Hi Folks,
Boy I must have gotten lost in a worm hole somewhere in the Universe because I originally joined here in 2007 and the last post I made (2015?) was probably after moved to Niagara Region, and before we decided to cut the cord.
The Story so far ...
We cut the cord in March 2015 and installed a ClearStream 4MAX UHF / VHF high gain antenna with a range of about 70+ miles capable of reaching the CN Tower in Toronto to pick up all the CDN stations. We picked up CBC, CITY, Global, TVO all with a signal strength of about 75-80% while CTV 9 arrived at about 65-70%. No surprise there.
By default the backside of the antenna was 'generally' aimed at Buffalo and we picked up all the networks and PBS (UHF and VHF) with a satisfactory signal strength of about 70-80%.
Initially we had a MediaSonic HW-130 STB decoder, but replaced it with an HW-150 PVR in 2020 when the first decoder died. At one point we added a Channel Master 3412 Amplifier but removed it when we discovered the it was causing clipping and overdriving the Decoder.
This setup (minus the Amp) ran flawlessly until 2019 when CTV 9 dropped out entirely for almost a week and then just as mysteriously returned. The absence of CTV 9 was the reason for the attempt to boost the signal with an Amp). In my first attempt to discuss the loss of CTV 9 with BM engineers I was told that we were in 'the fringe' area and that was as good as it would get.
Fast forward to December 2021 and we found that CTV 9 would pixelate around 6 PM every night and often drop out entirely. A new round of talks with BM engineers revealed that we might be getting hit with FM and LTE interference.
Regarding Equipment Upgrades and Changes:
Channel Master LTE and FM Filters
I installed these as a first step to clean up Channel 9 CTV. They were installed sequentially and the result was that the signal quality dropped (predictably) from 65-70% to just over 45-48%. What this told me was that there must have been a considerable payload of FM noise with the signal, with LTE bringing up the rear from surrounding cell towers.
I guess it creates another question too, do FM broadcasters use VHF as the frequency band of choice?
MediaSonic HW-150PVR Decoder and its Role in Virtual Channel Loss
I spoke with the Techs at MediaSonic this week to determine the threshold for channel loss based on signal quality. Prior to introducing sequential filters for FM and LTE Channel 9 CTV was in the 65-70% range. After the filters were inserted the signal stabilized at around 45-48%, but due to a couple of changes made recently it now stabilized at 52% after 6 PM. Until today (a Friday) where the virtual channel decaded and abruptly dropped off the Decoder. Hasn't reappeared since 1 PM today. And this occurs almost without fail every Friday, I kid you not! The Techs at MediaSonic advise that below 43%, the signal would be lost entirely.
Tripp Lite Surge Protector
I purchased a new Tripp Lite Surge Protector with internal EMI and RFI filtering. I think that being able to filter FM, LTE and EMI in the immediate area around and in our home has helped to contribute to a more stable signal from Channel 9 CTV.
Ferrite Noise Filters
I have installed about 6 Ferrite Filters on equipment sensitive to interference and on the coax leading from outside to the Decoder. While this may be overkill, it does seem to help to stabilize the Channel 9 CTV signal even in the early evening hours when the channel used to pixelate and drop out entirely. It now stabilizes between 48-52% and we are able to watch it successfully.
Research and Discover:
Google was helpful, but a comment from a YouTuber about LEDs sent me on another quest as well.
To explain, my neighbor across the street has what we call the ‘Griswold Family Christmas’ house with blazing LEDs from rooftop and on every organic bush in their yard. It’s lovely, and I never gave the LEDs much thought when we put up our own limited LED display on the north face of our home, the same direction the antenna is aimed at Toronto 35+ feet off the ground. The neighbor’s home is in direct line of sight of the antenna BTW.
Did our own LEDs on Christmas tree(s) – we have two in the house, affect the reception? It didn’t appear that they did, and one tree was 6 feet away from the TV and Decoder.
And finally this item had slipped my mind, but a casual discussion with a group of Ham operators reminded me that the City of Niagara Falls (Ontario) has begun the replacement of street lights with LEDs in September 2015. This was after we switched to OTA.
