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post #16 of 36 (permalink) Old 2011-10-13, 12:42 PM
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Originally Posted by QuickSilver View Post
I bet most people set up iCloud with their iTunes account. I know I did when I set it up yesterday.
Same with me

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Originally Posted by Gino Cerullo View Post
I've said the same thing three time in three different ways. If you don't understand by now I'm afraid that demonstrating the difference while standing over your shoulder is the only other way I will get through. And that ain't gonna happen, sorry.
Wow, I don't think you need to be rude. You even admit it is confusing. Besides it is easy for you to give all of this advice, but since you admitted you haven't setup iCloud yet, then how do you know it will work in reality.
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post #17 of 36 (permalink) Old 2011-10-13, 01:10 PM
 
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Wow, I don't think you need to be rude. You even admit it is confusing. Besides it is easy for you to give all of this advice, but since you admitted you haven't setup iCloud yet, then how do you know it will work in reality.
I wasn't being rude, I was being realistic. Sorry if it did not come across that way to you.
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post #18 of 36 (permalink) Old 2011-10-13, 01:21 PM
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Well I think Apple should have done a better job at explaining things. Many Many people are confused about this....check out the forums around the web. For a Cloud service from a company that is supposed ot make things easy for the consumer the past 2 days have been well...confusing as hell. It is not comparable to the RIM debacle but I think Apple needs to do a better roll out next time. This is only my opinion.

A friend of mine messaged back and forth for about an hour last night trying to wrap our heads around this account stuff....moving back and forth from our iPads to iPhones and back again. Combined experience in IT for us is over 25 years. It was pretty funny when it all kind of clicked well almost clicked.

We chatted last night how this was going to work when our kids get older (both have 2.5 year olds) in that we could have a family calendar available on all devices for all of the family to use. Do not want my kids or wifes seeing my work messages though iMessages or personal messages from my buddies....

I created an address @.me this morning. I honestly see no use for iCloud at this point....with my iPhone and iPad being connected to exchange at work. Photostream is cool and useful.

I will have to really think about how this will work in our household.
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post #19 of 36 (permalink) Old 2011-10-13, 01:27 PM
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Honestly, I really don't get it so I have deleted my iCloud account (which I inadvertently set up when I was answering questions at the beginning) until I fully understand what is going on.



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post #20 of 36 (permalink) Old 2011-10-13, 01:39 PM
 
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Having read through what I've posted so far I should clear one thing up that may have also added to the confusion between Apple IDs and iCloud accounts.

(This following was true regarding MobileMe accounts so I'm presuming that it continues to hold true regarding iCloud accounts as well.)

When you register an iCloud account it is automatically also an Apple ID account. Yikes! Let me clarify.

Once you've created and iCloud account you can start using it as an Apple ID right away without doing any extra work. What this means is that you can use the iCloud account credentials, the @me.com email address and password, to login in to the iTunes Store, Apple Support Community forums and anywhere else an Apple ID is used.

For many people this is perfectly fine and will not present any problems but, for others, this has the potential to create problems that won't crop up right away. The main place that this becomes a problem is in the iTunes Store where say married couples or families want to be able to share the resources, apps and media, that they acquire there.

So what does all this mean? It means that if you find yourself in a situation where you want to share an Apple ID to gain the benefits of a shared iTunes Store account, then be aware that when you set up your devices that the account that they log into the iTunes Store account with is the same.

Apple has made provisions in all their devices that allow the separation of iCloud accounts and iTunes Store accounts. If you set up your devices iCloud account it is not automatically set up as the iTunes Store account. You have to log-in to the iTunes Store separately and when you do you can choose to log in using the shared account, that may be different fro your iCloud account, that you've decided as a group to use. It won't, for example, use the iCloud account you set up on your Mac's System Preferences in iTunes to log you in to the Store automatically.
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post #21 of 36 (permalink) Old 2011-10-13, 02:33 PM
 
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Yes, it is confusing but you have to understand that this all goes back a long way.

Apple's current history of cloud services goes back to around the year 2000 when they introduced a free service called iTools. It eventually transitioned to become .Mac then MobileMe and now iCloud. Along the way it also became a paid service only to now, once again, become a free service. If you count Apple's eWorld service, something akin to CompuServe or America Online if you're familiar with those old dial-up services, then Apple's cloud services go back to the mid ’90s. eWorld ran on Apple's AppleLink platform which began in the mid ’80. The AppleLink platform was also the basis for America Online as well. So if you think about it Apple's cloud service go back to the mid ’80s with AppleLink.

Apple IDs have a long history as well most of which I'm not familiar with despite having used Macs since the early ’90. I believe they were originally used as replacement account IDs when Apple stopped using AppleLink for such things as Developer accounts for example. Also, at one point, Apple IDs were not registered using an email address, as they were quite rare back then, and some people still use those old Apple ID accounts. Imagine how they feel.

