Bell Fibe TV app - Page 6 - Canadian TV, Computing and Home Theatre Forums

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post #76 of 155 (permalink) Old 2017-12-23, 10:51 AM
 
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Question TV everywhere

Not sure if this is the proper place for this but last night I was at a friend’s place to watch the Habs and Flames game on RDS. My friend is a Bell Fibe customer.

During a Bell Fibe commercial, viewers are being told they can now watch their Fibe TV channels, including recordings, on any device of their choice. So far, no problem.

What really got my ears buzzing was when they added : “from anywhere in the world!”

Now as far back as I can remember, the common opinion expressed in this Shaw Direct forum is that there is a supposed “law” that forbids this. We also know that Bell Express Vu Satellite TV no longer covers the US because they voluntarily restricted the footprints of their birds several years ago. Not to mention they would immediately terminate service once they found out someone was using it outside Canada.

But now Bell is advertising Fibe customers can view their channels from anywhere in the world??? This would not be the first case of false advertisement coming from Bell’s marketing dep’t.

So the questions are:

1- has anyone in this forum heard if this Bell Fibe claim to view from outside Canada is indeed true?

2- if the answer to 2 is yes, then can someone tell us WTH is going on here?

I know that Shaw’s own Free Range TV does not work outside Canada because I actually tried it. As a Shaw Direct customer, I would want to know why Bell Fibe says they can offer this feature and SD Free Range cannot? 😧
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post #77 of 155 (permalink) Old 2017-12-23, 12:25 PM
 
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Excellent post, goalsgo. I will venture a couple of guesses: The copy writer of the ad did not know about geographical copyright restrictions or only Bell Media content is available "world-wide" via ??? internet ???

Most likely is that the ad is a mistake.
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post #78 of 155 (permalink) Old 2017-12-23, 01:15 PM
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@goalsgo I had my doubts about that ad, so I searched YouTube and found it (or one similar.) You were mostly right. However the ad is about watching recorded shows that are on your Fibe TV PVR.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZUNm2wBB4c

If you listen carefully the ad says that you can watch your recorded shows anywhere in the world. My guess is that Bell is taking advantage of a loophole in the geographic restrictions because the program is on your Fibe PVR which is tied to a physical address in Canada. Viewing on-demand programming or live TV is still restricted to Canada. Watching recorded programs only applies to Fibe TV and not Bell Satellite.

Here is the post about the feature if you want to read more about it. Note there were a few posts about problems until the service was fully rolled out.
http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/188-...ml#post2928258

The Shaw Free Range app doesn't have the feature to watch programs that are recorded on your PVR.
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post #79 of 155 (permalink) Old 2017-12-23, 03:24 PM
 
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Thank you Dr Dave. Your point is well taken and I did hear it on the you tube link.

Having said that, if you look at Bell’s Fibe website, it is clearly stated that it is possible to watch up to 400 live channels and on demand TV “on the go” and PVR recordings from “anywhere”. There is absolutely no condition or fine print disclaimer (that I could find) that says this is possible “only” within Canada.

Now to me as a consumer, this is quite misleading because “on the go” does not imply only in Canada. Even less when I see the word “anywhere”. Hence my contention that Bell is engaging in deceptive and false advertising. We are part of the several million Canadians who happen to travel internationally for whom this service would be manna from heaven. But what is Bell’s objective with being deliberately foggy on this issue? Why not come out clearly and say “Only in Canada”?

To spice things up a little bit here, I just spoke with a customer service supervisor at Bell and although the ad clearly states that PVR recordings can be watched from anywhere in the world, he told me that even that is not possible: only within Canada.

That’s why I was wondering if someone had experienced the service from outside Canada to see what is in fact possible with the app.

I’m not sure I understand the difference between not allowing to watch a live TV program but allowing the recording of that same TV program to be seen from outside Canada. At the end of the day, it still is the same program albeit on a time delay basis which is the reason why people PVR programs anyway.
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post #80 of 155 (permalink) Old 2017-12-23, 03:57 PM
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As an FYI, the Rogers FAQ regarding "Anyplace TV" is quite clear in the first pulldown of the following link. Bolding is mine:

https://www.rogers.com/customer/supp...ce-tv-overview

Quote:
Anyplace TV is a free service lets you watch sports, news, shows, movies and more, live or on demand wherever you are in Canada. Access your guide, channels, favourite shows and movies all in one place.
Just as an additional FYI, we cannot (yet?) stream anything from our PVRs. I believe it used to be that Anyplace was only available in your home for streaming, TV channels, and OD, but that has changed to Canada. I never used it myself outside my home, but I'll see what happens the next time I travel. I use Anyplace mostly for the guide, to schedule, and check scheduled recordings, for my PVRs.

Now, back to your original programming...

