Source Cable (Operated by Rogers) updates - Page 4 - Canadian TV, Computing and Home Theatre Forums

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post #46 of 64 (permalink) Old 2019-04-07, 05:54 PM
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Question

Does this mean there forcing customers to continue having rogers tv, their forcing you to take Rogers phone service even if you have it threw Bell Primus or someone else?

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post #47 of 64 (permalink) Old 2019-04-07, 07:03 PM
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Although IgniteTV package includes Rogers Home Phone (in the rest of Ontario), you don't have to use it, although it's basically almost free with the Ignite package, so why wouldn't you?

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post #48 of 64 (permalink) Old 2019-04-07, 08:07 PM
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For former Source Cable customers, they actually dropped the original SD line-up from 2-99. Instead what they did is they mirrored the HD channel block 701-799 1-99.
They might have used auto HD, as they do here. That means if you have a SD STB, you get SD on those channels and HD with HD STB. It all happens automagically.

Also, if you get Internet from Rogers, it will include IPv6.

BTW, I was doing some work in the Rogers Hamilton office, back in November. They're doing a lot of work there. Perhaps this has something to do with it.

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post #49 of 64 (permalink) Old 2019-04-08, 09:04 PM Thread Starter
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They might have used auto HD, as they do here. That means if you have a SD STB, you get SD on those channels and HD with HD STB. It all happens automagically
That's true of old STBs but Ignite service is a single modem to handle your Internet, Phone and TV. The portals that connect to your TV access live TV, on demand and apps via the Wi-Fi signal provided by the modem. In other words there is no tuner in these devices. From what I can tell, everyone is being migrated to Ignite TV if you are a Source Cable customer regardless if you have SD terminals or HD terminals.

For systems that have always been Rogers, the HD terminals would map the HD channel on the existing legacy channel numbers between 1-99. That is not the case with Source Cable customers. For example, channel 30 is TSN4 for Source Cable. On the new Ignite service, channel 30 is now YTV-HD. YTV HD was on channel 730 for Source Cable.

Here is the first 13 channels of Source Cable's old SD and HD channel line-up and the new Rogers Ignite line-up

Source Cable SD Line-up
1 Source on Demand
2 TVO
3 Global
4 Omni.1
5 Omni.2
6 CBC
7 Citytv
8 CBS
9 ABC
10 Radio-Canada
11 Today's Shopping Choice
12 CHCH
13 Sportsnet 360

Source Cable HD Line-up
701 Radio-Canada HD
702 TVO HD
703 Global HD
704 Omni.1 HD
705 Omni.2 HD
706 CBC HD
707 Citytv HD
708 CTV HD
709 CTV 2 HD
710 Yes TV HD
711 Today's Shopping Choice HD
712 CHCH HD
713 The Weather Network HD

Rogers Ignite New Channel Line-up

1 Radio-Canada HD
2 TVO HD
3 Global HD
4 Omni.1 HD
5 Omni.2 HD
6 CBC HD
7 Citytv HD
8 CTV HD
9 CTV 2 HD
10 Yes TV HD
11 Today's Shopping Choice HD
12 CHCH HD
13 The Weather Network HD

As mentioned in my previous comment, what they have done is eliminated the legacy dial positions for channels 2-99 and replaced them with what use to be channels 701-799
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post #50 of 64 (permalink) Old 2019-04-09, 09:59 AM
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If Ignite is the only TV service that Rogers offers in an area, they will have to allow you to subscribe to the Starter package for $25 without forcing you to buy any other services. I'm not sure if there is a CRTC rule that will force a company to unbundle all of their TV service, but I remember that they applied a lot of pressure to Bell to unbundle their Fibe IPTV service from internet.

Right now Rogers bundled price for Starter TV + internet + phone is $125.
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post #51 of 64 (permalink) Old 2019-04-09, 04:10 PM
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I agree. The $25 TV package is mandate by the CRTC. If the issue were to be pursued, I believe the CRTC would force Rogers to provide it without internet or phone. It's likely the CRTC would also require Rogers to allow internet service from a TPIA over the same cable since internet competition is also mandated.
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post #52 of 64 (permalink) Old 2019-04-10, 08:30 AM
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Yeah that brings up a interesting question...

Take for example the Ignite App. Works much like the Home Edition Anywhere TV used to.
When your on a ROGERS internet connection, it knows this, and allows you to stream ANY channel.
But when your on a different internet... only select ones.

If the ignite boxes worked much the same way.. wouldnt work on a TPIA?


They would have to change that.

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post #53 of 64 (permalink) Old 2019-04-10, 08:48 AM
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Rogers would have to provide their internet to operate the Ignite TV boxes at no additional charge since it's part of the TV service. They aren't obligated to provide internet service for additional apps, so those probably would be limited to "out of home" channels.

The customer could choose to have no land-line internet service or an additional internet service through a TPIA.

Rogers isn't allowed to operate their TV service on a TPIA.
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post #54 of 64 (permalink) Old 2019-04-10, 03:35 PM
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The Ignite TV service and internet would need to operate separately, as it now does with digital/MoCA TV and internet. Whether Rogers has this capability on their Ignite services is another issue. If they don't, whoever is responsible for that oversight should be fired, or at least have a very long talk with the CRTC about how they are going to make corrections. Simply detecting a device IP in order to determine availability of content is a totally different issue from separating TV and internet services if they are tightly integrated by design. Since Rogers Ignite services are based on a Comcast system which operates in an environment where TPIAs usually don't exist, it's a possibility.

