Area 51 for Antenna Modelers & Builders (See Post #1)

423149 Views 1327 Replies 63 Participants Last post by majortom, Jun 20, 2020

stampeder

Discussion Starter · Apr 21, 2009 (Edited)

This thread has been created strictly for Antenna Modelers and Builders who like to live not just on the leading edge but on the bleeding edge of antenna research and development.

Area 51 is for posting and discussion of any computer model of any experimental antenna by Antenna Modelers and Builders

Area 51 is not for casual builders or newcomers to ask questions or look for useable home antennas. Participants here are expected to fairly well "know their stuff".

If an antenna design is shown to be worthwhile for general public consumption we will move it out of Area 51 into the main Antenna Research & Development Forum.

Just remember what the ancient map makers wrote when they had no further info to illustrate: "Beyond here be dragons!"

261 - 280 of 1328 Posts

bokakob

· #261 · Aug 14, 2009 (Edited)

Thank you much for the help.

http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/album.php?albumid=298&pictureid=1346

bokakob

· #262 · Aug 15, 2009 (Edited)

2

*** I am very impressed with its performance! ***

I built the new antenna with uneven loops and it outperformed the antenna with equal loops. The old antenna stopped at Ch.50 and the new one picked up six more channels in the 60's range, even though the location was not as good as the old antenna -- there was not enough coax. Unfortunately, all of new channels are either Spanish, Korean, Portugese or Chinese and two audio channels only... I just wanted to prove the case. Again, thanks to everyone who helped.

See less See more

Xauto

· #263 · Aug 15, 2009

bokakob:With out the reflector the raw gain is [email protected] and increases to [email protected] The SWR is [email protected] down to 2.1 @Ch39 then up to [email protected] and [email protected]

300ohm

· #264 · Aug 16, 2009

Maybe some air loops or loops around a ferrite core.

No luck doing that, it made very little difference coiling up the RG58, no matter how I did it. But by using Netstumbler and RaUI (the Ralink included software) which measure in dBm, I could tweak the antenna on the fly looking at the screen, and got at least 2 more dBm by ever so slightly changing the feedpoint distance and playing with the reflector. Netstumbler and RaUI are now telling me I get about 8 dBm over the rubber ducky wifi antenna, so I guess thats about right for a biquad.
I gotta get my portable TV/Sansonic FT300A project finished so I can tweak my DBGHs real time on the fly in a similar fashion. When tweaking like that, it doesnt really matter that the numbers arent correct in the absolute sense, because they are correct in the relative sense.

wildwillie

· #265 · Aug 16, 2009 (Edited by Moderator)

Hello Area51 members
X0255
Well I just could not stay away from the VHF_Hi on the GH
I have managed to keep the SWR below <3 on the UHF and VHF_Hi
the VHF_Hi is looking good at around 11dbi and above on a single GH
In the UHF lowest dbi around 13.5 and peaking to over 15dbi
Could you guys have a look and see if there is any faults before i start this build.
Thank you
William

Code:

