PBS HD Buffalo Ghosting & Other Issues - Page 4 - Canadian TV, Computing and Home Theatre Forums
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post #46 of 204 (permalink) Old 2006-07-28, 08:05 AM
 
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I have noticed that PBS (with Rogers) is one of the worst HD cannels out there. I tend to get dizzy watching it. I am not sure how to describe the issue but when the camera is moving or the subject is moving it is really blurry until it stops and then everything comes into focus. I thought it was a refresh rate issue but it happens on both of my tvs and does not happen with any other HD channel. Does anyone else notice this? I find it quite distracting.

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post #47 of 204 (permalink) Old 2006-07-28, 08:36 AM Thread Starter
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That is exactly the problem with WNED HD we are discussing.

The picture was still no better last night for me.

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post #48 of 204 (permalink) Old 2006-07-28, 08:47 AM
 
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Damn, I hate being the new guy. Didn't realize this was referred to as "ghosting", sorry.

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post #49 of 204 (permalink) Old 2006-07-28, 08:50 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason A
Damn, I hate being the new guy. Didn't realize this was referred to as "ghosting", sorry.

Jason
No need to apologize... 'ghosting' usually refers to a bad analogue TV reception. I couldn't think of a better descriptive word.

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post #50 of 204 (permalink) Old 2006-07-28, 10:33 AM
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Some people called it "smearing" and when it happens to a person's face, some people call it "Jello head". These descriptions were all discussed earlier in this thread, so, you may wish to review the thread from post 1 Jason A.

The "ghosting" can be easily seen on any camera panning, or movement. The picture of the shark in my previous post (45) shows an excellent example of ghosting (several ghosts in fact).

The Jello Head/smearing is shown in the Bruce Spingsteen photo. Both are shown in the second photo.

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post #51 of 204 (permalink) Old 2006-07-31, 10:26 PM
 
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i could even watch it tonight, horrible. Does anybody know if this is going to be rectified?
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post #52 of 204 (permalink) Old 2006-08-01, 09:52 AM
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Feedback from WNED:

Quote:
We have confirmed that this problem is originating from PBS. We have been able to capture the symptoms on tape coming directly from the PBS satellite feed, using several different satellite
receivers. We have contacted PBS and they were vaguely aware of the problem, but were under the impression that it had been rectified. They are now working on the issue, but please be aware that
these kind of problems can be extremely complex and it may take a while to sort it out on their end.

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post #53 of 204 (permalink) Old 2006-08-01, 09:55 AM Thread Starter
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Wow. Power of the press.

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post #54 of 204 (permalink) Old 2006-08-01, 01:11 PM
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Yea I have to agree in the last week I have noticed the smearing/ jellohead
problem on pbs a lot, the second segment of history dectives last night was virtually unwatchable on my set, I turned to another station just to make sure My set was ok, it was really really terrible picture quality worse then SD now that's bad.
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post #55 of 204 (permalink) Old 2006-08-01, 10:59 PM
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Arrow

I have seen the ghosting issue on WGBH Boston as well. 'Jello head' is quite common with *C due to the type of compression they use. I have only seen it with SD on *C, not HD. I wonder if PBS has changed their equipment or the amount/type of compression for HD.
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post #56 of 204 (permalink) Old 2006-08-02, 07:10 AM
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I have heard that PBS has changed the method of distribution of its signal to its stations resulting in these problems. WNED has complained to PBS and Rogers is aware of and monitoring the situation. Thats all the info I have.

I've got to say that the "HDTV Standard" sure takes a lot of abuse!!!!
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post #57 of 204 (permalink) Old 2006-08-03, 11:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 57
Some people called it "smearing" and when it happens to a person's face, some people call it "Jello head". The "ghosting" can be easily seen on any camera panning, or movement
Well..."Jello head" Train tonight on Soundstage. I watched it from WNED-HD via OTA, which confirms to me the point of origin is with PBS and not to the station. Pity, since Soundstage is usually a pristine presentation.
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post #58 of 204 (permalink) Old 2006-08-04, 02:11 PM
 
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Wow, 57, those are heinous artifacts in your photos! That's appalling!

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post #59 of 204 (permalink) Old 2006-08-04, 02:23 PM
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You don't actually notice them that much when you're watching the programme. Your brain just sort of gets seasick, unless you focus and look for the artifact.

Those photos were (obviously) the worst frames in a programme for demonstration purposes. The frames next to those could be relatively clear... See example below of similar frames, one poor, one clear:

The overall effect though is that you get the "jello head" and nauseous feeling when watching these programmes, along with ghosting.

The interesting thing is that there used to be macroblocking on these programmes, instead we now get this "ghosting/smearing".

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post #60 of 204 (permalink) Old 2006-08-08, 03:09 PM
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Spoke to the enginner at WNED today.

The head engineer was very nice, he did confirm that from late last week they were expermenting with the 1280x1080i format.

He said since a lot of HD tv's are only 1280x720p and he made reference to plasma and lcd that are only up to 1280x768p they wanted to see if there was any change in quality when they broadcast at the lower resolution.

He said it uses a lot less processing power. What I dont understand if they were already doing 1920x1080i what does WNED save? Does he mean less hydro to process the siganls(equipments)??

The weird thing he said nobody before me called to complain/enquire, I was the first. I was explaining there ane many different tuners/tv out there and some cannot process the new format properly and a few cusitmers called to say the screen format looked squeezed.

I said I belong to a Canadian board they lots of people are aware of the change in quality and I said they even dedicated a few threads to WNED. He said that on the shows that shows PBS HD in the corner of the screen there is no alteration of the signals ?

I gave him the example I have 5 tuner/tv setup and all process the new format but with a softer and lower quality picture and at my office the Sanyo the picture is distorted.

The best thing he said since I called, he would be switching the format back up to the full 1920x1080i by some time tonight. He said you cant have his viewers have bad signal feeds

By the way he said that they were still trying/working to fix the upconverted sd to hd quality with Central Pbs.

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Last edited by Yaamon; 2006-08-08 at 03:20 PM.
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