Canadian TV, Computing and Home Theatre Forums banner

41 - 60 of 1367 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
257 Posts
joedoe said:
I just got the 9200 and signed up for the HDTV package.

Was strolling in Walmart and saw a Phillips antenna......$25........ahhhhh....I'll try it.

I got at most 13 channels. Currently have 12

The percentages of all are around 70% and some higher.

004-01 WIVB
004-03 WNLO
005-01 CBLT
007-01 WKBW
023-01 WIVB
023-03 WNLO
029-01 WUTV
029-02 WUTV
029-03 WUTV
043-01 WNED
043-02 WNED
043-03 Think

The quality seems to be the same as on expressvu.

Does quality go up as percentage does? I assume since it is digital that it is either clear or not. Some pixulation usually means you are on the thin line.

Is that pretty good for the antenna I got? I just put it over the TV. Is there any reasons to keep it as it doesn't map into the Bell guide that well. Bell carries the channels as well.......they just may be different cities.

Thanks

Joe
You should also be receiving 53-1 (CITY-TV HD) and 66-1 (CKXT-TV HD).

The quality of the picture remains virtually constant as long as you get a signal. That's the difference between analog & digital. There will be a difference between signals on cable or EVue -- due to compression. The OTA signals don't have the same compression levels, and therefore are more pristine.

When you loose the signal (and this threshold varies with your receiver) you will begin to pixellate, experience blocking, and then nothing.

Your signal indicator may indicate zero, but in fact, there still is signal, but it has fallen below the threshold to decode a good picture.

The question with your antenna is sustainability. I believe with your cheapie indoor antenna you will not always receive the Buffalo channels or the weaker Toronto channels (like 66-1).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
257 Posts
joedoe said:
I am in Oakville. 3rd Line and Uppermiddle area.

No problem really. Just thought I would play with a $25 antenna and am surprised I got so many channels.

As my first post states though.......with Bell offering the same channels is there a lot of value to spend much more on an antenna?

Granted.......if I buy a better antenna and put it outside I may get higher singal and possibly more channels but from what I read on what some people are getting I think I got quite a few channels.

Also can the VHF/UHF amplifier do anything for me?

Thanks

Joe
A 10dB amp used on an indoor antenna, may help very slightly. You can see the effect using your signal indicator, and put the amp into the antenna line, and without. What difference does it make using the signal indicator. The picture won't change at all -- it is digital.

A VHF/UHF amp doesn't help. All the HD OTA channels are all UHF.
 

·
OTA Forum Moderator
Joined
·
24,867 Posts
bete_noir said:
Thanks for the info. I mentioned the Wade SL-4BT because a previous poster in this thread recommended it.

By the way, it's great to have a place where we can discuss Canadian signal reception and other issues....

:D
And that, my friend, is exactly why we're here! :D Regarding the Wade SL-4BT you might want to consider the reflector version of it: the 4BT-1483. Anyways we can discuss it in the Outdoor Antennas thread as you need because we're not really supposed to discuss things much in this Reports thread. ;)
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
74 Posts
Oakville antenna choice help needed

I'm in the Winston Churchill-QEW area of Oakville and I'm looking to get into OTA HDTV. I'm picking up a handful of stations now (mostly the Grand Island ones) on rabbit ears. I'd like to find a reliable setup to receive all the Toronto and Buffalo digital stations and, of course, not spend more money than necessary.

I noticed a couple of posts about using a four-bay bowtie antenna (Ready123's SL-4BT) to pick up both the Toronto and Buffalo stations. It seems like most other people use much more directional antennas and either have a rotar or combine the signals of two antennas.

Obviously, the single, inexpensive, wide-pattern antenna looks enticing*. Just the fact that rabbit ears (in the basement!) pull in some stations from 50 miles away makes me think that it might work. OTOH, I'd like to do this once and do it right.

Are there others using a wide-pattern antenna in the Oakville area?

Craig


*Much less noticeable from the curb, too!
 

·
OTA Forum Moderator
Joined
·
24,867 Posts
You mentioned the SL-4BT, which will do great as an almost unseen outdoor UHF antenna in your area. I personally recommend going with the reflector version (4BT-1483) or one of its competitors (Channel Master 4221 or Winegard PR-4400) on a mast in order to better maintain signal reception in heavy rain or snow conditions, but as you mentioned, Ready123 gets great results from his SL-4BT.

Regarding directional antennas, I think you might be getting the terminology backwards. It seems to me that the majority of people in this Forum are either using or looking at wide pattern UHF antennas such as those I've mentioned above and of course the Channel Master 4228. Such bowtie reflector antennas have wide and generous patterns. On the other hand, there are people here who use very directional yagi antennas such as the Winegard 90XX and Televes yagi models, which have very tight reception patterns. Those antennas are very effective and desirable in many cases such as line-of-site aiming or rejection of interference from more local sources, although they don't fare as well in deep fringe or obscured/low altitude areas as the reflectors.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
29 Posts
I am a bit higher up from you, around the Dundas and 4th Line area. I have a Terk TV38 antenna located in my attic. Yes, I should have gone with a UHF antenna, but I got the antenna before I found this web site.

