New cellphones should be designed ... - Canadian TV, Computing and Home Theatre Forums

 
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post #1 of 9 (permalink) Old 2010-04-04, 11:35 PM Thread Starter
 
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New cellphones should be designed ...

... to have dual modes, meaning the phones should be able to support two SIMs, one for CDMA and one for GSM. Using dual SIMs, customers would be able to use their phone in any part of the world and add the new SIM to the secondary slot when traveling.

I know some Chinese cellphones already do this, I'm just wondering when the North American phones e.g. Nokia, Apple iPhone etc., will be be able to offer more dual-SIM phones. That would be fantastic.

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post #2 of 9 (permalink) Old 2010-04-05, 12:46 AM
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CDMA phones don't use SIM cards though, and unfortunately the CDMA carriers don't want to allow foreign handsets on their network.

Now if everyone were to switch to HSPA and perhaps LTE down the road, then there would be a chance that phones could support all the HSPA frequencies.
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post #3 of 9 (permalink) Old 2010-04-05, 06:48 AM
 
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Phones did not need dual mode... North American regulators (FCC and DOC) should have insisted on GSM when cell phones first went digital.

CDMA may or may not be a slightly better technology than GSM but it lost out in the global rush to cell phones.

I agree that when the world went to LTE so that one phone will work everywhere that will be a good thing. Many phones do support the 4 "old" frequencies plus the different flavours of HSPA/G3 at and around 2100 Mhz.
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post #4 of 9 (permalink) Old 2010-04-05, 07:32 AM
 
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Bell has carried models that did this for over four years. When I left Bell three years ago there was a Blackberry, and a Motorola that did both CDMA and GSM. The GSM was unlocked as well so you could use a Bell sim or pick one up in whatever country you were in.

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post #5 of 9 (permalink) Old 2010-04-05, 09:06 AM
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The CDMA cell phone network is on the way out and will be replaced by other technologies. IIRC, Bell & Telus are already providing GSM in addition to greater bandwidth networks.
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post #6 of 9 (permalink) Old 2010-04-05, 09:08 AM
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Quote:
Bell has carried models
Perhaps they realized a CDMA only model couldn't be used for roaming in much of the world, whereas a 4 band GSM phone could be used virtually anywhere.
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post #7 of 9 (permalink) Old 2010-04-05, 04:03 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timlocke View Post
Phones did not need dual mode... North American regulators (FCC and DOC) should have insisted on GSM when cell phones first went digital.

CDMA may or may not be a slightly better technology than GSM but it lost out in the global rush to cell phones.

I agree that when the world went to LTE so that one phone will work everywhere that will be a good thing. Many phones do support the 4 "old" frequencies plus the different flavours of HSPA/G3 at and around 2100 Mhz.
The last thing we need is for the gov't to get involved in regulating the technology for mobile comm's. The market has already decided and in broadstrokes it is GSM > UMTS > LTE. Phones are already being designed with this path in mind, but forget old CDMA being combined with this except in very limited markets. It just wouldn't be profitable.
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post #8 of 9 (permalink) Old 2010-04-05, 04:35 PM Thread Starter
 
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It would not be profitable for the carrier to combine both of these but it would be profitable to the phone manufacturer. I can imagine people buying these dual mode cellphones and switching between carriers whenever the carriers offer more competitive rates as they jostle each other for market share. Such a phone would be useful for people who travel and move around and do not like to be tied to anyone carrier regardless of where they are.

CDMA is not going away as shown in Apple's rumour of introducing a CDMA iPhone, and with India becoming the world's second largest CDMA market surpassing China. That's a heck of a lot of CDMA users that is NOT within North America. In North America, CDMA market share accounts for over 50%.

So, I can see a lot of business sense to introduce a CDMA iPhone, but I also see a lot more business sense to introduce a "worldphone" that can do all GSM+CDMA+HSPA modes. It might not make sense to the carriers but it makes sense to the people who buy these all-in-one phones as it allows us (users) to control which carriers we want to choose, and not the other way around.

Right now, if you are with Rogers, you don't want to switch to Telus, Bell or vice versa due to different phones required due to incompatible networks.

With prices coming so cheap for a GSM/HSPA or CDMA/HSPA phones, how much more expensive is it to bundle both phone technologies together and charge a higher premium for people who want to be able to choose their carriers? I've seen videocards with more powerful GPU cores than desktop PCs, and laptops with their PC prices going down every month, but yet cellphones can't do the same, come on! Get real.

I can't see it as that much higher cost-$$ wise than what people are paying now for a Nexus One etc. It just makes sense to me to support both technologies within the same phone (dual-SIM etc). The carriers would like you to think different as it makes more money for them.

But doing it the other way would make the cellphone manufacturer more money (not necessarily the carriers) but also allow users control of their carriers. This would indirectly force the carriers to be more competitive since they have no more head-lock on their customers, and also this competitive rate-wars would directly help users to offset the higher cost of such dual-mode phones for future.

Again, just a different line of thought. Think outside the box... back to more head-banging sessions...

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post #9 of 9 (permalink) Old 2010-04-06, 06:49 PM
 
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Originally Posted by lawman View Post

CDMA is not going away as shown in Apple's rumour of introducing a CDMA iPhone, and with India becoming the world's second largest CDMA market surpassing China. That's a heck of a lot of CDMA users that is NOT within North America. In North America, CDMA market share accounts for over 50%.

...

Right now, if you are with Rogers, you don't want to switch to Telus, Bell or vice versa due to different phones required due to incompatible networks.

With prices coming so cheap for a GSM/HSPA or CDMA/HSPA phones, how much more expensive is it to bundle both phone technologies together and charge a higher premium for people who want to be able to choose their carriers? I've seen videocards with more powerful GPU cores than desktop PCs, and laptops with their PC prices going down every month, but yet cellphones can't do the same, come on! Get real.
The current CDMA technology is going away - it will be a few years, but it is on the way out, no question. The evolution of CDMA and GSM is both toward LTE.

Rogers and Bell, Telus now have compatible HSPA networks making that point progressively moot as time goes on.

Cell phones are short-lived, commodity products. The manufacturer's will gladly make them if there is a demand, which there is in a few, limited, mostly-foreign markets. The analogy to CPU power is misplaced. The processing power and capabilities don't exist at low prices and small packages simply due to technology but due to the fact of rapidly moving technology in very high volumes to markets. The demand for dual CDMA/GSM/HSPA phones in the most valuable markets (North America and Europe) just isn't there. Where the demand lies is in high low-cost markets where competition is fierce and profit-margins are slim. Dual CDMA/GSM phones have been on the market here for years (I had one) but the demand is just not there.
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