[Bobvan]

I went with the stabilizer along with the Toshiba upconverting recorder cost me close to $400.00 with taxes quite a bit. Like I mentioned before I already own a HD PVR but dont like the PQ of nonhd on my LCD tv and like to be able to dub non hd movies on a DVD recorder to watch on my 32" CRT Wega.

The deciding factor to go with this set up over purchasing the coming SD Shaw PVR is 1) Off the air channels have a much better PQ going though my Recorder's tuner then any Shaw box. 2) If I want to keep something I can, and once you figure out the settings on the GoDVD you can get a really nice picture. And I do only record for personal use which we have the right to do under fair law.

 

[JBC]

An explanation from Shaw

A further update....

I asked Shaw why I'd be able to record to DVD if I connected the DVD-recorder directly to the 'wall' coaxial cable signal, but would not be able to record to DVD from the output of the cable box (Motorola DCT 6200).

The response I got was as follows:Content passing through HDCP compliant hardware, such as the DCT 6200 will prevent certain programming from being recorded. Content that is passed directly to your television, bypassing the Digital Cable Terminal, will not be subject to copyright protection, because it is not passing through a device that is HDCP compliant.


I'm not sure if I'm being fed some erroneous but plausible information to make me go away, or whether that's the genuine problem. Any advice?

Best regards,
JBC

 

[57]

It's not HDCP (which is digital and only affects DVI/HDMI), as mentioned many times in this forum. It's CGMS-A.

It appears that when you use the DVD Recorder's NTSC tuner directly, that CGMS-A is not "detected", while using the video inputs, the signal is detected, on some newer DVD Recorders, some newer programmes, etc.

Also, the signal may only affect digital channels, therefore the analogue channels that the NTSC tuner picks up are not affected.

An interesting test may be to use the RF-coax connection from the STB to the DVD recorder (instead of composite or S-video), tuning to channel 3 to see if you can record this signal from the STB (it'd be mono and lower quality, but can it be recorded?).

 

[JBC]

Hi '57'

Thanks for the quick reply.

I didn't think the reply I got from Shaw made sense.

I have actually tried your experiment without success. I tried to record the output of the STB (both analog and digital channels) to DVD using coaxial cable, composite (with stereo audio) or S-video (stereo audio). In all cases, I could record to VHS, but generally not to DVD.

In most cases, I am trying to record analog channels.

One question, if it is a CGMS-A type protection, and the DVD-recorder does pick it up when it's present in the output of the STB... does the fact that I can record to DVD when bypassing the STB mean that Shaw is 'adding' the copy protection, or does it just mean that the tuner in the DVD-recorder doesn't pick up the copy protection signal?

Best regards,
Jason

 

[57]

I would guess the latter, but that's just a guess. The signal is present in the original programme, so I don't think the signal is being "added" - it's either being "passed" by Shaw and detected by the DVD recorder (or not detected by some recorders or via the NTSC tuner).

Also, this is not as much of an issue with some service provders so I can only assume that those providers "strip" (or do not pass) the signal, which is embedded in the VBI information.

 

[Bobvan]

I am not sure about VHS recording, but when I ran coax out of the STB into my DVD recorder it did record all chanels, but the PQ is not very good. Even though its is quite more expensive having to purchase th GoDVD the PQ is 100 times better with S-Video. I am pretty picky with that stuff, I guess it all depends what one is into. There are also $2000.00 plus components that apparently upconverts everthing to HD quality.

 

[JBC]

Stonewalled

I guess I won't get any more answers out of Shaw - they said (paraphrasing) that their technical support extends to ensuring that I get a clear picture on my TV and internet service. Their technical support did not extend to third party devices and their connectivity.

Giving Shaw the benefit of the doubt - if they aren't adding any copy protection signals (and I don't have any proof that they do) - then I can see their point.

I guess my best bet is one of those Video Stabilizers. Hey BobVan - your 'Go DVD' did you source yours from 'the Source' (formerly Radio Shack)? I'm not too concerned about the $150. In the overall scheme of things, the convenience (and picture quality) outweigh the cost.

Thanks for your help everyone.
JBC

 

[Bobvan]

I live in Richmond BC I found it at London Drugs on #3 road they did have one left after I scoped mine . You can also try Ebay

 

[WopOnTour]

I would guess the latter, but that's just a guess. The signal is present in the original programme, so I don't think the signal is being "added" - it's either being "passed" by Shaw and detected by the DVD recorder (or not detected by some recorders or via the NTSC tuner).

Also, this is not as much of an issue with some service provders so I can only assume that those providers "strip" (or do not pass) the signal, which is embedded in the VBI information.