CM X0256
CM SBGH  UHF Collinear Rods design by WildWillie
CM VHF-HI Collinear Rods
CM SWR below <3
CM 7	174
CM 8	180
CM 9	186
CM 10	192
CM 11	198
CM 12	204
CM 13	210
CE
GW	1	3	0	-2.5	0	0	1.90944881	0	0.11889764
GW	2	7	0	1.90944881	0	0	7.42125983	5.51181102	0.13779528
GW	3	7	0	7.42125983	5.51181102	0	1.90944881	11.023622	0.13779528
GW	4	7	0	1.90944881	11.023622	0	7.42125983	16.5354331	0.13779528
GW	5	3	0	7.42125983	16.5354331	0	12.1338598	16.5354331	0.13779528
GW	6	7	0	1.90944881	0	0	7.42125983	-5.511811	0.13779528
GW	7	7	0	7.42125983	-5.511811	0	1.90944881	-11.023622	0.13779528
GW	8	7	0	1.90944881	-11.023622	0	7.42125983	-16.535433	0.13779528
GW	9	3	0	7.42125983	-16.535433	0	12.1338598	-16.535433	0.13779528
GW	10	7	0	-2.5	0	0	-8.011811	5.51181102	0.13779528
GW	11	7	0	-8.011811	5.51181102	0	-2.5	11.023622	0.13779528
GW	12	7	0	-2.5	11.023622	0	-8.011811	16.5354331	0.13779528
GW	13	3	0	-8.011811	16.5354331	0	-12.724411	16.5354331	0.13779528
GW	14	7	0	-2.5	0	0	-8.011811	-5.511811	0.13779528
GW	15	7	0	-8.011811	-5.511811	0	-2.488189	-10.988189	0.13779528
GW	16	7	0	-2.488189	-10.988189	0	-8	-16.5	0.13779528
GW	17	3	0	-8	-16.5	0	-12.7	-16.5	0.13779528
GW	32	21	-0.0295276	-15.295276	17	-0.0295276	13.4547244	17	0.13779528
GW	33	21	-0.0295276	-15.295276	-17	-0.0295276	13.4547244	-17	0.13779528
GW	34	21	-10.5	-29.5	4	-10.5	-0.5	4	0.1377953
GW	42	21	-10.5	0.5	4	-10.5	29.5	4	0.1377953
GW	43	21	-10.5	-29.5	-4	-10.5	-0.5	-4	0.1377953
GW	44	21	-10.5	0.5	-4	-10.5	29.5	-4	0.1377953
GW	45	23	-10.5	-31.5	41	-10.5	-1.5	41	0.1377953
GW	46	23	-10.5	-0.5	41	-10.5	30	41	0.1377953
GW	47	23	-10.5	-31	-41	-10.5	-1	-41	0.1377953
GW	48	23	-10.5	0	-41	-10.5	30.5	-41	0.1377953
GW	49	27	-10.5	-37	37	-10.5	-1.5	37	0.1377953
GW	50	27	-10.5	-0.5	37	-10.5	35	37	0.1377953
GW	51	27	-10.5	-36.5	-37	-10.5	-1	-37	0.1377953
GW	52	27	-10.5	0	-37	-10.5	35.5	-37	0.1377953
GW	53	21	-10.5	-30	44.5	-10.5	-1.5	44.5	0.1377953
GW	54	21	-10.5	-0.5	44.5	-10.5	28	44.5	0.1377953
GW	55	21	-10.5	-29.5	-44.5	-10.5	-1	-44.5	0.1377953
GW	56	21	-10.5	0	-44.5	-10.5	28.25	-44.5	0.1377953
GW	59	25	-10.5	15.5	0	-10.5	-17.5	0	0.13779528
GW	61	23	-10.5	15.5	6	-10.5	-15.5	6	0.13779528
GW	63	23	-10.5	16	-6	-10.5	-15	-6	0.13779528
GW	65	27	-10.5	18	21	-10.5	-18	21	0.13779528
GW	67	27	-10.5	18	-21	-10.5	-18	-21	0.13779528
GW	69	9	-4	0	-25	-4	-11	-25	0.13779528
GW	70	9	-4	-0.5	7.5	-4	-12.5	7.5	0.13779528
GW	71	9	-4	13	2.5	-4	0.5	2.5	0.13779528
GW	72	9	-4	-0.5	2.5	-4	-13	2.5	0.13779528
GW	74	9	-4	13	-2.5	-4	0.5	-2.5	0.13779528
GW	75	9	-4	-0.5	-2.5	-4	-13	-2.5	0.13779528
GW	76	9	-4	12.5	7.5	-4	0.5	7.5	0.13779528
GW	77	9	-4	-0.5	-7.5	-4	-12.5	-7.5	0.13779528
GW	78	9	-4	12.5	-7.5	-4	0.5	-7.5	0.13779528
GW	79	9	-4	11.7874	-25	-4	0.7874	-25	0.13779528
GW	80	9	-4	0	25	-4	-11	25	0.13779528
GW	81	9	-4	11.7874	25	-4	0.7874	25	0.13779528
GW	82	9	-4	-0.5	10	-4	-12.5	10	0.13779528
GW	83	9	-4	12.5	10	-4	0.5	10	0.13779528
GW	84	9	-4	-0.5	-10	-4	-12.5	-10	0.13779528
GW	85	9	-4	12.5	-10	-4	0.5	-10	0.13779528
GW	86	9	-4	13	15	-4	0.5	15	0.13779528
GW	87	9	-4	-0.5	15	-4	-13	15	0.13779528
GW	88	9	-4	13	-15	-4	0.5	-15	0.13779528
GW	89	9	-4	-0.5	-15	-4	-13	-15	0.13779528
GW	94	9	-4	13	13.5	-4	0.5	13.5	0.13779528
GW	95	9	-4	-0.5	13.5	-4	-13	13.5	0.13779528
GW	96	9	-4	13	-13.5	-4	0.5	-13.5	0.13779528
GW	97	9	-4	-0.5	-13.5	-4	-13	-13.5	0.13779528
GS	0	0	0.0254		' All in in.
GE	0
EK
LD	5	0	0	0	2.49e7	0
EX	0	1	2	0	1	0
GN	-1
FR	0	1	0	0	173	0

See less See more

300ohm

· #266 · Aug 17, 2009 (Edited by Moderator)

2

Could you guys have a look and see if there is any faults before i start this build.

Generally looks pretty good, especially vhf-hi gain on a SBGH, but intricate to build that 89 inch high monster, heh. It was lopsided a bit, but that was easy enough to correct in Geometry Edit. I also adjusted UHF AGT = 1.0 (0 db) for the center of the UHF band (585 mhz) and put in a RP card. You have that dip in the 613 mhz gain range, so you may want to try putting in Ramkats Tophat NAROD style, if that dip area affects you.

Adjusted NEC file :

Code:

