once people have Ignite in their homes and use these functions.

10. The TV boxes only have HDMI out. If you wish to connect to an older devices without HDMI, you’ll need to purchase a converter.

There are way too many features for me to go into in this one post, the YouTube videos and searches of Rogers Website will provide lots of additional information for those interested.

Ignite TV™

Rogers Community Forums
communityforums.rogers.com communityforums.rogers.com

Ignite TV™

Rogers Community Forums
communityforums.rogers.com communityforums.rogers.com

Here's a summary of things that IgniteTV doesn't do.

  • TV Call Display
  • “on” Channel (goes to last channel instead)
  • No DD5.1 on cloud recordings (is available live and OD)
  • Time off? (extend recordings) Done Automatically
  • Latency/ping issues as discussed in the Rogers Forum
  • Emergency Alert doesn’t cancel
  • Recordings deleted after one year (without warning).
  • No Guest Mode on Modem/Router

Although I’m not going to discuss exact pricing, it will vary with your package. For example, I currently have the grandfathered Ultimate VIP with Movies. In order to get something similar with Ignite TV, I’d be on the “Premiere” TV package, plus have to pay a bit more for some channels that are not in Premiere. I was provided with the option to have 500 mbps/unlimited Ignite Internet, along with a Home Phone package similar to what I currently have. Unfortunately, the price of all this was a lot more than I’m currently paying. I therefore declined to switch at this time. At this price point, I don’t believe that Rogers will get many “average customers” to switch. There are no appreciable "discounts" for Ignite. This price point appears to be for early adopters or people in the top 5%. It’s not a matter of “too little, too late” because the technology appears to be great, but I would say it’s “too expensive, too late.” This will be a tough sell for Rogers with many people looking at cord cutting or cord minimizing - not at increasing their bills.
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ExDilbert
This caught me by surprise but it's nice to see Rogers rolling out IPTV. Some of the features can be found by going to https://www.rogers.com/consumer/support/tv/IgniteTV. The Rogers.com TV support page has an added box labelled "Filter by device:" which has an Ignite TV option that leads to the same page.

Ignite TV seems to have the ability to manage and watch recorded TV from the browser or app. I've got to wonder if changes made for Ignite TV created incompatibilities with the existing Rogers Anywhere TV service and forced Rogers to cancel those features. The timing makes it appear likely. When push comes to shove, a new service like Ignite TV might take precedence over legacy services in the minds of project managers.

I tried accessing Ignite TV through the login page. No go. It knows we don't have Ignite TV and won't even provide a preview. I found it interesting that accessing Ignite TV brought up links to Comcast.com, Xfinity.net and Cisco.com. Those are most likely for licensing. It finally lands on Rogers.com with a link to AdobeTM.com. Is Rogers still using Adobe Flash for Ignite TV?! I guess they haven't turned the corner as much as I'd hoped.

The Rogers.com Ignite TV login page has a message that says, "Don’t have Ignite TV yet? Learn more by visiting the Rogers website." Unfortunately it doesn't have a link and, apart from 57's link and the obscure and limited support information, there appears to be absolutely nothing about Ignite TV on the Rogers website. I guess Ignite TV is still not meant for widespread public adoption. This is an exciting new product. Whatever happened to building up product demand and anticipation with marketing? That's yet another gigantic fail on Rogers part.
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ExDilbert
Does anyone have any idea of what hardware, apart from the Xfinity TV box, is fully compatible with Ignite TV? I assume the Xfinity TV hardware will be rebranded with an Ignite TV logo. The ultimate goal would be to be able to use a HTPC or media device to replace the awful, overpriced NextBox hardware.

Can anyone share the prices for the new Ignite TV packages and bundles? My guess is that Rogers wants to bring their prices up to the same levels as comparable IPTV packages and bundles from Bell.
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ExDilbert
It looks like the internet + Premier TV bundle starts at $205. That's the same as the current non-discounted prices for non-IPTV packages. As already mentioned the are no discounts, even for people who already have them. The minimum internet available is 500Mbps unlimited which could push up some peoples' cost significantly. Didn't ask if Ignite TV could be purchased separately but the internet plan requirement gives me the impression that it cannot.

Add to that,
1. Extra Ignite TV boxes at $10/mo. (One is included in the price.) That's more reasonable than NextBox rentals.
2. A few channels and theme packs that are missing from current standard packaging, such as US superstations.
3. Premium channels such as TMN/HBO, Superchannel, Hollywood Suite, etc.