This makes perfect sense. How else would Shaw be able to make THEIR OWN PVRs able to record the "protected" content? The capability to filter this feature may be present on their "newer" STBs but the the older Motorola 2xxx series may not be able to do this. (always pass)

I would suspect there's probably a way to turn the "feature" OFF in the firmware of the DVD-R/RW devices involved- but I doubt there's any way to get that out of Sony!!
WopOnTour

 

[JBC]

Sima to the rescue

I picked up a Sima CT200 Video Stabilizer from London Drugs, and I just hooked it up. I'm very happy to report that I can record the output of the Shaw cable box (via component/stereo RCA audio). It looks like this one little unit is the key to solving all the 'copy protected image' problems.

Thanks very much to 57 and Bobvan for the helpful advice. I think I sy

Now I can play around to see if I get a better image with S-video cables instead of the component video... much better than wondering if I'm going to actually be able to record something or not.

Best regards,
JBC

 

[Officedweller]

I've got the Toshiba RD-XS35 DVD Recorder with hard drive. I've got the same prolem as Jager recording from Movie Central - after about 2 minutes, the message about being copy protected comes up and recording is paused. I haven't recorded anything from Movie Central in a while, but last fall I recorded Batman without problems. One strange thing is that when I pull up the Batman recording on my hard drive I now see a "copy never" icon when I had not noticed that before.
I get service from Novus in downtown Vancouver for which no set top box is required to access the Movie Central channels.
I haven't tried to record older movies from Movie Central.

 

[Bobvan]

JBC try one of the switches on the side you will see that it gives you lighter and darker pictures. I dub through S-Video. And like you found the solution through posts on this forum

 

[johnsa]

Problems with BEV receiver and Samsung DVDr130

Via SVHS cable or RCA video cable, I get no picture other than the Guide or channel info from the receiver. It was fine for the first 2 weeks I owned the DVD recorder and I was able to record several shows. I have sinced returned the Samsung unit but after reading most of this thread, I wonder if I would have received the picture signal if I had changed the BEV HD receiver output setting to 480i?

I thought it must be a product defect as it worked fine for 2 weeks ....Any thoughts?

P.S. I was able to record standard and HD channels. Now nothing shows except the BEV guide and channel info..

 

[Jock]

Fix for DVD Recording from Shaw content

I'm a newbie.

I have the Motorola box from Shaw for high definition TV. Like many others, I have recently been unable to make DVD-R copies of on-air programming using my Toshiba DVD recorder.

After reading the forum, I called Shaw and they told me that Motorola has added the CGMS-A Analog copy protection "for legal reasons" and neither Shaw nor Motorola have any plans to remove it.

Following others' suggestions, I placed a video stabilizer box (from London Drugs) in between the Motorola receiver and my DVD Recorder. My previous problems vanished, and I now am able to record material from on-air.

Thanks to the forum for providing the information I need to solve my problem.

Jock
Nanaimo
[email protected]

 

[Digisurfer]

I picked up a Sima CT200 Video Stabilizer from London Drugs, and I just hooked it up. I'm very happy to report that I can record the output of the Shaw cable box (via component/stereo RCA audio). It looks like this one little unit is the key to solving all the 'copy protected image' problems.

Following others' suggestions, I placed a video stabilizer box (from London Drugs) in between the Motorola receiver and my DVD Recorder. My previous problems vanished, and I now am able to record material from on-air.

I've been debating whether or not to buy the Sima CT-200 video stabilizer, but after the past couple of days, and the two posts above, have decided it is definitely worthwhile. The only problem is that only one place sells it locally (Source by Circuit City) and the price seems kind of high ($150). Can anyone point to a reliable trustworthy place I can order online that is not only more affordable, but also has fast shipping? Thanks.

Fwiw, last week my Toshiba RD-XS52 refused to record Rome to the HDD via the weekly timer I've set. The second season is playing once a week late night on Movie Central. Would have completely missed the show if it wasn't for the Bittorrent community. I don't really care to do this, but what choice do we have? Strangely, this weeks episode of Rome had no protection at all and recorded fine. Thought for a moment that perhaps they decided to finally fix this problem. Shaw actually called in the middle of the week to try an sell us on their other services, but the wife lodged a complaint about CGMS-A instead, asking why the heck we would want to pay for more of Shaw's services when we're barely happy with the one we have.