I have found that in this area you will need to go with a dual setup. I have played with my direction, and to get Toronto well, you have to give up a good signal from Buffalo. There seems to be about a 35-40degree spread between the two.

I have given up on trying to get both area's with one antenna, and am getting a CM4228 to point towards Toronto and leave the Terk pointing towards Buffalo as it seems to work that direction quite well for me.
 

·
OTA Forum Moderator
Joined
·
24,867 Posts
mjm70 said:
I have found that in this area you will need to go with a dual setup.
Have you considered a rotator? Just some thoughts...

With the delta between the CN Tower and Buffalo towers being about a 30 to 45 degree spread, the time to change antenna position (based on the 360deg/60sec rate of a new Channel Master rotator model) would be 45/8 = 7.5sec. at the most, or 30/12 = 2.5sec. at the least. Factor in maybe a bit of a slower turn if its windy and you still have the antenna transiting between Toronto and Buffalo in 4 to 10 seconds from where you are.

With a Harmony remote control you could train it to set the ATSC tuner and the Rotator's STB to the right configuration each time, so for instance as you go from CBC-HD to WKBW-DT your tuner will make the lock within a second or three of your picture changing. Not bad at all.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
74 Posts
In the future, I'm looking forward to a OTA HD PVR or HTPC. So I'd like a solution that doesn't involve a rotor.

From where I am, the CN Tower and the Buffalo stations are separated by about 80 degrees. (There is nearly a 10 degree spread amongst the Buffalo transmitter sites, too.) From the handy information at RemoteCentral.com, the distances to the transmitters are about:

Toronto 16 mi
Grand Island 49 mi
S. Buffalo 82 mi

Are the 4-bay bowties rated for the very wide spread and the long-haul from S. Buffalo? Or do they just work in practise!

Craig
 

·
OTA Forum Moderator
Joined
·
24,867 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,326 Posts
PVR4Me said:
In the future, I'm looking forward to a OTA HD PVR or HTPC. So I'd like a solution that doesn't involve a rotor.
Why not combine the two ideas. If you are going the route of a second antenna for Toronto signals, why not put a rotator on it anyway. I was also thinking of an OTA PVR but never considered the problem of antenna direction unless it was preset before recording.
However, I find the rotator invaluable for the fact that some signals need to be fine tuned from the originally saved antenna setting otherwise you sometimes will get breakup. Also, the degree settings can be a challenge, I need different settings one for 15(Hamilton), one for CBC, CTV, CBC/F, one for 66(Toronto), one for Buffalo stations, and one for WB49.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1 Posts
I just bought a Winegard 4 bow tie UHF Antenna this past weekend. It works awesome just sitting on my kitchen chair. I live in the Bronte and Dundas area of Oakville. I recieve buffalo and toronto channels perfectly no FOX or Toronto 1 but once I mount the antenna on the roof I will play around with the direction and see if I can improve the signals

Dude get an antenna it is defintly worth the $$!!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
29 Posts
stampeder said:
Have you considered a rotator?
A rotator wouldn't work for me for several reasons. I have more than one TV in my house. So, unless I start getting multiple IR remote transmitters to control the rotator, I am going to need sit at the TV that has the rotator control to swap between Toronto and Buffalo.

Also, I don't have supreme domination on what to watch. Hence the need for multiple TV's. I like PBS, but my wife likes CTV. I don't want to be stuck with divorce/homicide :eek: from changing the orientation of an antenna to watch what I want, and killing the reception of what the significant other is watching.

My only concern is with overlap of the two antenna's. Will I get an awful signal by putting up two different antennas and having them compete with each other.
 

·
OTA Forum Moderator
Joined
·
24,867 Posts
dieselGeek said:
I just bought a Winegard 4 bow tie UHF Antenna this past weekend. It works awesome just sitting on my kitchen chair. I live in the Bronte and Dundas area of Oakville.
Great reception area you've got there! Looking forward to seeing your results when its mounted up top.
 

·
OTA Forum Moderator
Joined
·
24,867 Posts
I was just scanning some of the Oakville results posts in the GTA thread and it looks like people are having good success with a variety of single antennas in various locations there.

As you mentioned, two antennas would solve PVR problems, but you might also want to consider the years ahead in your planning: as more and more Canadian stations go DTV in the years to come it will be a benefit to have a CM4228 on a rotator with the second antenna fixed on Buffalo. If you can afford it, it would be a matter of spending $$$ on a new rotator now as opposed to the future hassle of taking down an existing antenna mast, cleaning it up, and mounting the rotator and antennas all over again. Yuck...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
29 Posts
changed directons

I have pointed my Terk TV38 more towards Toronto, and in the process improved all my signal strength. I will try to get back up there this coming weekend and take a true compass pointing to see where it's facing.

My Channel 9 now comes in with good reception on Analog and digital. All the US channels come in with 70-90% power. The only channel that I don't get now is the SunTV (68 I think).