One nice feature is the ability to pick channels. For example, the standard bundles appear to include a selection or swap of up to 80 channels of your choosing. That's a lot different from the current fixed bundle of channels with a choice of one bonus channel. Don't know which channels are on the list (or missing from the list) for selection.
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ExDilbert
The thing that bothers me is being forced to pay for the high end internet package to get TV. Bell tried something similar with Fibe but stopped after a couple of years. It's very anti-competitive and probably aimed at TPIAs. I wonder what the CRTC would have to say if enough people filed complaints.
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ExDilbert
New customer offers, bundle discounts and free rentals are the trap. It's usually cheaper in the long run to shop for internet, phone and TV separately. TPIAs for internet, VoIP for phone and satellite TV with purchased hardware are often quite a bit cheaper than bundles. Third party wireless phone and owned hardware is usually a lot cheaper as well. The only reason I am with Rogers for internet and TV is because they offer discounts that match cheaper competitors. If the discounts stop, I'm gone. I've ditched both Shaw and Bell in the past when they stopped being competitive. I've ditched Rogers, Teksavvy and others for substandard service. I'm close to ditching Rogers again over their lousy NextBox TV hardware.

I'm certainly not paying what Rogers is asking for Ignite TV, especially since it's unproven. It could turn out to be a quagmire, especially in cities outside the GTA where there are fewer Rogers employees to participate in the preliminary testing phase. Their cable internet and HDTV services were both atrociously unreliable when introduced here. The tech people in Toronto could only say it was fine there so it must be my equipment. The field tech people they sent out would rarely arrive when there was an issue. The internet service is rock solid now but that is a fairly recent occurrence. I have no reason to believe that Ignite TV will be any better or even as good as the current service. They need to prove that it works well and it's worth it before I lay out large sums for installation and internet upgrades I don't need.
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ExDilbert
Premium package with 500Mbps internet: $204.99
Click to expand...
That matches what I was told. The channel swap feature could be advantageous. The Premium package has 80 channels that can be swapped. Don't know how many swap channels the Popular and Select packages provide. It might be possible to save $15 or $30 with those and swap in enough channels to prevent purchasing the full Premium package. Current conventional packages are $25 and $50 cheaper so it looks like Rogers has taken that into account.

So here is a possible scenario. Customer switches from the Premium TV package to Popular or Select for a $15-$30 saving and swaps channels to effectively maintain current TV viewing habits. Customer also drops the current land line and switches to Rogers phone for another $35-$50 saving. Customer takes a $20-$50 hit on the extra cost of the upgraded internet (based on the 3 next lower priced internet plans.) Depending on current internet, phone and new TV packages, the total saving is $0-$60 which might match current package discounts.
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ExDilbert
I believe the Ignite TV activation fee is $150 and cannot be waived.
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ExDilbert
I agree. There is no 150Mbps internet offering with Ignite TV. It is a pretty good deal if you can tolerate using a NextBox for the next 2 years. I'm not sure I could do that. I'll be looking for something better once the current deal is up.
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ExDilbert
Some would say that Rogers has already withdrawn support for NextBox. Despite promoting ownership through a rent to own campaign, they won't repair owned equipment. Firmware updates are trivial at best, chaotic at times, without a significant number of bug fixes or improvements for some time. There are dozens, maybe hundreds, of outstanding bugs that will probably never be fixed, many of which have been there since the NextBox was introduced. The NextBox hardware rights have been sold off to a holding company that likely has little expertise in the field and probably no interest in improving the product.

At least Ignite TV is using Comcast X1 equipment and software. Unlike the NextBox, the Comcast X1 platform is owned and developed by a major player in the North American cable market that will continue to support the software and hardware for their own systems for years to come. They also have significantly more capital to support ongoing development of the product than Rogers.

It's like Rogers took a page out of Bell's playbook but almost 20 years too late. Bell licensed Dish Network technology for their satellite TV service and has reaped significant benefits over the years. Among those are having the first PVR in Canada, the first HD PVR in Canada, a reliable source of affordable technology and equipment and financial benefits. For once, maybe Rogers has made a good decision regarding their digital TV equipment. Let's hope they don't screw it up again.
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ExDilbert
Haven't seen any specs on the router being used but I doubt the internet is wifi only. Even if it is, a compatible AC router could be placed near it to achieve at least 300Mbps throughput to feed the wired network.

If all the internet is wifi do rogers provide free adapters...capable of 500 Mbps...which suggests the have to be USB3.
Click to expand...
PCs can use PCIe wifi cards which will usually outperform USB wifi adapters. Many other devices have wifi built in. Individual devices will typically make a 300Mbps, 150Mbps or slower link and real throughput will typically be less than half the link speed. Some newer devices might make a 600Mbps link with maximum 300Mbps throughput under ideal conditions. To get anything near 500Mbps or 1Gbps real throughput over wifi, identical routers must be used under ideal conditions.
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ExDilbert
Another concern I have is the router. The tendency these days is for ISPs to lock them down in order to make extra features like TV and phone work. Rogers is talking about adding lots of extra features to Ignite which could motivate them to lock it down even more. Rogers seems to be keeping quiet about what modem is provided and it may be proprietary to the X1 system. Until someone posts some details, we won't know about its capabilities.
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ExDilbert
I see it as Rogers using pricing to prevent quick adoption by a lot of users. The service currently appeals to early adopters who are renting NextBox equipment. The equipment we own would cost over $60/mo to rent. The purchase cost was amortized years ago. As long as it keeps working or cheap used replacements are available it's a cost effective option. Renting Ignite TV equipment would represent a significant cost increase in addition to the service cost increase.