CM X0255
CM Adjusted for lopsided patterns and AGT = 1.0 
CM SBGH  UHF Collinear Rods design by WildWillie
CM VHF-HI Collinear Rods
CM SWR below <3
CM 7	174
CM 8	180
CM 9	186
CM 10	192
CM 11	198
CM 12	204
CM 13	210
CE
GW	1	3	0	-2.5	0	0	1.90944881	0	0.075
GW	2	7	0	1.90944881	0	0	7.42125983	5.51181102	0.13779528
GW	3	7	0	7.42125983	5.51181102	0	1.90944881	11.023622	0.13779528
GW	4	7	0	1.90944881	11.023622	0	7.42125983	16.5354331	0.13779528
GW	5	3	0	7.42125983	16.5354331	0	12.1338598	16.5354331	0.13779528
GW	6	7	0	1.90944881	0	0	7.42125983	-5.511811	0.13779528
GW	7	7	0	7.42125983	-5.511811	0	1.90944881	-11.023622	0.13779528
GW	8	7	0	1.90944881	-11.023622	0	7.42125983	-16.535433	0.13779528
GW	9	3	0	7.42125983	-16.535433	0	12.1338598	-16.535433	0.13779528
GW	10	7	0	-2.5	0	0	-8.011811	5.51181102	0.13779528
GW	11	7	0	-8.011811	5.51181102	0	-2.5	11.023622	0.13779528
GW	12	7	0	-2.5	11.023622	0	-8.011811	16.5354331	0.13779528
GW	13	3	0	-8.011811	16.5354331	0	-12.724411	16.5354331	0.13779528
GW	14	7	0	-2.5	0	0	-8.011811	-5.511811	0.13779528
GW	15	7	0	-8.011811	-5.511811	0	-2.488189	-10.988189	0.13779528
GW	16	7	0	-2.488189	-10.988189	0	-8	-16.5	0.13779528
GW	17	3	0	-8	-16.5	0	-12.7	-16.5	0.13779528
GW	32	21	-0.0295276	-15.295276	17	-0.0295276	13.4547244	17	0.13779528
GW	33	21	-0.0295276	-15.295276	-17	-0.0295276	13.4547244	-17	0.13779528
GW	34	21	-10.5	-29.5	4	-10.5	-0.5	4	0.1377953
GW	42	21	-10.5	0.5	4	-10.5	29.5	4	0.1377953
GW	43	21	-10.5	-29.5	-4	-10.5	-0.5	-4	0.1377953
GW	44	21	-10.5	0.5	-4	-10.5	29.5	-4	0.1377953
GW	45	23	-10.5	-31.5	41	-10.5	-1.5	41	0.1377953
GW	46	23	-10.5	-0.5	41	-10.5	30	41	0.1377953
GW	47	23	-10.5	-31	-41	-10.5	-1	-41	0.1377953
GW	48	23	-10.5	0	-41	-10.5	30.5	-41	0.1377953
GW	49	27	-10.5	-37	37	-10.5	-1.5	37	0.1377953
GW	50	27	-10.5	-0.5	37	-10.5	35	37	0.1377953
GW	51	27	-10.5	-36.5	-37	-10.5	-1	-37	0.1377953
GW	52	27	-10.5	0	-37	-10.5	35.5	-37	0.1377953
GW	53	21	-10.5	-30	44.5	-10.5	-1.5	44.5	0.1377953
GW	54	21	-10.5	-0.5	44.5	-10.5	28	44.5	0.1377953
GW	55	21	-10.5	-29.5	-44.5	-10.5	-1	-44.5	0.1377953
GW	56	21	-10.5	0	-44.5	-10.5	28.25	-44.5	0.1377953
GW	59	25	-10.5	15.5	0	-10.5	-17.5	0	0.13779528
GW	61	23	-10.5	15.5	6	-10.5	-15.5	6	0.13779528
GW	63	23	-10.5	16	-6	-10.5	-15	-6	0.13779528
GW	65	27	-10.5	18	21	-10.5	-18	21	0.13779528
GW	67	27	-10.5	18	-21	-10.5	-18	-21	0.13779528
GW	69	9	-4	0	-25	-4	-11	-25	0.13779528
GW	70	9	-4	-0.5	7.5	-4	-12.5	7.5	0.13779528
GW	71	9	-4	13	2.5	-4	0.5	2.5	0.13779528
GW	72	9	-4	-0.5	2.5	-4	-13	2.5	0.13779528
GW	74	9	-4	13	-2.5	-4	0.5	-2.5	0.13779528
GW	75	9	-4	-0.5	-2.5	-4	-13	-2.5	0.13779528
GW	76	9	-4	12.5	7.5	-4	0.5	7.5	0.13779528
GW	77	9	-4	-0.5	-7.5	-4	-12.5	-7.5	0.13779528
GW	78	9	-4	12.5	-7.5	-4	0.5	-7.5	0.13779528
GW	79	9	-4	11.7874	-25	-4	0.7874	-25	0.13779528
GW	80	9	-4	0	25	-4	-11	25	0.13779528
GW	81	9	-4	11.7874	25	-4	0.7874	25	0.13779528
GW	82	9	-4	-0.5	10	-4	-12.5	10	0.13779528
GW	83	9	-4	12.5	10	-4	0.5	10	0.13779528
GW	84	9	-4	-0.5	-10	-4	-12.5	-10	0.13779528
GW	85	9	-4	12.5	-10	-4	0.5	-10	0.13779528
GW	86	9	-4	13	15	-4	0.5	15	0.13779528
GW	87	9	-4	-0.5	15	-4	-13	15	0.13779528
GW	88	9	-4	13	-15	-4	0.5	-15	0.13779528
GW	89	9	-4	-0.5	-15	-4	-13	-15	0.13779528
GW	94	9	-4	13	13.5	-4	0.5	13.5	0.13779528
GW	95	9	-4	-0.5	13.5	-4	-13	13.5	0.13779528
GW	96	9	-4	13	-13.5	-4	0.5	-13.5	0.13779528
GW	97	9	-4	-0.5	-13.5	-4	-13	-13.5	0.13779528
GS	0	0	0.0254		' All in in.
GE	0
EK
LD	5	0	0	0	2.49e7	0
EX	0	1	2	0	1	0
GN	-1
FR	0	8	0	0	173	6
RP 0 1 73 1510 90 0 1 5 0 0

Raw Gain:

SWR:

See less See more

300ohm

· #267 · Aug 17, 2009

2

the VHF_Hi is looking good at around 11dbi and above on a single GH

Yeah, that does look very good with about 10.2 dbi VHF-Hi Net Gain average on a SBGH. Pretty much beats out everything here except the CM3671B (and the VU-190XR on channels 7 and 8) : http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ANTENNAS/comparing.html
Figure about 2.5 dbi more on a double bay version done right. (of course youre looking at a about a 15ft high antenna)

VHF Hi Raw Gain:

VHf Hi SWR:

See less See more

wildwillie

· #268 · Aug 17, 2009 (Edited by Moderator)

thank you 300ohms ya she is a little long in lenght .
Oh hey back the reflector for VHF_Hi back about 2.5 inches and channel 7 and 8 gets a little more gain over the 11dbi mark.

hmmmm a GH being beat out on vhf_hi have to work some more on that hehe

Ramkats Tophat NAROD style, if that dip area affects you.

