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You might be able to get TVO and TFO analog
TFO on ch 39 and TVO on ch 48 are low power analog transmitters in Vankleek Hill.
In Deux Montagnes, you'd probably get those with a rotor.
I'm not sure about the Camp Fortune (4/6/9/13/24/30/34/40 analog, 22/25 digital) or Herbert's Corners (11/14/32/43/60/65 analog) stations, but they're worth a try.
 

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Since 2 weeks ago, we had problems with some US channels so....

...Just got a CM 4228 from Montcalm electronique in Laval

I will try it after the snow storm.

it will replace the 20 years old cm4221. Then I will be set and we won't have to spend more on our OTA setup. :D
 

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Rosemere near the river

Hello all,

I live in Rosemere near the river (lat=45.65, long=-73.77). I'm seriously thinking about trying to go OTA. I'd like to catch signals from Mount Royal and well as the ones from Mount Mansfield, including the so-hard-to-get ABC.

From the Mount Mansfield signal coverage for my location, provided by tvfool, I see that I would get Mount Mansfield signals weekly (the map is purlple color). The main reason for this is my low altitude and the Mount Royal blocking Mount Mansfield.

After reading threads, I get that the CM 4228 would be the best UHF antenna for me. To catch ABC, a custom VHF 13 antenna (availble from this site) would do the best. To that, I will need to add a preamp, the CM 7777.

I have a few questions before going on with the projet. I tough you experienced people could give me an opinion.

1) Is the CM 7777 the right choice or should I go with a stronger preamp?
2) Is the custom VHF 13 antenna a good/best choice to get ABC?
3) Could the antennas be located in the attic and still deliver enough signal?(the attic is located at about 30 feet high)

Thanks,
Frederic
 

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Discussion Starter #244
I setup a 4221 with a channel 13 and a CM7777 in the Attic and I get excellent results. I am in St. Dorothee Laval.

On occasion ABC has some dropouts, but very rare. Eventually I will climb back into the attic and reposition the 5Y13s i bought, or maybe move that one outside.
 

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If you live near Montreal, get the GE preamp (10$ from Addison). It gives better results than the Channel Master 7777 ($120 from Raybel). I tried them both and was very surprised that an inexpensive device outperformed the more expensive device.

I ended up using two GE preamp in series (the instruction manual from GE recommend this to increase gain) with my setup. This is what I get steady and no drop out, even with the signal split using a 2 way splitter:

2.1
3.1, 3.2
5.1, 5.2
6.1
33.1, 33.2. 33.3. 33.4
35.1
44.1, 44.2
57.1, 57.2, 57.3

Using the CM7777, I failed to get 3.1, 3.2, 5.1, 5.2, 44.1 and 44.2

using a single GE preamp, I get all the channels above but with some drop out using a 2 way splitter. If no splitter is used, everything is strong. Since I want to split the signal, I ended up using two GE preamp directly connected one after another.

I recommend going for the GE preamp. It works the same way as the CM7777 with the preamp installed near the antenna and the separate power supply near your TV. The power is sent to preamp via the coax line. The only thing is the GE preamp does not have separate input for VHF and UHF, no toggle switch for UHF-VHF combined-separated and no FM trap. I tried every single combination of the CM7777 and still the $10 GE device is better.

So before spending the big money on fancy equipment, give the GE preamp a try. My CM7777 is now useless, I will put it up on auction on fleabay!

The lesson I learned in the antenna business, you don't have to spend big money to get OTA. I first learned with my home made vertical array of 8 pairs of bowties constructed with clothes hangers cost nearly nothing to build and outperformed a popular $100, 8-bay commercial antenna! next, I learned that a $10 device outperformed the $120 device! inexpensive does not mean cheap or inefficient!
 

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hungt1999 said:
So before spending the big money on fancy equipment, give the GE preamp a try. My CM7777 is now useless, I will put it up on auction on fleabay!

The lesson I learned in the antenna business, you don't have to spend big money to get OTA.
That's nice for you that you discovered a lower cost solution and I delight when people get good reception! If absolutely lowest cost is important, then yes there are lots of things a person can try, and some of them will work well. :)

On the other hand, Post #2 in the OTA Forum Knowledge Base & FAQ describes why your findings may not apply to other people. People reading your results should ask here first if they are not sure what equipment to get.
 

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GE preamp

hungt1999:

Can you be more specific about your location? I too am intrigued by your results. I saw 4 or 5 models of pre-amps on the Addison site. There was one for $24 or $29 that apparently had asjustable gain, a feature I have been looking for in a pre-amp and that is curiously missing from all the units I have checked so far.

I had Fox 44.1 locked in this morning, but it vanished in the afternoon. Looks like i am going to have to watch the Superbowl in SD (sucking resolution).:(
 

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Since 2 weeks ago, we had problems with some US channels so....

...Just got a CM 4228 from Montcalm electronique in Laval

I will try it after the snow storm.

it will replace the 20 years old cm4221. Then I will be set and we won't have to spend more on our OTA setup. :D
Nice, the new 4228 is on the tower, the TV pick all available channels except for 3.1 and 3.2. BUT 22.1 was rock steady during the snowstorm (no real vhf antenna).