Anyway at some point these separate services and/or IDs merged somewhat and more features were added and dropped along the way. Since Apple IDs could be registered using any email address that's what people did, especially once .Mac/MobileMe became paid services.

Once Apple expanded the use of Apple IDs to things like iTunes Store accounts and then introduce all these mobile and handheld devices into the mix well, things were bound to get a little messy and they have. One problem is that there doesn't seem to be a way to change an Apple ID account credential or to merge multiple accounts into one. There are rumours that Apple has plans to address these issues but they are only rumours at this point.
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post #22 of 36 (permalink) Old 2011-10-13, 02:50 PM
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Gino, I don't think you need to have to explain but thanks for trying!

I assume I will figure it out eventually but I think we can all agree that Apple has botched the implementation of this one for iPads with multiple-users.

By botch, I don't mean it doesn't work but the user interface / simplicity / implementation aspect of it all.

Personally, I really want to see a multi-user iPad or iPod touch.



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post #23 of 36 (permalink) Old 2011-10-13, 03:03 PM
 
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It's funny you should say that. Although I think of the iPhone as a very personal device I think of iPads as more of a multi-user device, like a desktop/laptop PC/Mac. As such I always thought that Apple should support the ability to have multi-user accounts on them like there is for desktops/laptops. Let's hope that support shows up in some future update.
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post #24 of 36 (permalink) Old 2011-10-13, 03:17 PM
 
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Set up iCloud
If you don’t have an iCloud account, it’s easy to sign up for one, either on your device, when updating to iOS 5 or through the Settings app, or on your computer if you’re running OS X 10.7.2. If you’re switching from MobileMe, you have to move and merge your account through the iCloud website before you can take advantage the service.

Do you have an Apple ID? If you’ve ever purchased something from the iTunes Store, you’ll have signed up for an Apple ID (which is usually your primary email address). Even if you never used this account to sign up for MobileMe, you can convert it into an iCloud account.


If you’ve converted your old Apple ID, you need to toggle the Mail switch to On in the iCloud pane to get an email address for your account.
To do so from an iOS device, go to the Settings app and tap the iCloud menu. At the top of the screen, enter your Apple ID and password. After a moment of setup time, iCloud will prompt you to merge anything on your device with this newly created account; tap Merge to do so, or Don’t Merge if you don’t want to copy the information currently on your device. From there, just tap the toggles to customize your iCloud account the way you prefer. Note that if you convert an Apple ID into an iCloud account, you won’t have access to iCloud email by default—you’ll have to create a [email protected] address first. To do so, toggle the Mail slider in the iCloud settings pane to On; a pop-up dialog box from the bottom of the screen will prompt you to create a username.

To activate iCloud on your computer, you need to be running OS X 10.7.2. (You can download it from Apple’s website or from Software Update on your computer.) You can set up iCloud online at icloud.com by simply logging in with your Apple ID; you can also set it up from your computer’s System Preferences application by clicking on the iCloud preference pane.

But what if I share my Apple ID? If multiple people use your Apple ID (say, if you have one central account for your, your spouse’s, and your children’s purchases), you can still use this ID among you for purchases, but each person will have to create a separate iCloud account for syncing and backup.

For example, if you have an Apple ID (or MobileMe account) you use between you, your significant other, and your daughter for purchases, but they'd like to take advantage of iCloud's sync and storage features, you'll want to do the following: Have each family member sign up for an iCloud account for their backups, mail, etc; then, after setting up iCloud on their iOS devices, go to the Store preference pane within the Settings app, sign out of the iCloud account (which will populate there automatically after you sign up), then sign into the original Apple ID you use for purchases.

If the Apple ID your family uses for purchases is also your primary account for syncing (if it's a MobileMe account, for example), you personally can use it for iCloud; but your family members will need to create separate iCloud accounts so that they don't accidentally end up syncing with your information.



Using the same Apple ID for Store purchases and iCloud (recommended)
Using the same Apple ID for store purchases and iCloud is recommended for most users. To use the same ID, follow these steps:

iPhone, iPad, or iPod touch:

When you first set up your iOS 5 device, enter the Apple ID you use for iTunes in the setup screens. It will be used for store purchases and iCloud.
If you skipped the setup process, enter your Apple ID in Settings > iCloud and Settings > Store.

Mac: Enter the same Apple ID in Apple () menu > System Preferences > iCloud and in 
iTunes > iTunes Store.

PC: Enter the same Apple ID in Control Panel > Network and Internet > iCloud and in iTunes > iTunes Store.