The top hat of of Ramkits if i get it figured out but right now I'm getting check seg's but dam 300ohms that dip real goes the other way puts me up into the 15.54dbi and above at 583

X0255.NEC wavelength=1.733 mtr.

Warn.: Wire 69 (tag 105), seg-len (0.25) below 2 * radius (0.276)
Warn.: Wire 78 (tag 114), seg-len (0.25) below 2 * radius (0.276)
Warn.: Wire 87 (tag 123), seg-len (0.25) below 2 * radius (0.276)
Warn.: Wire 96 (tag 132), seg-len (0.25) below 2 * radius (0.276)

thank you

300ohms for the pic's and the help
william

Xauto

· #269 · Aug 17, 2009 (Edited by Moderator)

wildwillie: Here is a quick shot at Top hats.
CM Experimental Antenna Design X-255
CE WildWillie
SY S=0.3
SY D=0
GW 1 3 0 -2.5 0 0 1.90944881 0 0.075
GW 2 7 0 1.90944881 0 0 7.42125983 5.51181102 0.13779528
GW 3 7 0 7.42125983 5.51181102 0 1.90944881 11.023622 0.13779528
GW 4 7 0 1.90944881 11.023622 0 7.42125983 16.5354331 0.13779528
GW 5 3 0 7.42125983 16.5354331 0 12.1338598 16.5354331 0.13779528
GW 6 7 0 1.90944881 0 0 7.42125983 -5.511811 0.13779528
GW 7 7 0 7.42125983 -5.511811 0 1.90944881 -11.023622 0.13779528
GW 8 7 0 1.90944881 -11.023622 0 7.42125983 -16.535433 0.13779528
GW 9 3 0 7.42125983 -16.535433 0 12.1338598 -16.535433 0.13779528
GW 10 7 0 -2.5 0 0 -8.011811 5.51181102 0.13779528
GW 11 7 0 -8.011811 5.51181102 0 -2.5 11.023622 0.13779528
GW 12 7 0 -2.5 11.023622 0 -8.011811 16.5354331 0.13779528
GW 13 3 0 -8.011811 16.5354331 0 -12.724411 16.5354331 0.13779528
GW 14 7 0 -2.5 0 0 -8.011811 -5.511811 0.13779528
GW 15 7 0 -8.011811 -5.511811 0 -2.488189 -10.988189 0.13779528
GW 16 7 0 -2.488189 -10.988189 0 -8 -16.5 0.13779528
GW 17 3 0 -8 -16.5 0 -12.7 -16.5 0.13779528
GW 18 19 0 -9.3-D 18.5+S 0 9.3+D 18.5+S 0.138
GW 19 3 0 -9.3-D 17.5+S 0 -7.3-D 17.5+S 0.138
GW 20 3 0 7.3+D 17.5+S 0 9.3+D 17.5+S 0.138
GW 21 2 0 -9.3-D 17.5+S 0 -9.3-D 18.5+S 0.138
GW 22 2 0 9.3+D 17.5+S 0 9.3+D 18.5+S 0.138
GW 23 10 0 -11.8 16.7+S 0 -7.3-D 16.7+S 0.138
GW 24 10 0 7.3+D 16.7+S 0 11.8 16.7+S 0.138
GW 25 1 0 7.3+D 17.5+S 0 7.3+D 16.7+S 0.138
GW 26 1 0 -7.3-D 17.5+S 0 -7.3-D 16.7+S 0.138
GW 27 19 0 -9.3-D -18.5-S 0 9.3+D -18.5-S 0.138
GW 28 3 0 -9.3-D -17.5-S 0 -7.3-D -17.5-S 0.138
GW 29 3 0 9.3+D -17.5-S 0 7.3+D -17.5-S 0.138
GW 30 2 0 -9.3-D -17.5-S 0 -9.3-D -18.5-S 0.138
GW 31 2 0 9.3+D -17.5-S 0 9.3+D -18.5-S 0.138
GW 32 10 0 -11.8 -16.7-S 0 -7.3-D -16.7-S 0.138
GW 33 10 0 7.3+D -16.7-S 0 11.8 -16.7-S 0.138
GW 34 1 0 -7.3-D -17.5-S 0 -7.3-D -16.7-S 0.138
GW 35 1 0 7.3+D -16.7-S 0 7.3+D -17.5-S 0.138
GW 41 21 -10.5 -29.5 4 -10.5 -0.5 4 0.1377953
GW 42 21 -10.5 0.5 4 -10.5 29.5 4 0.1377953
GW 43 21 -10.5 -29.5 -4 -10.5 -0.5 -4 0.1377953
GW 44 21 -10.5 0.5 -4 -10.5 29.5 -4 0.1377953
GW 45 23 -10.5 -31.5 41 -10.5 -1.5 41 0.1377953
GW 46 23 -10.5 -0.5 41 -10.5 30 41 0.1377953
GW 47 23 -10.5 -31 -41 -10.5 -1 -41 0.1377953
GW 48 23 -10.5 0 -41 -10.5 30.5 -41 0.1377953
GW 49 27 -10.5 -37 37 -10.5 -1.5 37 0.1377953
GW 50 27 -10.5 -0.5 37 -10.5 35 37 0.1377953
GW 51 27 -10.5 -36.5 -37 -10.5 -1 -37 0.1377953
GW 52 27 -10.5 0 -37 -10.5 35.5 -37 0.1377953
GW 53 21 -10.5 -30 44.5 -10.5 -1.5 44.5 0.1377953
GW 54 21 -10.5 -0.5 44.5 -10.5 28 44.5 0.1377953
GW 55 21 -10.5 -29.5 -44.5 -10.5 -1 -44.5 0.1377953
GW 56 21 -10.5 0 -44.5 -10.5 28.25 -44.5 0.1377953
GW 59 25 -10.5 15.5 0 -10.5 -17.5 0 0.13779528
GW 61 23 -10.5 15.5 6 -10.5 -15.5 6 0.13779528
GW 63 23 -10.5 16 -6 -10.5 -15 -6 0.13779528
GW 65 27 -10.5 18 21 -10.5 -18 21 0.13779528
GW 67 27 -10.5 18 -21 -10.5 -18 -21 0.13779528
GW 69 9 -4 0 -25 -4 -11 -25 0.13779528
GW 70 9 -4 -0.5 7.5 -4 -12.5 7.5 0.13779528
GW 71 9 -4 13 2.5 -4 0.5 2.5 0.13779528
GW 72 9 -4 -0.5 2.5 -4 -13 2.5 0.13779528
GW 74 9 -4 13 -2.5 -4 0.5 -2.5 0.13779528
GW 75 9 -4 -0.5 -2.5 -4 -13 -2.5 0.13779528
GW 76 9 -4 12.5 7.5 -4 0.5 7.5 0.13779528
GW 77 9 -4 -0.5 -7.5 -4 -12.5 -7.5 0.13779528
GW 78 9 -4 12.5 -7.5 -4 0.5 -7.5 0.13779528
GW 79 9 -4 11.7874 -25 -4 0.7874 -25 0.13779528
GW 80 9 -4 0 25 -4 -11 25 0.13779528
GW 81 9 -4 11.7874 25 -4 0.7874 25 0.13779528
GW 82 9 -4 -0.5 10 -4 -12.5 10 0.13779528
GW 83 9 -4 12.5 10 -4 0.5 10 0.13779528
GW 84 9 -4 -0.5 -10 -4 -12.5 -10 0.13779528
GW 85 9 -4 12.5 -10 -4 0.5 -10 0.13779528
GW 86 9 -4 13 15 -4 0.5 15 0.13779528
GW 87 9 -4 -0.5 15 -4 -13 15 0.13779528
GW 88 9 -4 13 -15 -4 0.5 -15 0.13779528
GW 89 9 -4 -0.5 -15 -4 -13 -15 0.13779528
GW 94 9 -4 13 13.5 -4 0.5 13.5 0.13779528
GW 95 9 -4 -0.5 13.5 -4 -13 13.5 0.13779528
GW 96 9 -4 13 -13.5 -4 0.5 -13.5 0.13779528
GW 97 9 -4 -0.5 -13.5 -4 -13 -13.5 0.13779528
GS 0 0 0.0254 ' All in in.
GE 0
EK
LD 5 0 0 0 2.49e7 0
EX 0 1 2 0 1 0
GN -1
FR 0 8 0 0 173 6
RP 0 1 73 1510 90 0 1 5 0 0
EN