A slow rollout is to Rogers advantage as it will allow them to scale the system up and iron out major bugs in an orderly fashion. I say that with some hesitation as Rogers has not worked out nearly enough bugs in the NextBox hardware and development support appears to be approaching end of life as far as Rogers is concerned.

As long as Rogers can keep churning existing NextBox equipment as rentals, they will keep promoting them. Renting out 5 year old equipment at prices that return their original cost in about two years is a profitable business plan. When that stops becoming cost effective due to equipment shortages and high failure rates, they will start actively promoting Ignite TV equipment to new customers.
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ExDilbert
Do you have any extra info on the modem/router and TV boxes?
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ExDilbert
Rogers certainly isn't providing enough information to make an informed decision. Under the digital package channel list, they claim 170+ channels. I count over 300 "channels" including radio and audio stations plus about 50 bonus channels and many more premium channels. I was told that the 40 channels in the Ignite premium package are "swappable" with any other regular priced channel. I assume that's the list of channels listed as included in the Digital Premium package plus all the bonus channels. However, I was not told how many channels are included in the Ignite Premium package. Is it just 40 of those 170+50 available channels in the Digital Premium package? If so, it's quite a downgrade. It's not that I need 170+ channels. If the ignite premium includes 170+ channels with up to 40 of them swappable for any of the 50 bonus channels, that's quite a good package. Is the Ignite Popular package 130+ channels with 20 swappable channels, just 20 channels or something in between? Why is Rogers withholding that information?
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ExDilbert
It's nice to hear that the modem can be bridged. I prefer to use a home brew OPNsense router with an ASUS AC router as an access point. It's way better than using the Hitron router.

I wouldn't get too excited about the MESH network. Latest reports indicate that they are often no better than conventional repeaters in real world situations. They've got some work to do in making roaming work like it should and MESH repeaters are still half as fast or slower compared to a hardwired access point. Having a really good, centrally located access point or two will outperform MESH with a badly placed access point by a significant factor. A couple of tri-band routers with one configured as a MESH repeater (as some of the newer routers can do) will blow even expensive MESH systems away.
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ExDilbert
Does anyone have any info on the channels provided with each package? Are they the same as the Digital TV packages with swappable channels as an option or is it something different like a base package with an extra 20 or 40 specialty channels and a list of channels to choose from?
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ExDilbert
If so, the packages are the same as Digital TV. I was told 40 channels could be swapped with the Ignite Premier TV package.
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ExDilbert
The CW channels are part of the "US Superstation" package that is normally bundled with one of the premium movie packages. (They are no longer the actual superstations but that's another story.) I was told channel swapping is confined to regular priced channels. The CW channels are not on that list and I was told they would cost extra. To see what can be swapped, look at the list of included and bonus channels in the Premier TV package. The most likely interpretation is that if it doesn't have a check mark or bonus channel designation, it costs extra. Another thing that costs extra is the Canadian and US Timeshifting package and their sub-packages. That's a lot of nickle and diming on the part of Rogers if you ask me. Just add an extra $3 to $9 to get your favourite US channels. That jumps to $15-$25 if Rogers decides to enforce the premium movie package dependency rule for the US Superstation pack. Some of these packages and regulations go back almost 40 years. It's about time they were updated to reflect the current marketplace and newer CRTC policies.
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ExDilbert
The CW as in WNLO
Click to expand...
We don't get WNLO here or any other CW in the base package. It's pretty much confined to the GTA and surrounding areas. We once had a lot more US stations here but Rogers decided to take them off the local cable. We had 3 NBCs, 2 CBS and 2 ABCs but Rogers, IC and the CRTC kept playing games with new Canadian stations being co-channel to US TV and FM stations until we were down to one of each network and almost all the FM stations were gone. One of the Detroit CBS stations switched to Fox so Rogers took it off and didn't replace it with the new CBS station. It took us years to get any Fox and CBS from Detroit back. Rogers tried to force the Buffalo stations on us instead but so many people complained the CRTC told Rogers to put the Detroit stations back on. These days, there are so many GTA transplants here (due to cheaper housing and lots of retirees cashing in on GTA housing prices) that there are probably more people who would like Buffalo stations. We should have both considering the history of local cable and the people living here. We are midpoint between Detroit, Buffalo and Cleveland, and closer to Erie. We've had several stations from all three cities at different times and still have at least one from each.
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ExDilbert
Thanks for the update. It appears to be very difficult for non-subscribers to find detailed information about Ignite TV.
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