Worth getting computer with Intel 2nd Gen Core Processors - Page 4 - Canadian TV, Computing and Home Theatre Forums
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post #46 of 52 (permalink) Old 2011-02-02, 05:46 PM
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Interesting, I'll have to look into this as well as it may come in handy when backing up some BD movies from 50GB to 25GB. I'm assuming it'll be faster than a dedicated GPU such as the Radeon 6000 series, or does it combine the two?
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post #47 of 52 (permalink) Old 2011-02-03, 06:55 AM
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Time to sit on the fence in my estimation.

Originally Posted by Eluder View Post
Interesting, I'll have to look into this as well as it may come in handy when backing up some BD movies from 50GB to 25GB. I'm assuming it'll be faster than a dedicated GPU such as the Radeon 6000 series, or does it combine the two?
From what the specs are the clock speed of the bus plus the number of pipes to the video makes it so the processor can now do real time video encoding with the possibility of streaming the output to whatever without dropout.

I just wish that some company would do the same thing for audio. I have a nephew that has written routines to do real time multitrack audio encoding by wave analysis and recreation at the cpu level. He was only 16 when he started to code them. Then went on to sell and create effects software that works from his original code.

So perhaps he will have a larger pro audio market, now that processors and motherboard chip sets have started to catch up to what he was doing 10 years ago! Most of what he wrote only worked well on Macs but it sold to some Windows users.

Would be really nice if in future gpu pcm and cpu were all integrated, and the user could fine tune the system for each purpose at the flip of a software based switch.

Might really hurt companies like Creative and M-audio though, as they rely on the fact that Intel, Analogue Devices and Realtek have only up and till now produced really crappy consumer audio hardware and software that is prone to dropout at higher bit rate and is ridiculously complicated to configure for recording purposes. Especially if what you want to do is record, transcode or stream high bit rate or try to do 7.1 24/192 studio audio with a pc. Same goes for high 1080p video with studio grade sound!
Sure they spec the video to do pro level work but I highly doubt that the audio will be up to the task.

I am interested in the latest specs that Intel is pushing for the audio api for their future offerings but I am sitting on the fence until some real product shows up. I have been burned in the past thinking that a pc could be capable of real work without buying an expensive add on audio card. Next year I will build a new pc and hopefully by then the kinks will be ironed out.
And the motherboard audio chip sets will actually do what they say they are capable of doing!
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post #48 of 52 (permalink) Old 2011-02-03, 04:48 PM
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And the motherboard audio chip sets will actually do what they say they are capable of doing!
What claims do motherboard manufacturers (with on-board audio) make that you allege are untruthful?
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post #49 of 52 (permalink) Old 2011-02-04, 04:15 AM
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Their video might be fine but audio performance is still in question

Originally Posted by DancesWithLysol View Post
What claims do motherboard manufacturers (with on-board audio) make that you allege are untruthful?
I do understand for the gamer or the home video user the audio might not be that important... but

Please forgive my rant but my experience with Intel and the azalia high definition audio codec has been far from stellar. I do not trust them to integrate high definition audio and video with any real reliability or common sense. I am afraid all you will get from them and Asus is bling and hype about how easy it is to turn your processor into a space heating device at the flip of a switch in the bios.

Higher bit rate recording or serious audio work with onboard chips has been anything but easy or of any real use. The alc883 from realtek is a good example. Sure you can record stereo 24/96 a-d at about 80-90 db as advertised with the device but there is always trouble with the motherboard drivers and audio rtprio, especially on asus boards.

Transcoding the saved high bit rate files invariably causes transcode time errors that do funny things like create pops and secondary noises and even timer drift. The software mixers are essentially useless. Even the ac97 based jack sensing can cause the driver to choke and puke when you switch devices. Sometimes even causing you to reboot the system.

Also using the line in function to the auxiliary input on the board causes hum at higher input levels so the input impedances are most likely set wrong for a hot line level signal. Something that the Creative consumer grade cards are also notorious for doing.

The drivers from Realtek and Creative are invariably over 20 meg in size and do squat that is really useful and hardly ever do what they say with any reliability. Whereas the drivers from M-Audio are rock solid tiny in size and the mixer does what it says it is doing without system lockups.