See less See more

300ohm

· #270 · Aug 17, 2009

2

For the uninformed, this is what the 89 inch structure looks like : (Wildwillie avatar fits well, heh)

I find the pattern at 585 mhz cool. It looks like a rocket blimp !

I really like it, but would never build it, heh.

See less See more

300ohm

· #271 · Aug 17, 2009

This is the RamKat Top Hat NAROD look, posted by Xauto above :

Xauto, did you optimize the Top Hat NAROD for the full VHF-Hi band ? (of course its a compromise)

See less See more

300ohm

· #272 · Aug 17, 2009

but dam 300ohms that dip real goes the other way puts me up into the 15.54dbi and above at 583

Yeah, before the dip, theres a slight boost in dbi, heh.

Xauto

· #273 · Aug 17, 2009

wildwillie/300ohm: The top hat that I substituted is the one that I'm using that works from Ch7 to Ch13. On wildwillies design it shines'. 11dbi net with swr under 2. The UHF peak at [email protected] This is one paper tiger.

stampeder

Discussion Starter · #274 · Aug 17, 2009

Sorry, when I moved an off topic post out of this thread X-256 became X-255, not that it really matters I suppose.

300ohm

· #275 · Aug 18, 2009

Hmm, referring to picture on post 261, if you eliminate the 3 topmost large pairs of pairs of reflectors and the 3 bottommost, you then have a 50 inch tall antenna instead of an 89 inch one. You lose only about 1 dbi net gain on VHF-Hi, but get that back on UHF, especially after channel 31. SWR looks much better too.

Xauto

· #276 · Aug 18, 2009

If you do that with the Top hat NARODs, you give up about 1.3 dBi on the VHF-hi side and only get about 0.5dbi back on the UHF side at Ch51. May not be a good trade off for the Top hat.

wildwillie

· #277 · Aug 18, 2009

300ohms/Xauto play with the 4 col rods center move them out away from each other in parelle i will show you in a second.

heck going to start for scratch again n0w that i have the top hat.