It wouldn't be the first time the CRTC had to modify policies due to provider shortcomings. Simsub policy was changed due to shortcomings in Bell's satellite hardware and Bell's claim that it couldn't be modified to address the issues.
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post #55 of 64 (permalink) Old 2019-04-11, 08:26 AM
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I guess yeah.. they would have to provide a modem.. fully locked down.
Not able to be logged into (to set to bridge mode, etc).

More than likely, a hidden SSID, that the boxes would be set to directly talk to?
(I know the EARLY smarthome monitoring worked this way, there was a non advertised SSID which it connected to)


The main issue I would/could see then is... sure you could then get your own internet through a TPIA, but your going to start running into things like running two wireless networks. Having to make sure that there is no interference from one to the other, etc.

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post #56 of 64 (permalink) Old 2019-04-13, 01:16 PM Thread Starter
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You don't need to lock down the modem or hide the SSID etc. All Rogers really needs to do is put the modem in a different subnet that doesn't have access to the public internet. It would just get its DHCP address from a different pool than modems provisioned for Internet access.

With that being said, I had a conversation with Source Cable a few days ago and they did confirm that the only option for Hamilton customers is Rogers Ignite TV which is bundled with Internet. I'm not sure what that means for bulk cable customers which get cable service only. Source Cable has 15,000+ subscribers to migrate. I have no idea what percentage of subscribers have been migrated. My guess is they are targeting the ones that have TV + Internet service first. I'm really curious what they are planning for TV only customers which I'm sure is a significant amount of their customer base.
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post #57 of 64 (permalink) Old 2019-04-14, 09:41 PM
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There is no reason why Rogers could not provide TV without internet using their Ignite system. It's also likely that Rogers can provide Ignite TV in conjunction with a third party TPIA. They just don't want to in order to maximize revenue and profits. I believe that Bell has already been told not to require bundling so it's likely that Rogers would be told the same if a number of people were to file complaints with the CRTC. However, Rogers current internet pricing is not significantly higher than most TPIAs so there is not a big advantage to having a TPIA for internet with Ignite TV. That's especially true if bundle discounts apply.

As far as wifi is concerned, there is very little difference between having two services on one modem or having two services on the same channel using two modems. Wifi is designed to handle such situations. The only time issues arise is when one of the modems has very high bandwidth and doesn't obey the protocols. It could be an advantage if the two modems have their wifi set to different channels.
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post #58 of 64 (permalink) Old 2019-04-15, 09:07 AM
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I would beg to differ.
(and I work with some enterprise level stuff at work)

Having two modems, both broadcasting wifi, in the same general vicinity (especially if say both are installed at the same spot), and using the same channel, will most definitely interfere with each other.
Most modems now are set to AUTO, which are supposed to move the channel around as to not interfere... but most of them do a very poor job.
Separating them to opposite sides of the range, should help with that..
But still could get some interference, just due to their potential proximity.


Quite a number of years ago.. Was looking at some of the earlier wireless security cameras.
Plugged into your own wired connection, but the base was to set up their own wireless network to communicate with the cameras.
I was using a higher end ASUS bridged for my main wireless.. and the two wireless were a floor apart and 10+ft away. So no where near close enough.
Any time the camera system was plugged in.. it would kill the other wireless down to like 25% performance. No matter of changes of channels across the range, moving it, etc.. worked.


Personally, i just dont trust running the multiple wireless networks in that way. More chance of there being an issue.


The BEST would be to allow the boxes to run on ANY other connection.
(But that runs into a whole other gamut of other issues.. whats to prevent me from taking my box over to your house to watch it there, etc)

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post #59 of 64 (permalink) Old 2019-04-15, 05:55 PM
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I'm not saying they won't affect each other. What I am saying is that two modems on the same channel using AC protocol will share bandwidth reasonably well. It won't be much different than sending the two same streams over one router. Things like MIMO and beam forming may give a single router some advantage providing it's implemented well. Having the two separate routers on different non-overlapping channels will obviously provide an advantage.

Quote:
Quite a number of years ago..
What I said applies to AC or newer protocols. N will not be nearly as good and two G routers on the same channel would be a disaster. Having any G devices, especially things like streaming cameras, will kill available bandwidth as well.
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post #60 of 64 (permalink) Old 2019-04-15, 10:33 PM
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What I said applies to AC or newer protocols. N will not be nearly as good and two G routers on the same channel would be a disaster. Having any G devices, especially things like streaming cameras, will kill available bandwidth as well.
When configuring WiFi, enable only the lowest bandwidth you need. For example, these days, there's little need for G and B should be banned!

The APs have to listen to other traffic on the channel and then announce itself at the lowest speed heard. The same will also apply to other devices on the channel, so having G available, when everything is N results in a minor slowdown, as N will have to transmit the header at G rates, then shift up to N for the data. However, B, since it's completely incompatible with other types it requires G and better to transmit a B frame, advertising how long they plan to use the channel and then transmit at the higher rate. It is this extra B transmission that causes the significant slowdown, when B is present. My own access point is configured for N only, as every device I have supports it.

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