For this reason I stick with my good old pci 24/96 audiophiles with an ice1712 for stereo work or pair them for four track recording...they sync the crystals through the asio audio drivers and do not drift. And do transcoding really well with the drivers from M-Audio. At least they will handle a hot signal correctly.

Because Intel is slowly dropping the pci bus these cards may not usable on new boards in about 2 years. So I think I will stick with non Intel based boards for now. I see that their sandybridge spec is still for 2 32 bit pci slots so for now it is possible to use both of my cards but you can bet it will be down to a single pci slot very soon.

Some of the newer integrated chips like the alc892 that are supposed to be compliant with the azalia audio codec from intel spec are supposed to do a-d conversion at high bit rate with a very good db rating of over 100.

But much like the consumer grade stuff from Creative the drivers and their implementation is by and large terrible. If you look at what is happening when you search for the people who have already purchased motherboards with these chipsets you get the picture that driver hell is still the norm with azalia based highdef onboard audio.

So I think I will pass on the latest and greatest stuff until the drivers and problems are all ironed out, if they ever are. Either that or buy some really expensive pro gear that comes available at a reasonable price now and then when a studio goes out of business.

A good used Tascam HD-P2 or a portable 4 track would be just about perfect for my needs and would be just about as cheap as a new pc.
Fortunately there still are pci-x firewire cards readily available...heck I even have a spare one put away just in case the one I have blows up and all the manufactures suddenly decided to stop producing them.

That said I am still really interested in what is happening with the efficiency of the SandyBridge design. SandyBridge is a step in the right direction and I am very interested in the fact that combined graphics and cpu will work at 32 watts system idle and a max of 115 under heavy load. This means that a fan-less 300 watt power supply like the one I currently use will work really well with 2 hard drives and a SandyBridge I7.

I could easily run into trouble with the newer Phenoms that run at 60 watts idle or up to a ridiculous 221 under heavy load. Could be really useful though if I wanted to trancode video and cook supper at the same time though.

I currently use an 7750 black and I really have to watch the temps carefully if I Handbrake a dvd to m4v or do other stuff like do a lot of data transfer disk to disk. Or even blank a disk then reformat it for other purposes. So upgrading to something better is on the cards for me.

The wattage average is 95 on the processor alone, and I know that I could easily stress my power supply if I do something stupid and run everything my system can do all at once.

I have only caused a system lock from a power supply overload problem once in the past. And my boss was not impressed with my raid setup and the fact that he would have to shell out for a new bigger power supply for his hp server... because I did not do some simple math first... I do not like the smell of smoke very much when using a computer it makes me cringe a bit. The 4 story building being evacuated because of a smoke detector setting off the alarms was also a bit of black eye that I will also not forget.
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post #50 of 52 (permalink) Old 2011-02-04, 09:58 AM Thread Starter
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Thread off topic soI will close later today.

As far as the subject of the thread goes, I think the answer is that it's not worth getting an Intel 2nd Gen Core Processors and MOBO until new Motherboards with new chipsets are available for sale.

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post #51 of 52 (permalink) Old 2011-02-04, 02:09 PM
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It's a bit of a moot point, anyway: it looks like most/all vendors have pulled Sandy Bridge CPUs and motherboards from their product lineups for now. Presumably they'll reappear sometime in early April when the chipset problem is fixed and sufficient supply is available.

I remain happy with my new system. It's been rock solid and very, very fast. I moved my SSD and hard drive over to the SATA 6Gbps ports, and I may move the optical drive over to one of the Marvell 3Gbps ports shortly. In theory, as long as I don't add any additional SATA drives I have no real need to replace the motherboard. I may still do so, but that will depend on exactly how the replacement program is structured (I have no interest in ripping out the mobo to return it and then waiting 2+ weeks for a replacement to arrive).

The only good news in all of this is that the motherboard manufacturers will have two additional months to work out firmware bugs while only supporting a smallish group of customers.
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post #52 of 52 (permalink) Old 2011-02-04, 02:13 PM Thread Starter
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Last word goes to GDX then!

Thanks for everyone's participation.

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