Steve Jobs says why no Flash on iPhone, iPad - Page 5 - Canadian TV, Computing and Home Theatre Forums

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes

post #61 of 78 (permalink) Old 2011-03-07, 12:23 PM
Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Oakville, Cogeco
Posts: 3,211
I don't have a tablet, but I figure if I get one, I'd want one that has Flash, just so I can be sure I'd get a "regular" web experience. Ironically, if I go to a website on my PC and it gives me the choice of Flash or No Flash, I always choose No Flash.
asif9t9 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #62 of 78 (permalink) Old 2011-03-07, 12:37 PM
Moderator
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Nova Scotia
Posts: 3,210
Why not just give the user the choice? You know like a button "Enable Flash" that in turn goes to "Disable Flash". I have an iPad and find it frustrating at times. If it drains my battery faster so be it...but at least I have control of it.
QuickSilver is offline  
post #63 of 78 (permalink) Old 2011-03-07, 01:22 PM
Member #1
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Toronto
Posts: 47,716
Quote:
Why not just give the user the choice?
In the old days, sites did. You could goto the HTML site or the Flash site. I always chose the HTML site because I didn't like the "schlockiness" of most Flash sites.



hugh is offline  
 
post #64 of 78 (permalink) Old 2011-03-07, 04:34 PM
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: in my home theatre
Posts: 3,572
agree! Sites should have the option for flash vs non-flash. When the option is there, I always choose non-flash or sometimes even low-bandwidth option (when available).

THX, ISF, Control4 Certified Professional; CEDIA Certified Instructor; CEDIA Certified Designer
David Susilo is offline  
post #65 of 78 (permalink) Old 2011-03-07, 05:02 PM
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: 127.0.0.1
Posts: 3,370
Quote:
In the old days, sites did. You could goto the HTML site or the Flash site. I always chose the HTML site because I didn't like the "schlockiness" of most Flash sites.
Sure, but that was back when websites used flash for the entire website (or at least major portions of the site, like navigation. These days sites have moved away from that design pattern (even on "high bandwidth" sites), and now flash is for special purpose items like graphs (like in Google Finance) or video, but since there is no practical alternative to Flash (ignoring stuff like Silverlight) to do many of those functions there is no Flash vs HTML "option". Oh, and sites have generally abandoned the "splash" page on which those choices were presented.

If you want to block flash, use a flash blocker, and then it's like you clicked the "HTML" version all the time.
audacity is offline  
post #66 of 78 (permalink) Old 2011-03-07, 05:13 PM
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: in my home theatre
Posts: 3,572
Too many sites won't allow you to even enter if you disable flash. The worst offenders are vw.ca and honda.ca also mcintosh audio.

t

THX, ISF, Control4 Certified Professional; CEDIA Certified Instructor; CEDIA Certified Designer
David Susilo is offline  
post #67 of 78 (permalink) Old 2011-03-08, 10:31 AM
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: /dev/null
Posts: 3,022
Adobe capitulates?

Maybe it's a moot discussion now...Adobe has released their technology preview of a new tool that distills Flash into HTML5, giving websites an easy track back to iOS (and WP7 and Xoom for that matter). Apparently there's a couple of unsupported features, but the main functionality is there....

http://labs.adobe.com/downloads/wallaby.html
99semaj is offline  
post #68 of 78 (permalink) Old 2011-03-08, 10:48 AM
Member #1
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Toronto
Posts: 47,716
why would Adobe do this?

As a developer, if your going to convert your site to HTML 5 for some users, then why not build it in HTML 5 to begin with?



hugh is offline  
post #69 of 78 (permalink) Old 2011-03-08, 10:53 AM
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 216
There's a lot of people who are only comfortable producing content through tools. You could ask why people pay for Dreamweaver when they could just edit HTML by hand. It's very difficult to convince most people to learn new technologies, this way Adobe lock in their flash user base while keeping their skills relevant/marketable.