Edit i"m back have a look this is only with VHF-hi reflectors . UHF will be worked on later.
58 inches tall

Code:

CM X0256 VHF-Hi only reflectors ;)
CM 
CM design by WildWillie
CM VHF-HI ONLY Collinear Rods
CM SWR below <3
CM 7	174
CM 8	180
CM 9	186
CM 10	192
CM 11	198
CM 12	204
CM 13	210
CE
GW	1	3	0	-2.5	0	0	1.90944882	0	0.075
GW	2	7	0	1.90944882	0	0	7.42125984	5.51181102	0.13779528
GW	3	7	0	7.42125984	5.51181102	0	1.90944882	11.023622	0.13779528
GW	4	7	0	1.90944882	11.023622	0	7.42125984	16.5354331	0.13779528
GW	5	3	0	7.42125984	16.5354331	0	12.1338598	16.5354331	0.13779528
GW	6	7	0	1.90944882	0	0	7.42125984	-5.511811	0.13779528
GW	7	7	0	7.42125984	-5.511811	0	1.90944882	-11.023622	0.13779528
GW	8	7	0	1.90944882	-11.023622	0	7.42125984	-16.535433	0.13779528
GW	9	3	0	7.42125984	-16.535433	0	12.1338598	-16.535433	0.13779528
GW	10	7	0	-2.5	0	0	-8.011811	5.51181102	0.13779528
GW	11	7	0	-8.011811	5.51181102	0	-2.5	11.023622	0.13779528
GW	12	7	0	-2.5	11.023622	0	-8.011811	16.5354331	0.13779528
GW	13	3	0	-8.011811	16.5354331	0	-12.724411	16.5354331	0.13779528
GW	14	7	0	-2.5	0	0	-8.011811	-5.511811	0.13779528
GW	15	7	0	-8.011811	-5.511811	0	-2.488189	-10.988189	0.13779528
GW	16	7	0	-2.488189	-10.988189	0	-8	-16.5	0.13779528
GW	17	3	0	-8	-16.5	0	-12.7	-16.5	0.13779528
GW	117	7	0	-0.25	-19	0	-9.75	-19	0.13779528
GW	118	1	0	-9.75	-19	0	-10	-18.75	0.13779528
GW	119	1	0	-10	-18.75	0	-10	-18.25	0.13779528
GW	120	1	0	-10	-18.25	0	-9.75	-18	0.13779528
GW	121	1	0	-9.75	-18	0	-8.25	-18	0.13779528
GW	122	1	0	-8.25	-18	0	-8	-17.75	0.13779528
GW	123	1	0	-8	-17.75	0	-8	-17.25	0.13779528
GW	124	1	0	-8	-17.25	0	-8.25	-17	0.13779528
GW	125	3	0	-8.25	-17	0	-12.4	-17	0.13779528
GW	126	7	0	-0.25	-19	0	9.25	-19	0.13779528
GW	127	1	0	9.25	-19	0	9.5	-18.75	0.13779528
GW	128	1	0	9.5	-18.75	0	9.5	-18.25	0.13779528
GW	129	1	0	9.5	-18.25	0	9.25	-18	0.13779528
GW	130	1	0	9.25	-18	0	7.75	-18	0.13779528
GW	131	1	0	7.75	-18	0	7.5	-17.75	0.13779528
GW	132	1	0	7.5	-17.75	0	7.5	-17.25	0.13779528
GW	133	1	0	7.5	-17.25	0	7.75	-17	0.13779528
GW	134	3	0	7.75	-17	0	11.9	-17	0.13779528
GW	135	7	0	-0.25	19.2	0	9.25	19.2	0.13779528
GW	136	1	0	9.25	19.2	0	9.5	18.95	0.13779528
GW	137	1	0	9.5	18.95	0	9.5	18.45	0.13779528
GW	138	1	0	9.5	18.45	0	9.25	18.2	0.13779528
GW	139	1	0	9.25	18.2	0	7.75	18.2	0.13779528
GW	140	1	0	7.75	18.2	0	7.5	17.95	0.13779528
GW	141	1	0	7.5	17.95	0	7.5	17.45	0.13779528
GW	142	1	0	7.5	17.45	0	7.75	17.2	0.13779528
GW	143	3	0	11.9	17.2	0	7.75	17.2	0.13779528
GW	144	7	0	-0.25	19.2	0	-9.75	19.2	0.13779528
GW	145	1	0	-9.75	19.2	0	-10	18.95	0.13779528
GW	146	1	0	-10	18.95	0	-10	18.45	0.13779528
GW	147	1	0	-10	18.45	0	-9.75	18.2	0.13779528
GW	148	1	0	-9.75	18.2	0	-8.25	18.2	0.13779528
GW	149	1	0	-8.25	18.2	0	-8	17.95	0.13779528
GW	150	1	0	-8	17.95	0	-8	17.45	0.13779528
GW	151	1	0	-8	17.45	0	-8.25	17.2	0.13779528
GW	152	3	0	-8.25	17.2	0	-12.4	17.2	0.13779528
GW	174	23	-10	-14	0	-10	15.5	0	0.13779528
GW	175	23	-10	-14	-7.2	-10	15.5	-7.2	0.13779528
GW	176	23	-10	-36.1	3	-10	-4.6	3	0.13779528
GW	177	23	-10	4	3	-10	35.5	3	0.13779528
GW	178	23	-10	-36.2	-3	-10	-4.7	-3	0.13779528
GW	179	23	-10	4	-3	-10	35.5	-3	0.13779528
GW	180	23	-10	-36.8	6	-10	-6.8	6	0.13779528
GW	181	23	-10	-36.9	-6	-10	-6.9	-6	0.13779528
GW	182	23	-10	6.3	-6	-10	36.3	-6	0.13779528
GW	183	23	-10	6.1	6	-10	36.1	6	0.13779528
GW	184	23	-10	-14.6	7.2	-10	14.9	7.2	0.13779528
GW	187	23	-10	-15	-29	-10	16.95	-29	0.13779528
GW	188	23	-10	-15.95	29	-10	16	29	0.13779528
GS	0	0	0.0254		' All in in.
GE	0
EK
LD	5	0	0	0	2.49e7	0
EX	0	1	2	0	1	0
GN	-1
FR	0	1	0	0	173	0
RP 0 1 73 1510 90 0 1 5 0 0

this is with UHF reflectors added

Code:

CM X0256 with UHF Collinear Rods
CM design by WildWillie
CM VHF-HI ONLY Collinear Rods
CM SWR below <3
CM 7	174
CM 8	180
CM 9	186
CM 10	192
CM 11	198
CM 12	204
CM 13	210
CE
GW	1	3	0	-2.5	0	0	1.90944882	0	0.075
GW	2	7	0	1.90944882	0	0	7.42125984	5.51181102	0.13779528
GW	3	7	0	7.42125984	5.51181102	0	1.90944882	11.023622	0.13779528
GW	4	7	0	1.90944882	11.023622	0	7.42125984	16.5354331	0.13779528
GW	5	3	0	7.42125984	16.5354331	0	12.1338598	16.5354331	0.13779528
GW	6	7	0	1.90944882	0	0	7.42125984	-5.511811	0.13779528
GW	7	7	0	7.42125984	-5.511811	0	1.90944882	-11.023622	0.13779528
GW	8	7	0	1.90944882	-11.023622	0	7.42125984	-16.535433	0.13779528
GW	9	3	0	7.42125984	-16.535433	0	12.1338598	-16.535433	0.13779528
GW	10	7	0	-2.5	0	0	-8.011811	5.51181102	0.13779528
GW	11	7	0	-8.011811	5.51181102	0	-2.5	11.023622	0.13779528
GW	12	7	0	-2.5	11.023622	0	-8.011811	16.5354331	0.13779528
GW	13	3	0	-8.011811	16.5354331	0	-12.724411	16.5354331	0.13779528
GW	14	7	0	-2.5	0	0	-8.011811	-5.511811	0.13779528
GW	15	7	0	-8.011811	-5.511811	0	-2.488189	-10.988189	0.13779528
GW	16	7	0	-2.488189	-10.988189	0	-8	-16.5	0.13779528
GW	17	3	0	-8	-16.5	0	-12.7	-16.5	0.13779528
GW	117	7	0	-0.25	-19	0	-9.75	-19	0.13779528
GW	118	1	0	-9.75	-19	0	-10	-18.75	0.13779528
GW	119	1	0	-10	-18.75	0	-10	-18.25	0.13779528
GW	120	1	0	-10	-18.25	0	-9.75	-18	0.13779528
GW	121	1	0	-9.75	-18	0	-8.25	-18	0.13779528
GW	122	1	0	-8.25	-18	0	-8	-17.75	0.13779528
GW	123	1	0	-8	-17.75	0	-8	-17.25	0.13779528
GW	124	1	0	-8	-17.25	0	-8.25	-17	0.13779528
GW	125	3	0	-8.25	-17	0	-12.4	-17	0.13779528
GW	126	7	0	-0.25	-19	0	9.25	-19	0.13779528
GW	127	1	0	9.25	-19	0	9.5	-18.75	0.13779528
GW	128	1	0	9.5	-18.75	0	9.5	-18.25	0.13779528
GW	129	1	0	9.5	-18.25	0	9.25	-18	0.13779528
GW	130	1	0	9.25	-18	0	7.75	-18	0.13779528
GW	131	1	0	7.75	-18	0	7.5	-17.75	0.13779528
GW	132	1	0	7.5	-17.75	0	7.5	-17.25	0.13779528
GW	133	1	0	7.5	-17.25	0	7.75	-17	0.13779528
GW	134	3	0	7.75	-17	0	11.9	-17	0.13779528
GW	135	7	0	-0.25	19.2	0	9.25	19.2	0.13779528
GW	136	1	0	9.25	19.2	0	9.5	18.95	0.13779528
GW	137	1	0	9.5	18.95	0	9.5	18.45	0.13779528
GW	138	1	0	9.5	18.45	0	9.25	18.2	0.13779528
GW	139	1	0	9.25	18.2	0	7.75	18.2	0.13779528
GW	140	1	0	7.75	18.2	0	7.5	17.95	0.13779528
GW	141	1	0	7.5	17.95	0	7.5	17.45	0.13779528
GW	142	1	0	7.5	17.45	0	7.75	17.2	0.13779528
GW	143	3	0	11.9	17.2	0	7.75	17.2	0.13779528
GW	144	7	0	-0.25	19.2	0	-9.75	19.2	0.13779528
GW	145	1	0	-9.75	19.2	0	-10	18.95	0.13779528
GW	146	1	0	-10	18.95	0	-10	18.45	0.13779528
GW	147	1	0	-10	18.45	0	-9.75	18.2	0.13779528
GW	148	1	0	-9.75	18.2	0	-8.25	18.2	0.13779528
GW	149	1	0	-8.25	18.2	0	-8	17.95	0.13779528
GW	150	1	0	-8	17.95	0	-8	17.45	0.13779528
GW	151	1	0	-8	17.45	0	-8.25	17.2	0.13779528
GW	152	3	0	-8.25	17.2	0	-12.4	17.2	0.13779528
GW	174	23	-9.5	-14	0	-9.5	15.5	0	0.13779528
GW	175	23	-9.5	-14	-7.2	-9.5	15.5	-7.2	0.13779528
GW	176	23	-9.5	-36.1	3	-9.5	-4.6	3	0.13779528
GW	177	23	-9.5	4	3	-9.5	35.5	3	0.13779528
GW	178	23	-9.5	-36.2	-3	-9.5	-4.7	-3	0.13779528
GW	179	23	-9.5	4	-3	-9.5	35.5	-3	0.13779528
GW	180	23	-9.5	-36.8	6	-9.5	-6.8	6	0.13779528
GW	181	23	-9.5	-36.9	-6	-9.5	-6.9	-6	0.13779528
GW	182	23	-9.5	6.3	-6	-9.5	36.3	-6	0.13779528
GW	183	23	-9.5	6.1	6	-9.5	36.1	6	0.13779528
GW	184	23	-9.5	-14.6	7.2	-9.5	14.9	7.2	0.13779528
GW	187	23	-9.5	-15	-29	-9.5	16.95	-29	0.13779528
GW	188	23	-9.5	-15.95	29	-9.5	16	29	0.13779528
GW	189	9	-4	12.5	2	-4	0.5	2	0.13779528
GW	190	9	-4	-0.5	2	-4	-12.5	2	0.13779528
GW	191	9	-4	12.5	-2	-4	0.5	-2	0.13779528
GW	192	9	-4	-0.5	-2	-4	-12.5	-2	0.13779528
GW	193	9	-4	12.5	14	-4	0.5	14	0.13779528
GW	194	9	-4	-0.5	14	-4	-12.5	14	0.13779528
GW	195	9	-4	13	10	-4	0.5	10	0.13779528
GW	196	9	-4	-0.5	10	-4	-13	10	0.13779528
GW	197	9	-4	13	-10	-4	0.5	-10	0.13779528
GW	198	9	-4	-0.5	-10	-4	-13	-10	0.13779528
GW	199	9	-4	12.5	-14	-4	0.5	-14	0.13779528
GW	200	9	-4	-0.5	-14	-4	-12.5	-14	0.13779528
GW	201	9	-4	12.5	24	-4	0.5	24	0.13779528
GW	202	9	-4	-0.5	24	-4	-12.5	24	0.13779528
GW	203	9	-4	13	20	-4	0.5	20	0.13779528
GW	204	9	-4	-0.5	20	-4	-13	20	0.13779528
GW	205	9	-4	13	-20	-4	0.5	-20	0.13779528
GW	206	9	-4	-0.5	-20	-4	-13	-20	0.13779528
GW	207	9	-4	12.5	-24	-4	0.5	-24	0.13779528
GW	208	9	-4	-0.5	-24	-4	-12.5	-24	0.13779528
GS	0	0	0.0254		' All in in.
GE	0
EK
LD	5	0	0	0	2.49e7	0
EX	0	1	2	0	1	0
GN	-1
FR	0	1	0	0	173	0
RP 0 1 73 1510 90 0 1 5 0 0