By the way, I have a 15 years old radioshack preamp. adjustable gain with fm-trap. While the fm-trap is doing nothing to help, I had to reduce gain to half power to maximize reception in digital and image quality in UHF analog. so yeah, I may need a notch filter for 17 and 35 and help the other channels. (I'm 120 miles away from Mt Mansfield)
 

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Some details on my set-up

I am located on the northern part of Laval (Ste-Rose, next to highway 15).

My antenna is homemade. Similar to the following:

http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/showpost.php?p=502262&postcount=76

except that the one I built is a vertical array of 8 pairs of bowties instead of 4 pairs from the site above.

My antenna is located in the attic of a 2-storey house.

The amplifier that gave best results for me is the following. I purchased two of these at $10 each from Addison. I put the two in series, only one power supply is needed and only one DC blocker is used.

http://groups.msn.com/Hungwatches/misc.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=268

I also built a 10 element Yagi for VHF 13. So far not much success catching anything with it. I will keep experimenting and will update results soon. I really want to get WVNY ABC digital.
 

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If you live near Montreal, get the GE preamp (10$ from Addison). It gives better results than the Channel Master 7777 ($120 from Raybel). I tried them both and was very surprised that an inexpensive device outperformed the more expensive device.
This is because the Channel Master 7777 is overloading. The GE preamp will not overload and it is a good step it will give a little boost and in a lot of case that just what you need.

Has for the spec if I remember well it is (10 db gain and 4 db Noise).
 

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Smog, which direction are you pointing your CM4228?

I am perplex that you catch ABC 22.1 and not 3.1 nor 3.2.

If you can catch 5.x, 33.x, 44.x etc, then you should be able to catch also 3.1 and 3.2 because they all come from the same area.

For me, the weakest signal is 44.x followed by 33.x. I can't get those without amplification.
 

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no problemo with any other channel than 3.1 and 3.2, I'm even receiving 3.0 analog with that UHF only antenna.

The antenna is way higher than anything between my house and Mt Mansfield.

2.1 SRC
5.1 NBC
5.2 NBC
6.1 CBC
22.1 ABC
22.2 blank
33.1 VPT/PBS
33.2 VPT/PBS
33.3 Vermont Create
33.4 VPT World
35.1 TQS
44.1 FOX
44.2 CW

no 57.x but I don't care at all.
 

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Smog,

Impressive! you are located more than 180km from Mt-Mansfield!

what if you rotate your antenna slightly? maybe you will get all channels, including 57.x
 

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This is because the Channel Master 7777 is overloading. The GE preamp will not overload and it is a good step it will give a little boost and in a lot of case that just what you need.

Has for the spec if I remember well it is (10 db gain and 4 db Noise).
How good a preamp with 10 db gain and 4 db noise when compared to other preamp? What is the best gain/noise ratio a preamp could provide?
 

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How good a preamp with 10 db gain and 4 db noise when compared to other preamp? What is the best gain/noise ratio a preamp could provide?
There some very good pre-amp:
ResearchComm 9254 0.4 dB NF
Tin Lee MA82-16-77A 2.5 dB NF
Channel Master 7777 & 7778 2.2-2.5 dB NF
Wineguard 2.2 - 2.8 dB NF

see the pre-amp thread for more info http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=42426&page=15
 

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in our case, the channels 17 and 35 are strong. So adding a preamp will create distortion affecting the signal quality on all channels.
I added a quarter wave stub for channel 17 and cranked up the gain on the pre-amp.

so....

I got 3.1 and 3.2 back, lost 5.x (14) and analog 17. I still get that 22.1 and 22.2

so a quarter wave stub is a real good notch (enough to kill 17 completely)
 

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Ste Dorothee reception

Hi Guys

I' ve been reading all kinds of material in the last few weeks about HDTV reception . All of you have been pretty helpfull.

I ended up building 2 homemade DB4's effectively making a DB8 (4221 and 4228), stacked them side by side and mounted it up in the attic in Ste-Dorothee and got the following reception. (size is 30 X 16 with 8 bowties) times 2 seprated by 2 inches and connected with a regular splitter/combiner.

2.1 CBFT (19) 64 to 72
3.1 WCAX (53) 67
5.1 WPTZ (14) 61 to 68
6.1 CBMT (20) 62 to 72
33.1 WETK (32) 66 to 72
35.1 TQS (42) 74 to 91
44.1 WFFF (43) 57 (some pixels)
57.1 WCFE (38) 62 to 88


Antenna dimension 930 X 16 with 8 bowties) times 2 sepErated by 2 inches and connected with a regular splitter/combiner.

Space between each bowtie is 7 inches (5 on top) at 15 inches I place the balun. each bowtie V shape is 5 1/2 inches.

Would adding a 3rd and even a fourth DB4 beside it, connecting with a splitter improve reception or not ?

NB : My first attempt was with one DB4 and adding another one beside it made a big difference (I was not receiving 53 and 43 until adding another DF4)

Thxs
 

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I'm glad that your side-by-side experiment worked because getting antennas to work together can be very tricky sometimes. I would not try to add any more antennas because you will face the law of diminishing returns: any increase you see in gain will be offset by other factors.
 

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I ended up building 2 homemade DB4's effectively making a DB8 (4221 and 4228),
I may modify my new 4228; the VERY FLIMZY rear reflector is not straight at all. as the antenna is mounted against the tower, I will try to put a flat reflective instead of the wire mesh.
 
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