Using one Apple ID for iCloud and a different Apple ID for Store Purchases
You can use different Apple IDs for iCloud and store purchases and still get all of the benefits of iCloud. Just follow these steps:

iPhone, iPad, or iPod touch:


When you first set up your iOS 5 device, enter the Apple ID you want to use with iCloud. If you skipped the setup assistant, sign in to Settings > iCloud and enter the Apple ID you’d like to use with iCloud.
In Settings > Store, sign in with the Apple ID you want to use for store purchases (including iTunes in the Cloud and iTunes Match). You may need to sign out first to change the Apple ID.
Mac:

Enter the Apple ID you want to use for iCloud in Apple () menu > System Preferences > iCloud.
Enter the Apple ID you want to use for store purchases (including iTunes in the Cloud and iTunes Match) in iTunes > iTunes Store
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post #25 of 36 (permalink) Old 2011-10-13, 03:23 PM
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I agree that being able to set up more than one user on iOS devices would be a great thing. I also think it's only a matter of time before this happens.

My household has 4 MacBooks, 1 Mac Mini, 4 iPads and 4 iPhones. Essentially, my wife, my 12 yr old, my 10 yr old and myself each have those devices and the Mac Mini acts as a media server of sorts in our house (the 2 Apple TV boxes stream music, pictures and movies from it). I will have to rethink this part of the setup with iCloud but haven't gotten that far yet.

I have been subscribing to Mobile Me since day 1 (about 8-9 years ago I guess) so each family member already has me.com email address which also acts as an Apple ID. Until now, this has been used to allow each family member to sync their contacts, calendars, bookmarks, notes, etc. across their own devices. This part of the service shouldn't be drastically different under iCloud, except it is now free (good news since I was paying for this). The nice thing about it is that we have been sharing a family calendar and an address book in our house for at least 2 years.

We are, however, using ONE Apple ID to log into the iTunes store since it is linked to one credit card and allows apps and music to be downloaded to all our devices without having to pay again.

I don't imagine things will change all that much for us once I migrate our MobileMe service to iCloud. The main difference is that the media on our devices will now sync automatically, in addition to the mail, calendars, contacts and notes.

So I intend to set up each of my family members iCloud accounts individually, using our existing me.com addresses. But I will ensure that the iTunes store login info is set to my AppleID an ALL devices. I'm pretty sure this is what Gino Cerullo is saying.
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post #26 of 36 (permalink) Old 2011-10-13, 03:26 PM Thread Starter
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To activate iCloud on your computer, you need to be running OS X 10.7.2.
Or for the uncool majority you need Vista SP2 or Windows 7.
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post #27 of 36 (permalink) Old 2011-10-13, 03:32 PM Thread Starter
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The nice thing about it is that we have been sharing a family calendar and an address book in our house for at least 2 years.
Can you have both a family calendar and individual calendars? That would be very useful from my perspective.

So it looks like the way to go is to have one iCloud account per device but to use one unified ID Apple ID to buy stuff on iTunes.

Now what about Photo Stream? On my iPad it says
Quote:
Photo Stream automatically uploads new photos to iCloud and downlads them to all of your devices when connected to Wi-Fi.
I assume it will do this based on the iCloud account. Is there any way to merge a family's Photo Streams so that you would get this syncing for photos for all devices in your family? This was one of the other reasons that I thought it might make sense to use one iCloud account for all devices in my family, even if I have to pay $20/yr for more storage.
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post #28 of 36 (permalink) Old 2011-10-13, 03:40 PM
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Can you have both a family calendar and individual calendars? That would be very useful from my perspective.

So it looks like the way to go is to have one iCloud account per device but to use one unified ID Apple ID to buy stuff on iTunes.
Yes, and yes. I have several calendars, including an office exchange calendar, my individual personal calendar, calendars I subscribe to (pro sports teams) and a family calendar which you can share with others by sending them an invite. Everybody can edit the family calendar ( if you wish to let them do so). The minute one person edits the calendar,changes are pushed to all devices. You have no idea how liberating this is.

Agree on the iCloud / iTunes thing. Although you raise a great point with PhotoStream. Keeping all our family photos in one central location in our house is next to an impossible challenge when considering that pictures are taken from different iPhones and digital cameras and they are sort of all over the place. The flip side of the coin is that I don't know if I want my daughter's 300 pics of the family cat to bump some of the last 1000 pics in my photo stream if we end up sharing it. As a matter of fact, I'm not sure I want all those photos in my main, official iPhoto gallery. Not sure there will ever be a way to make this work for everyone as everybody's situation is a little unique.
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post #29 of 36 (permalink) Old 2011-10-13, 04:36 PM
 
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Apple has posted a Knowledgebase Article that hopefully addresses many of these questions.

Apple IDs and iCloud
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post #30 of 36 (permalink) Old 2011-10-13, 04:40 PM
 
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Or for the uncool majority you need Vista SP2 or Windows 7.
Sorry I didn't include that. I forgot there are still people using that.
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