Coincidentally, we have a light pole on the northwest corner of our property. I tried to contact the company that installed them to determine if they knew the level of interference these units might generate, but as of this writing I do not know. The street lights come on an hour before Channel 9 CTV begins to pixelate and drop out, so I'm going to assume the two are not directly related.
Regarding ‘Quality of Signal’ evaluation, I can say categorically that of all CDN stations broadcast from the CN Tower (1700 feet up), all are received in the 70-85% signal quality range, with the exception of Channel 9 which arrives in the 65-70% range. This 'signal quality' is just a MediaSonic measurement of the strength of signals being received. The only channel operating at a substantially reduced signal is Channel 9 CTV. The four or five CDN channels we receive from this one location are all UHF, except Channel 9 which operates on VHF.
Likewise, all of the Buffalo stations we receive are in the 75-85% signal quality range, and at least one operates on VHF with the remainder operate on UHF. Their relative location to us is about 40+ miles away line of sight and the antenna is generally pointed in that direction although all the signals hit the backside of the antenna because of its orientation to Toronto.
The other point to consider is that aimed at Toronto, the antenna is just at its fringe capability of 70+ miles across Lake Ontario. What I do not know is whether Channel 9 CTV was UHF originally, or always broadcast on VHF, as the transmitter used to be located on the east side of Toronto next to the broadcast studio. With the ‘re-pack’ in 2016, I do not know if the channel moved to VHF when it was moved to the CN Tower sometime in 2016.
Summarizing my experience to date, all the CDN broadcasters are received without exception, accept Channel 9 CTV which is the weakest of all the broadcast channels we receive, and they all originate in the same location 70+ miles away.
I don’t know if replacing the antenna head with a newer model of the ClearStream 4MAX UHF / VHF would improve the VHF capability, but it seems a steep price to pay for reception of a broadcast channel that should be stronger than it is given that Bell Media** is the largest terrestrial phone, cell phone, satellite and RF broadcaster in Canada. Rogers Media** being the second largest player.
I guess the CRTC needs to hear that their attempt to clean up the frequency bands (so these two clowns** can abuse more customers with cell phones and new infrastructure), have shot OTA digital transmission a lethal blow.
My experience, your mileage may vary,
Canon_Man
Boy I must have gotten lost in a worm hole somewhere in the Universe because I originally joined here in 2007 and the last post I made (2015?) was probably after moved to Niagara Region, and before we decided to cut the cord.
The Story so far ...
We cut the cord in March 2015 and installed a ClearStream 4MAX UHF / VHF high gain antenna with a range of about 70+ miles capable of reaching the CN Tower in Toronto to pick up all the CDN stations. We picked up CBC, CITY, Global, TVO all with a signal strength of about 75-80% while CTV 9 arrived at about 65-70%. No surprise there.
By default the backside of the antenna was 'generally' aimed at Buffalo and we picked up all the networks and PBS (UHF and VHF) with a satisfactory signal strength of about 70-80%.
Initially we had a MediaSonic HW-130 STB decoder, but replaced it with an HW-150 PVR in 2020 when the first decoder died. At one point we added a Channel Master 3412 Amplifier but removed it when we discovered the it was causing clipping and overdriving the Decoder.
This setup (minus the Amp) ran flawlessly until 2019 when CTV 9 dropped out entirely for almost a week and then just as mysteriously returned. The absence of CTV 9 was the reason for the attempt to boost the signal with an Amp). In my first attempt to discuss the loss of CTV 9 with BM engineers I was told that we were in 'the fringe' area and that was as good as it would get.
Fast forward to December 2021 and we found that CTV 9 would pixelate around 6 PM every night and often drop out entirely. A new round of talks with BM engineers revealed that we might be getting hit with FM and LTE interference.
Regarding Equipment Upgrades and Changes:
Channel Master LTE and FM Filters
I installed these as a first step to clean up Channel 9 CTV. They were installed sequentially and the result was that the signal quality dropped (predictably) from 65-70% to just over 45-48%. What this told me was that there must have been a considerable payload of FM noise with the signal, with LTE bringing up the rear from surrounding cell towers.
I guess it creates another question too, do FM broadcasters use VHF as the frequency band of choice?