As well there is a large base of Flash code that people want to continue to use but don't want to pay someone to rewrite from scratch. They'll sell a lot of this to managers who only consider cost, even if it produces less efficient code.

I'm sure Adobe saw the writing on the wall a while ago, the iOS thing just accelerated how soon they were willing to pull the trigger on producing new tools vs preserving their flash cash cow.
GrimJack is offline  
post #70 of 78 (permalink) Old 2011-03-08, 11:21 AM
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: /dev/null
Posts: 3,022
Quote:
Originally Posted by hugh View Post
why would Adobe do this?
My guess is because it's more than just iOS that's choking on Flash. I'm thinking that other mobile OS's having the same problems, albeit less publicly, and Adobe needs an exit strategy.
99semaj is offline  
post #71 of 78 (permalink) Old 2011-03-08, 12:06 PM
Member #1
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Toronto
Posts: 47,716
GrimJack, that makes a lot of sense. I forget how long "legacy" code and "legacy" coders can last!

Interesting, I was just looking at some sales numbers and predictions. If Apple sells 40 or 50 million iPads in 2011 and 30 million iPhones then the install base of iPad and iPhone will be close to 150 million by the end of this year.

That's a number that Car Manufacturers and owners of other Flash sites can't ignore.



hugh is offline  
post #72 of 78 (permalink) Old 2011-03-08, 01:20 PM
U
 
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 1,491
Quote:
Originally Posted by hugh View Post
That's a number that Car Manufacturers and owners of other Flash sites can't ignore.
Exactly... Recently (less than a month ago), the French CBC web site did a full redesign and completely removed Flash. It now looks perfect on a tablet, I'm sure (although I can't prove it) it was one of their motivations. They also created an iPad/iPhone app to watch TV content (tou.tv) so they really seem to be embracing the tablet.
U is offline  
post #73 of 78 (permalink) Old 2011-03-08, 03:11 PM
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: in my home theatre
Posts: 3,572
at the same time 150 million unit is nothing compared to 1 billion plus users that can use flash. Regardless, I'm longing for the days of the old low-bandwidth websites. I'm tired of things flying around on my web screen as much as I'm tired of 3D movies throwing things at me.

I honestly feel that people don't have good enough content and use flash in the attempt to hide those deficiencies.

THX, ISF, Control4 Certified Professional; CEDIA Certified Instructor; CEDIA Certified Designer
David Susilo is offline  
post #74 of 78 (permalink) Old 2011-03-08, 03:19 PM
Veteran
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Edmonton Telus PureFibre 4K internet 150
Posts: 2,306
This debate is still an issue, but not for long. Hugh eluded to it in his post: The growth of iOS based devices is all the leverage Apple (Jobs) needs to force Web developers to adopt different standards (HTML 5).

I remember reading somewhere that over the last 12-15 months, the percentage of online video available through HTML 5 had jumped from 25% to about 65 to 70%.

This was during the iPad's infancy. This trend is only likely to accelerate and extend to other types of content such as animated websites.

I used to be choked at the lack of Flash support on iOS devices. It's rarely an issue anymore and when it is, I always have access to a computer to get around the problem. I have to agree with Jobs about the total resource hog that Flash is. My kids MacBooks double as space heaters because the Flash website they play games on. If they're not plugged in, battery is dead within 45 minutes. Flash does crash a lot on my Macs, even my recently purchased and loaded MacBook Pro running Snow Leopard and all the current software updates.
PokerChip is offline  
post #75 of 78 (permalink) Old 2011-03-08, 03:21 PM
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: in my home theatre
Posts: 3,572
It will still take at least another year or two before this flash thing become an exception instead of the norm. Mark my word.

THX, ISF, Control4 Certified Professional; CEDIA Certified Instructor; CEDIA Certified Designer
David Susilo is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Canadian TV, Computing and Home Theatre Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools Search this Thread
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome