I am guessing you are talking about 3rd party programmable remotes like the Logitech ones, etc?

A number of users here and on other forums have found that they never had to change a thing I their remotes for them to work. The programming SHOULD BE exactly the same, as with the Rogers remotes, you could have a 10 year old box and go get a new Rogers remote and will work no programming required.

 

Yes, I'm talking about third party remotes. Particularly professional remotes by URC and RTI.

With the SARA guide there was an option to power on the box using any key. For example, if the box was off and the TV was on, the user could simply press the channel up button and the box would turn on. Now, if the Rogers remote is programmed to power on both the tv and box, in the case of one device being on and the other off, pressing the power button on the remote again will invert the power state of both devices. One will be on, the other off. This is extremely frustrating for many clients who hire me to make things easy for them. In most of my installations, the av gear is hidden, often on another floor of the home. With the Sara software I could program a workaround macro which would reliably set the desired power state of the cable box.

For Power On, the following IR commands were programmed into the macro: 0 half second delay then EXIT. This would ALWAYS turn the box ON

For Power Off, the following IR commands were programmed into the macro: 0 half second delay then EXIT, then POWER. This ALWAYS ensured that the cable box was powered OFF.

I have at least 100 remotes in the field programmed this way. Many have worked 100% of the time for over 5 years without any issues. If a client purchased a Cisco box, we'd call rogers and have the SARA guide sent to the box (also to eliminate the frustration of the laggy guide).

Now my power on macro will no longer turn these devices on. (0, exit does nothing if the box is off)

I can't believe that this day in age there are new devices being made without discrete power commands. Cable boxes are one of the few devices without this feature. At least in the past, there was a workaround. Rogers has now killed this feature.

So my question is, without a discrete IR codes, how can one reliably ensure that these devices end up in the proper power state without the addition of an expensive voltage sensing controller?

 

For Power On, the following IR commands were programmed into the macro: 0 half second delay then EXIT. This would ALWAYS turn the box ON

For Power Off, the following IR commands were programmed into the macro: 0 half second delay then EXIT, then POWER. This ALWAYS ensured that the cable box was powered OFF.

If the devices get out of synch, you leave the STB where it is and turn the TV to the other state using the TV's discrete power button. If the AVR is in the wrong state, use the AVR device power button. When all devices are off, the next press of the general power button turns everything on.

Another option is to use a Harmony Remote. The "help" screen guides you through the appropriate button presses depending on the state of the device.

If the STB is on, then pressing the discrete (on) code for the TV/AVR should turn everything (else) on and you'll be in synch again.

Of course none of this is as elegant as your solution which can ensure that the STB is off, or on, especially if the device is "hidden".

 

The programming SHOULD BE exactly the same

While the buttons may be the same, some sequences are different. For example, try deleting a show that's currently being recorded. On the 8300, you could select stop recording and delete. On the NB3, you have to first stop the recording and then delete it, two operations instead of one.

 

Discrete power codes and discrete input codes are great for activity based macros. Unfortunately, discrete codes seem to be getting less common, especially in low end devices. If the TV has a discrete on code, a 'power fix button' could send a TV power on plus cable box power toggle. The only other suggestion I can make is to provide a separate power key for the cable box and instruct people to use is if a blank screen is encountered. I don't envy anyone who has to deal with reprogramming 100 remotes and 100 disgruntled customers.

 

Just as an FYI, not having discrete codes can also have an advantage. For example, Yamaha AVRs often have a discrete code for on/off, so the Rogers remotes can be useless for the "Master Power" programming using the Rogers remote. I programme a lot more of these than I do specialized remotes. The Master Power programming can then turn on/off the STB, AVR & TV with a single button press.

Of course it's still possible to get the devices out of synch if the remote is not held properly during the sequence, but most of my clients are then ready to get up off their seats to turn the appropriate devices on/off.

If it's a STB and not a PVR, I often recommend not having it in the power sequence at all and simply leaving it on. This usually only consumes one additional Watt. Of course, if the power goes out, or there is a large firmware update, the STB could end up being off and would need to be turned on.

 

Discrete codes are almost always a win fot smart remotes. The Harmony is smart enough to send out discrete codes when the help button is pressed. With toggle codes, a series of questions must be answered. With discrete codes, it's fairly easy to correct power issues with a single key macro. Devices that have discrete codes usually also have toggle codes to that is not an issue. The worst case scenario is when a button must be pressed repatedly to selct a state, such as the correct input.

 

We still have the old IPG. We do not have the NEtbox IPG . I think the nextbox IPG is alot nicer.

 

We still have the old IPG. We do not have the NEtbox IPG . I think the nextbox IPG is alot nicer.

This is all personal preference.. for each person its different.
MANY users find it too small. On some smaller HD tvs, it can be.

Myself, visually, I prefer it. my smallest TV being 60" now.. the old guide hurst my eyes on them.. to big and blocky.

But depending on the box, etc.. there are/have been MANY other issues with the guide as well.. from LAG to other things.

Each person has had to make that decision for themselves.. a tradeoff sometimes one thing for another.

Sadly, if this is forced, rogers is taking that choice away

 

The new IPG guide, although may look nice, it's very buggy, slow, and have some very useful features removed. E.g. I sometimes like to schedule my recording to start LATER or end EARLIER, and they cannot be done now.

Even though I have the NextBox 3.0, I still find the interface rather slow (although already much improved from NextBox 2.0). Worst of all, schedule recording is very unreliable. It has missed many recordings already.

 

You CAN do that, per say, on the new IPG.

You cant do a +/- on the exact time when clicking it through the recording from the guide, only the + a few mins option.

You can set a 100% manual recording which allows you to set exact times, etc.. but its hidden under the setting menu.
Perhaps this might cover for some who did the more manual times.. IF it was more easy to get to.

 

I don't like how the guide button doesn't take you directly to the guide -- it instead adds an extra step where it takes you to a menu where you then select guide. And it does seem slow. When waiting for it to respond to a button press I often press the button again which cancels what I was pressing in the first place. So the new procedure is to press a button and count two seconds until it finally responds.

And the guide information isn't that detailed. For example, last night's description for Masterpiece Mystery! had a vague description about it being "the longest running (and most honored)" show on PBS but didn't mention that it was an episode of "Foyle's War: The Cage".

 

What box are you using? Are you talking about the quick start guide on the 8300? If so, that behavior is easily changeable.

SELF service -> Change Quick Start Menu Launch -> either TV Listing First or QSM from Fav key.