MediaSonic HW-150PVR Decoder and its Role in Virtual Channel Loss
I spoke with the Techs at MediaSonic this week to determine the threshold for channel loss based on signal quality. Prior to introducing sequential filters for FM and LTE Channel 9 CTV was in the 65-70% range. After the filters were inserted the signal stabilized at around 45-48%, but due to a couple of changes made recently it now stabilized at 52% after 6 PM. Until today (a Friday) where the virtual channel decaded and abruptly dropped off the Decoder. Hasn't reappeared since 1 PM today. And this occurs almost without fail every Friday, I kid you not! The Techs at MediaSonic advise that below 43%, the signal would be lost entirely.
Tripp Lite Surge Protector
I purchased a new Tripp Lite Surge Protector with internal EMI and RFI filtering. I think that being able to filter FM, LTE and EMI in the immediate area around and in our home has helped to contribute to a more stable signal from Channel 9 CTV.
Ferrite Noise Filters
I have installed about 6 Ferrite Filters on equipment sensitive to interference and on the coax leading from outside to the Decoder. While this may be overkill, it does seem to help to stabilize the Channel 9 CTV signal even in the early evening hours when the channel used to pixelate and drop out entirely. It now stabilizes between 48-52% and we are able to watch it successfully.
Research and Discover:
Google was helpful, but a comment from a YouTuber about LEDs sent me on another quest as well.
To explain, my neighbor across the street has what we call the ‘Griswold Family Christmas’ house with blazing LEDs from rooftop and on every organic bush in their yard. It’s lovely, and I never gave the LEDs much thought when we put up our own limited LED display on the north face of our home, the same direction the antenna is aimed at Toronto 35+ feet off the ground. The neighbor’s home is in direct line of sight of the antenna BTW.
Did our own LEDs on Christmas tree(s) – we have two in the house, affect the reception? It didn’t appear that they did, and one tree was 6 feet away from the TV and Decoder.
And finally this item had slipped my mind, but a casual discussion with a group of Ham operators reminded me that the City of Niagara Falls (Ontario) has begun the replacement of street lights with LEDs in September 2015. This was after we switched to OTA.
Coincidentally, we have a light pole on the northwest corner of our property. I tried to contact the company that installed them to determine if they knew the level of interference these units might generate, but as of this writing I do not know. The street lights come on an hour before Channel 9 CTV begins to pixelate and drop out, so I'm going to assume the two are not directly related.
Regarding ‘Quality of Signal’ evaluation, I can say categorically that of all CDN stations broadcast from the CN Tower (1700 feet up), all are received in the 70-85% signal quality range, with the exception of Channel 9 which arrives in the 65-70% range. This 'signal quality' is just a MediaSonic measurement of the strength of signals being received. The only channel operating at a substantially reduced signal is Channel 9 CTV. The four or five CDN channels we receive from this one location are all UHF, except Channel 9 which operates on VHF.
Likewise, all of the Buffalo stations we receive are in the 75-85% signal quality range, and at least one operates on VHF with the remainder operate on UHF. Their relative location to us is about 40+ miles away line of sight and the antenna is generally pointed in that direction although all the signals hit the backside of the antenna because of its orientation to Toronto.
The other point to consider is that aimed at Toronto, the antenna is just at its fringe capability of 70+ miles across Lake Ontario. What I do not know is whether Channel 9 CTV was UHF originally, or always broadcast on VHF, as the transmitter used to be located on the east side of Toronto next to the broadcast studio. With the ‘re-pack’ in 2016, I do not know if the channel moved to VHF when it was moved to the CN Tower sometime in 2016.
Summarizing my experience to date, all the CDN broadcasters are received without exception, accept Channel 9 CTV which is the weakest of all the broadcast channels we receive, and they all originate in the same location 70+ miles away.
I don’t know if replacing the antenna head with a newer model of the ClearStream 4MAX UHF / VHF would improve the VHF capability, but it seems a steep price to pay for reception of a broadcast channel that should be stronger than it is given that Bell Media** is the largest terrestrial phone, cell phone, satellite and RF broadcaster in Canada. Rogers Media** being the second largest player.
I guess the CRTC needs to hear that their attempt to clean up the frequency bands (so these two clowns** can abuse more customers with cell phones and new infrastructure), have shot OTA digital transmission a lethal blow.
My experience, your mileage may vary,
Canon_Man
