Sale of Android boxes To Obtain "Free TV" Is Now Illegal In Canada. - Page 7 - Canadian TV, Computing and Home Theatre Forums

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post #91 of 788 (permalink) Old 2017-02-13, 05:47 PM
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Originally Posted by bev fan View Post
Most of the people pay for the tv or streaming service but they just do not advertise it on forums liked his one.
Pirates on the other hand love to cry how mistreated they are by the BDU's but it is nothing else then just trying to justify the piracy.
They are doing it because down inside they know that what they are doing is wrong and having bunch of excuses somehow in their eyes makes it right and helps them fall asleep at night.
Not just that but if you disagree with them for any reason, because you were brought up with proper morals and learnt to pay for things you want, these people quickly resort to name calling and think you either work for the government or work for a tv network and call you a shill and they can't understand that there are people out there who DON'T do what they are doing.
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post #92 of 788 (permalink) Old 2017-02-13, 05:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Paolo View Post
Well that totally depends on where you get your feed from, do you get it directly from BEIN ie: BEIN CONNECT? or do you get it from your service provider such as Rogers, Bell, Shaw, Telus? I get mine from my service provider so I use their app on my phone/tablet and tune into the channel and it looks great
No it does not and also should not.

I respected your experience as being different from my experience. Please show the same courtesy. All paying customers with sufficient bandwidth (as evidenced by the excellent quality of other feeds) should receive a first class feed.
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post #93 of 788 (permalink) Old 2017-02-13, 08:04 PM
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I agree that the Canadian telecom industry is a mess, and that customers have been gouged for years by the incumbents. There is content that is not available here in a reasonable way. Will I resort to dishonest means to view it? No, I'll go without. It is only entertainment.
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post #94 of 788 (permalink) Old 2017-02-13, 09:41 PM
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The last time I wanted something not available in Canada, I shipped it through an agency that was able to purchase it for me. So I paid extra for their service.

With these Android boxes, a lot of times you don't have to pay, but you still like receiving the content, so you do it - you don't wait for approvals by agencies in Canada or just go without it - life's too short for that. I also use the box to get clean streams of games through subscriptions that I pay for like NFL Game Pass and a DNS server - this way everything is on one device and I don't have to put up with simsubs for any NFL game.

I can still sleep morally at night, even though I might be watching / receiving some stuff I shouldn't. I have broken the law before too in the real world and received parking tickets, but all in all, I can live with myself. And so can many I know - I've bought tons of boxes for others of late, all upstanding citizens with various jobs in life.
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post #95 of 788 (permalink) Old 2017-02-13, 09:59 PM
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Originally Posted by bev fan View Post
Well, Netflix has different content for each country where it is available so I do not know what's your point. This is how competition works. To have access to American Netflix you would basically have to move to the states if you feel that you have to have it.
I would still like to hear some examples of content that is available in USA but not available in Canada by legal means.

I am not American and love Canada the way it is, and do not need the American way of life interfere in every aspect of my life.
Respectfully, I think you're confusing a couple of concepts: Most significant of which is, just because the "American way of life" is AVAILABLE, doesn't mean you have to participate in it. You can always "turn it off"......or, just don't turn it on!

Whereas, MY argument is that there's no reason why the owners of the digital rights to the "US-only" portion of Netflix' inventory couldn't work out a deal with Netflix for distribution in Canada; they're just too lazy to do it because the 'market' isn't big enough.

And when you say, "This is how competition works"'re not pretending for a minute that my cable provider's On Demand offering represented ANYTHING remotely resembling Netflix, are you? There WAS no competition for Netflix.......and Netflix' Canadian offering was an anemic shadow of their American product.
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post #96 of 788 (permalink) Old 2017-02-14, 10:10 AM
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Do you really believe that they're too lazy? They're so terrible at running their business that they just can't be bothered to collect revenue? Netflix wants global rights to everything they offer. If they just couldn't be bothered with worrying about Canada, why would they not collect whatever Netflix is willing to give them in addition to their US deal? So, either they want more money than Netflix is willing to pay or they've sold the Canadian rights somewhere else. Laziness is not a factor.

There are two kinds of "unavailable" here. The first, with which I sympathize with people who look for alternative ways of finding content, is stuff that is simply not available, for any amount of money, legally in Canada. This is still common for current events shows, but extremely rare at this point for scripted shows. For example, you're a huge Mets fan, and you have an subscription to watch their games, but you really love watching the pre and post-game shows and you want to watch a weekly catch-up Mets show that only airs in New York. There's no way to get that here without at a minimum resorting to grey market solutions like slingboxes or VPNs.

I even have a little bit of sympathy for the notion that sometimes our telecoms play dirty with content to try to strong-arm consumers into models that don't work for them. The new Star Trek show is a great example of this. CBS is going to be offering it up on their streaming only service. Netflix has international distribution rights for everywhere but Canada and the US and will be making it available at the same time as CBS. Bell bought the Canadian rights, and hasn't given details on how they plan on distributing it yet. They have a streaming service, and if they put it up on Crave at the same time as Netflix and CBS, then there's no excuse for anyone to not just pay for Crave if they really want it. However, if they delay it by months in order to try to force fans into subscribing to Space, then I can understand why people would try to change their Netflix region to UK instead. Personally, I'll just wait for it to be available legitimately, but I get why the super-fan doesn't see waiting months or paying $40+/month just to watch Star Trek (with commercials and on Space's schedule) as viable options.