Now we can build either or if you just need a VHF-hi hehe.

Now i need to figure out how to build the lines for a DBGH

See less See more

300ohm

· #278 · Aug 19, 2009

Now i need to figure out how to build the lines for a DBGH

Some tips on that from my earlier analysis about a year ago. You want the phasing lines to be a minimum of 3/8" in front of or behind the driven element, or else you can have problems. I found the gain and SWR differences to be minimal 3/8" to 3+" (10mm to 80mm) in front of or behind the driven element.
The biggest differences in gain and SWR come from the distance between the phasing lines. Of course, each of the phasing lines has to be exactly equal.
You may also want to experiment with the phasing lines in various vee shaped patterns, like mclapp does on his 8 bay bowtie.
You want to keep tweaking the lines until you get that 2.5 - 3 dbi expected gain from doubling an antenna.

wildwillie

· #279 · Aug 19, 2009

I have been defeated by phase lines ooooooooh i just cannot grasp the moves i get lost oh well.

300ohms i hate to ask could you just put them into play so can go from there they can be off i will try and ajust
Please sir thank you as you have a better grasp of how to build them.

bokakob

· #280 · Aug 19, 2009

3

Bigger and Better(?) Brother

Hello everyone. I have built another crooked antenna as you can see on the pictures. Having some marginal success with the first variant, most likely because it was scaled after an industrial production unit, the next step was, naturally, to make it bigger and better. Here we go -- with straight logic of a person who have limited exposure in this field, I bought 20 feet of 12 gage solid wire for $4 and went to work... Then I labored for about thirty minutes and bent it in rhomboid contraption. I have no idea if it works properly, but it does work. If the first variant delivered 22 channels, this bigger brother got me 31 channels. One of them is NOAA marine weather for navigation. It clearly indicates that the contraption gets something, but I have no idea what exactly. Here is the list of programs I definitely can view and listen to:

2-1 WCBS-HD
4-1 WNBC-DT
4-2 Nonstop LX/1st Look NY
5-1 WNYW-DT
5-2 WWOR-DT
25-1 WNYE-1
25-2 WNYE-2
42 Air
47-1 WNJU-HD
50-1 NJN-1
50-2 NJN-2
50-3 NJN-AV
63-1 WMBC-DT
63-2 Korean
63-3 CGN-TV
63-4 MHTV
63-5 KBS
63-6 WDNJ
66-1 WFME-DT
66-2 WFME-FM
66-3 FR WEST
66-4 KEAR-FM
66-5 F.L.#1
66-6 F.L.#2
66-7 67SUB
66-8 92SUB
66-9 NOAA
66-10 FUTURE
68-1 WFUT-DT
68-2 WXTV-DT9

If someone would help me to make sense out this beast and analyze it, I would be very thankful. Perhaps adding a reflector would help a little? For the reference, the antenna is located in the NYC Metropolitan Area, approximately 12 miles directly south of Manhattan. Perhaps this is the main reason the antenna gets any channels at all... Thanks everyone for the help.

See less See more

261 - 280 of 1328 Posts

This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.