I stand corrected. You can get pretty much everything with only a single antenna. From reading the specs from the CM4228, i think you need to align the multiple lobes with the different targets. I found that my us stations are at 95% when pointing directly at buffalo, and get worse as you rotate about 25deg, toward Toronto. Then as you keep on rotating, the signal strength picks back up. It really is a luck/science to getting a good picture.

mjm
 

·
OTA Forum Moderator
Joined
·
24,867 Posts
Specs can be a real bu99er that way. I would usually suggest a bowtie reflector from where you are in Oakville, but...

I'm pretty sure your Terk 38 is a rebranded Winegard 7032 so you've got a solid VHF/UHF combo antenna there in the first place, but since the UHF portion is a corner-yagi its lobes will be more pronounced and forward-directional than with a CM4228's more generous reflector-type pattern.



Nevertheless you are very fortunate to have found a sweet spot in which both Toronto and Buffalo stations come in strongly, because you're at the point of a triangle that matches your beam pattern. I say stick with what you've got that's working to your satisfaction.

Your model of antenna will also be a terrific FM Radio antenna for stations a fair bit inland of Lake Ontario on both sides of the border if left pointed where it is for optimum TV (assuming you don't have an FM trap set in any preamp/amp gear).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
29 Posts
I should also add.. for testing I had the HDTV decoder hooked up in the bedroom. When I took it back downstairs to put it onto the 51" Toshiba, I did need to add a +6db amplifier/2way splitter to get the signal to work for Toronto.

This does add a small question. What is the difference between a pre-amp and a line amp?

The hookup to the antenna has a small step up transformer to convert from 300ohm to 75ohm RG6 cable. (that is what it's labeled as)

In my house, I have a TV on each level. The attic antenna is run down a wall cavity and comes out beside the Master bedroom TV. There I split it with my +6db powered 2way splitter, with one going into the analog tv and the other going out to the cabletv RG6 that the builder installed. That runs downstairs to a 4 way splitter that runs 3 connections to the entertainment room for HDTV, analog TV and the FM radio. The fourth runs back up to the main level family room.

What I have does work pretty well. I get reasonable signal strength. I wonder if it would be a better idea to get a bigger in-line amp, or put in a pre-amp and replace the in-line amp with a regular 2way spiller.

My current thought is if it ain't broke don't fix it. I was more interested in what the difference between the two are.
 

·
OTA Forum Moderator
Joined
·
24,867 Posts
mjm70 said:
This does add a small question. What is the difference between a pre-amp and a line amp?
The OTA Amps, Preamps, Splitters, Filters, Other Signal Gear thread has the info you need: http://www.digitalhomecanada.com/forum/showthread.php?t=26857

An antenna preamp is a very low noise amplifier for getting the antenna's signal indoors. It sometimes can drive several TVs, but usually not. That's where conventional signal amplifiers/splitters come in. They don't need to be so stringent about noise because internal cable runs are comparatively short and shielded.
mjm70 said:
The hookup to the antenna has a small step up transformer to convert from 300ohm to 75ohm RG6 cable. (that is what it's labeled as)
That transformer is called a balun because it takes a 300 ohm balanced signal (+ and - polarities) and converts it to an unbalanced, single signal that travels down the coax cable's internal wire.
mjm70 said:
I wonder if it would be a better idea to get a bigger in-line amp, or put in a pre-amp and replace the in-line amp with a regular 2way spiller.
Its usually a balancing act: if you add another receiver and your signal drops, you add corresponding amplification. Some people believe in feeding their antenna or preamp into a big amp indoors (such as a 20db) that keeps signal very high across the entire internal cabling, then putting attenuators (3 to 6db signal reducers) on their end receivers as needed to avoid overdriving them. This is probably overkill in most homes, but it is just a view into a different philosophy that is neither right or wrong. In such an installation there is hardly any risk that the signal will drop off with the addition of more receivers. Just some food for thought.

If you have further questions about amps we'll carry on the discussion in the OTA Amps, Preamps, Splitters, Filters, Other Signal Gear thread and keep this thread about Oakville reception.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5 Posts
Upper Middle & 8th Line using 2 indoor antennas

Did sb try to solve the direction problem by using two indoor antenna? I tried this: a cable splitter(1 to 2, use convertedly), connecting to two indoor antenna, ($15 from Walmart, with amplying function), then connect splitter to TV, make two antennas to 90 degree angle. turn on both antenna, now adjust a little bit, you can get both US and Toronto stations. even in my basement, I can get: (upper middle & 8th line)

2-1, 2-2, 4-1, 4-2, 5-1, 7-1, 9-1, 23-1, 23-2, 29-1, 29-2, 29-3, 43-1, 43-2, 43-3, 52-1.

I lost 25-1, it's French, I can't understand, so not matter. and I did not get 66-1. maybe I can get it when move to bedroom.
so it saves money anyway.
 

·
OTA Forum Moderator
Joined
·
24,867 Posts
Kevintrue, let us know what quality of signal you get (dropouts, etc.) on each of those channels after awhile.

Your post reminds me of the article on HDTVPrimer about using 2 Zenith Silver Sensors in a staggered formation to increase reception.
 
41 - 60 of 1367 Posts
Top