But, the vast, vast majority of stuff that people pirate is available legally and legitimately here in Canada. Not everything should be available on Netflix for $10/month. If your excuse is that you don't want to pay $10 for Netflix and $8 for Crave and buy the occasional show individually, well, that I have no sympathy for. This stuff shouldn't be free. Pay for the things you value.

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post #97 of 788 (permalink) Old 2017-02-14, 02:36 PM
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While i do have an android box, I do also pay for my TV subscription.
Mostly use it to catch up on things i forgot to PVR, not easily on on demand, etc.

I Know quite a few which are android only..
And I do often hear the argument "Why would you pay for cable when you can use this?" "no one should be paying for it anymore" etc.

I think many of these people do not realize, that the content creators, all get money back from the tv companies buying the channels, etc.

With no money IN.. they have no money to CREATE the content.

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post #98 of 788 (permalink) Old 2017-02-14, 02:38 PM
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it is, imho, a great shame that during the FTA and later NAFTA negotiations that the whole of North America was not made into one copyright zone... that may not be the right term. That all content licensed anywhere in NA was licensed for both countries. I am sure the Canadian media companies and Maude Barlow would have gone berserk but life would be so much simpler now!
I wonder if that could be a tweak for Trump when dealing with Canada on NAFTA

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post #99 of 788 (permalink) Old 2017-02-14, 04:12 PM
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Why should rights be sold on a territorial basis at all? It is an outdated model.

These same global businesses could just as easily market their content to individuals on a global basis.

Get rid of the non-value added, inefficient, incompetent middlemen.
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post #100 of 788 (permalink) Old 2017-02-16, 09:25 AM
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Because delivery models operate on a regional basis. Really, Netflix is the only one trying to be truly global at scale with a subscription model, and if your only customer is Netflix, you don't exactly have much leverage when negotiating rights fees.

Of course the content creators could sell directly to consumers, but they don't want to do that for the same reason most content re-sellers don't want to go global - the economics don't work. Keep in mind that it's not as simple as allowing anyone to access your existing service. To be a global service that works at scale, you need to do all kinds of localization and language support. Differences in content are not the only reason Netflix localizes support. And if you're not getting ancillary benefits like bundling with your existing services in the region, then the value proposition for smaller regions drops dramatically.

And even if we put aside the fact that these creators often have extremely valuable relationships with cable/IPTV providers that they need to protect, that still ignores the most obvious reason why content studios don't sell directly: infrastructure. Most consumers don't want to watch by going to a website and paying to download AVI files. They want a simple streaming experience that works with their existing TV equipment. And they don't want two dozen janky apps that each have one show they're interested in. If you're one of the big players like Disney then maybe you can pull that off and compete with Netflix, but Sony has been trying something like that for years with Crackle and it has largely failed. And if Sony can't pull it off, how would you expect a small studio to do so?

I don't disagree that many of these distributors are doing a bad job on things that should be obvious. I think the Crave app is still bug-ridden and full of terrible interface paradigms. But, I've also subscribed to the Adult Swim streaming service directly from them, and their app is at least as bad, so that's not a solution either. In that case, I desperately wished Netflix was acting as a middle-man with their quality software delivering Adult Swim's content.

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post #101 of 788 (permalink) Old 2017-02-16, 10:05 AM
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The bottom line is that content owners want regionalism and they base their business model on it. Even DVDs and BDs, that are sold globally by the studios, are marketed regionally. That way they can sell a movie for $1 in Asia, where they are trying to eliminate a serious piracy problem due to weak copyright laws, and $20 in NA and Europe where they know the market will bear it.

Competition for rights in countries like Canada inflate the price of content while countries with less competition get it cheaper. The fault is our own for creating an environment with rich broadcasters that bid up royalties and pass the costs on to consumers with impunity. As much as I like services like Netflix, we have to realize that it plays into the studios' business model of driving up prices by creating more competition for a product that has limited supply. The only positive it that Netflix puts pressure on Canadian broadcasters to compete at the low end of the market. As long has Canadian broadcasters have a majority market share, studios will act as a cartel to inflate prices in Canada.
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post #102 of 788 (permalink) Old 2017-02-16, 12:36 PM
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While we don't stream as we already have too much stuff to watch with paying for two satellite subscriptions I do like the idea of getting content from the source and purchase keeper shows & movies on BD & UBD. I find myself deleting more shows & timers of the DVR and just buying each season on BD. So I can get the appeal of the android box and know people that use them. I won't be one of them.
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post #103 of 788 (permalink) Old 2017-02-18, 11:05 AM
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I don't know if I am posting in the correct thread, but I am pretty sure I have the correct forum. The question I have is about Informir IPTV boxes. I saw a demo of one in a candy store, but could not get any good information from the salesperson. I googled the Infomir boxes and found out they are sold at Wintronics and Angel Electronics, both stores in the GTA. The other information I found out online is that the subscriptions for the IPTV service accessed by these boxes is $15/mo (also told to me at the candy store). The IPTV that is being accessed seems to be a reselling of US satellite services. Is this legal in Canada? How do the boxes hook up to your TV? seems to be a provider. Does anyone know anything about these boxes and services? Do they work through a Roku box, which I have?
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post #104 of 788 (permalink) Old 2017-02-18, 05:31 PM
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This is illegal and the link to the boxes appears to be an "infected or attack" site. Anything this inexpensive for something that others need to pay $100+/mo for is going to be illegal and often a concern for malware, etc.

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post #105 of 788 (permalink) Old 2017-02-20, 11:44 AM
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Thanks for the info.
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