We actually just went to watch Stargate Atlantis right now since we're both home sick today, and again the CGMS-A protection caused the show to not record last night, again when we were fast asleep. This episode isn't airing on Movie Central again, and because Sci-Fi hasn't aired them in the US yet, nobody from the torrent community has bothered to upload any of them. This means we are going to have to wait a long time before being able to pick up where we're being forced to leave off. Man, I thought I was angry last week over this, but now I'm absolutely livid with rage. I am a hairs breadth away from canceling our Shaw service altogether. Having to constantly deal with this kind of crap is not worth $100 per month.

 

[Bobvan]

The only way you might score a cheaper Sima Go DVD is on ebay. I use ebay alot and have no problems just read the sellers feedback. I would of gone that route but my local London Drugs had it, and if i had not been happy with it I could of returned it.

 

[Digisurfer]

How much are they selling them for? Wondering if it is worth the three hour drive to get one if the savings are worth the time and trouble. As for E-Bay, I'll do a search. While I've sold a few things on there in the distant past, I've never actually purchased anything since I'm just not the trusting type, even with being able to see a sellers feedback. Anyways, thanks for the reply. It is much appreciated.

 

[springle]

Update

I purchased 2 of the Simas some time ago. I had noticed that my 2 older DVD recorders seemed unaffected by whatever Shaw and Bell were distributing along with the programs and did not bother to put the Sima modified signal through these older DVD recorders. Previously I had done an experiment with an older DVD recorder and a newer one both recording the same signal from the same satellite receiver. One refused to record and the other had no problems.

However, things have changed. Specifically Bell ExpressVu has done some sort of modification.

Last night I set up my Toshiba RD-XS52 to record "Lucky Number Slevin" from Movie Central. This is one of my older machines. I happened to walk by the machine while it should have been recording and noticed that it was off. Puzzled, I turned it on and checked the DVD-RAM contents. 3 minutes. I played it and it just stopped. No message. I put it into Record and it started recording OK. So I reformatted the DVD and set it to record a later showing.

I then turned on my newer DVD recorder, an LG-790. This machine has the Sima device connected via S-Video cables. I set it to record the same movie to its hard drive.

Shortly after the film started I went into the room with the recorders and noticed that the Toshiba had an "Alert" message on the front panel and the LG-790 was busy recording. I turned on the TV and set it to Component Video in so that I could see what the "Alert" was. It was a message that this film was copy protected. After a minute the Toshiba shut down.

This machine had always worked before with such films. I had done several tests. So I assume that rather than easing DVD recording restrictions, Bell is tightening them. This older Toshiba will respond to the Broadcast Flag.

This morning I looked at the Hard Drive of the LG-790 and the film was there in its entirety. I deleted the crap at the beginning and end of the recording and set up a Dub to a disk. No problem.

I also re-routed my satellite receiver output so that it goes through the Sima, then through a video distributor (all S-Video), then to my DVD recorders. Problem solved.

It's the uncertainty that makes this extremely annoying. When I am away and record something, I just expect it to be there when I return. Not a recorded disk some of the time and a blank disk some of the time. I may have other blank disks. Movies that I thought I had recorded and put on a shelf for later viewing, only to discover when I attempt to watch them that the disk is blank. Anyone know when this change was initiated?

As I have 2 Bell receivers and 1 Shaw receiver, I'm now thinking that I should buy a third Sima.

 

[springle]

Suggestion

Today I visited a nearby London Drugs and while browsing, noticed that the GoDVD item mentioned in this thread was heavily discounted.

My guess is that someone has suggested to LD that they stop carrying this device and LD is discounting them to dump their inventory and will never carry them again. (It would be naive to believe that companies that have an interest in ensuring that copying is minimized, do not peruse these boards.)

So my suggestion is that if you are ever going to purchase one of these devices, NOW IS THE TIME. You will not find any mention of them on the Sima website. They no longer exist.

 

[57]

Learned the following from some professional contacts I have.

1. More studios/movies are using CGMS-a copy protection.

2. The programmes are tagged "copy once".

However.

3. Some DVD recorders are refusing to even copy once.

4. The manufacturers of these recorders could not explain why (to my professional contacts).

5. It is postulated that the DVD recorder manufacturers can not guarantee the disk they create is not copyable, so they don't make even one copy...

Fun times...

Sounds like anyone using a DVD Recorder so affected only has one choice if they wish to record these tagged programmes - the appropriate model video stabilizer.

Some more feedback from the "pros".

6. More programmes are being sent with CGMS-a set to "copy once" and the service providers simply "pass" this signal.

7. You need to check the copy specs/OM for the DVD player as many of them clearly outline in the operating manual that they will not record programmes so marked (copy once).

8. Sometimes, if you use component video cables instead of HDMI from the STB to the TV, the problem can go away.

9. Edit - Rogers Navigatr seems to be precluding recording to a DVD recorder or VCR at this time.