57's Home Theatre (Latest equipment & photos)
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post #81 of 155 (permalink) Old 2017-12-23, 09:59 PM
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@goalsgo I moved your post to this thread since we are getting into the nuts and bolts of this feature. Here is confirmation from July that you can watch your recordings from outside the country. At the time I thought it was a glitch, but it makes perfect sense in light of the ad your heard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nacholibre View Post
I'm away in Colombia this week and just logged into the FibeTv app on my iPad to try this out. Some interesting observations:
1) Unable to view live TV outside of Canada, even when using a VPN. This is normal behaviour from previous travel experience.
2) I'm able to watch my recordings. No VPN required. This includes all Movie Network/HBO recordings. I'm not sure if this is a mistake on their end and something they'll change in the future, but great that it currently works when you're Outside of Canada.
I agree they should specify on the sales page that live TV and on-demand are limited to Canada. I found this FAQ earlier in the support section (had a hard time finding it again.) It looks like it hasn't been updated for recorded TV.

Bell TV app FAQs
Quote:
2. Q: Can I use the Bell TV app outside of Canada?
A: No. The content is restricted for use in Canada only.
Source: http://support.bell.ca/Styles/tv/all...ere-FAQ-EN.pdf


Quote:
I’m not sure I understand the difference between not allowing to watch a live TV program but allowing the recording of that same TV program to be seen from outside Canada. At the end of the day, it still is the same program albeit on a time delay basis which is the reason why people PVR programs anyway.
I can understand live TV and on-demand being limited by geography - those are being transmitted to everyone by the TV provider (Bell.) I can only guess about the recordings, but it might be because you've recorded that specific program for your own personal viewing and you are allowed to watch it anywhere in the world. The equivalent to recording a program on your Sony Betamax VCR and packing the cassette in your luggage.
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post #82 of 155 (permalink) Old 2017-12-24, 09:58 AM
 
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Thanks for the research here. Based on the post from nacholibre it appears possible to view recordings from outside Canada. It is confusing however that both the Bell FAQ’s and the Supervisor I spoke to yesterday say “only in Canada”.

We will be traveling to warmer climes in January with my Bell Fibe friend so I will experience it firsthand and report back on this forum.

I like your analogy of the Beta tape, not the least because I still have a Betamax machine!! 🤣. Without wanting to start a philosophical debate here, I’m still puzzled at the restriction for watching live TV.

You suggest a possible reason is the fact live TV is being broadcast to everyone by the provider. But when I watch live TV in my living room, I am making a very personal choice and that choice really has nothing to do with the fact that millions of other people are able to watch at the same time. The same reasoning would apply when I decide to record a program: it is a simple personal choice. So why would one personal choice be restricted and the other one not?

Another way to look at it is when Fibe came out, both live TV and recordings were restricted. What happened since then for Bell to lift the restriction on recordings? It could have been a technical issue but I am very doubtful: the internet is the internet.

If I owned a sports bar in Florida and used the Fibe app to make money for my business by attracting snowbirds then yes, bring out the restrictions. But personal viewing?

In the end, these types of issues always boil down to dollars $$$, in this case advertising for the broadcasters. But here again, if I am a cable or Fibe subscriber in Montreal and I tune in to any US station, I get to see whatever ads are being shown to the local US tv viewers, not substituted Canadian ads. The same for any US cable subscriber who can watch Canadian stations: they are not seeing US ads but the ones seen by Canadian viewers. So I fail to see why satellite or Fibe internet apps would be restricted because of advertising concerns. Perhaps you have some insights you could share with us?
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post #83 of 155 (permalink) Old 2017-12-24, 10:40 AM
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Bell provides service as any other provider only in Canada. Same goes for American providers where they can not provide their service in Canada or other countries.
If you really wanted to watch Bell Fibe in the states, probably you can do it using VPN but you will have to find out which one will work with Bell Fibe TV app.
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post #84 of 155 (permalink) Old 2017-12-24, 12:15 PM
 
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@bev fan

I agree with your statements.

My initial post yesterday was to bring to light what at best seems to be very confusing information coming from Bell itself regarding what people can expect when they use the Fibe TV app.

The issue is Bell Fibe’s website does not indicate anywhere that their app only works in Canada. Their TV ad even says you can use it to view your recordings from anywhere in the world, meaning there is no need for VPN. The way they advertise their app easily leads someone to think the app can be used for viewing both live TV and recordings from outside Canada.

We do not currently subscribe to Bell Fibe and because we travel a lot, the ability to watch live TV and recordings from abroad with the app would be a determining factor for us to become subscribers. But before doing that, we simply wanted to get a straight answer on what exactly the app would allow us to do from abroad. We are not lawyers who know the intricate details of TV broadcasting, nor should we have to as TV consumers.

So yesterday I called Bell to get that answer. I spoke to a first line agent and then a supervisor and they both confirmed to me that it is NOT possible to view either live TV or recordings from outside Canada. We were left with the impression that their marketing was very misleading with regards to their Fibe app. Both these agents could be wrong, but the fact is we have no way of knowing if they are or not and we are trying to decide on becoming subscribers.

Dr. Dave yesterday quoted from Rogers’ website where they clearly state that their app only works from Canada. Bell does not. To me this is misleading and possibly false advertising and that is clearly not allowed.
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post #85 of 155 (permalink) Old 2017-12-24, 12:48 PM
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It is neither misleading nor false advertising. It does not say anywhere that Bell Fibe TV is available outside of Canada.
Plus Bell advertisers that their service is available anywhere. If they said everywhere maybe then you could be right about false advertising.
Again good VPN would probably work.
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post #86 of 155 (permalink) Old 2017-12-24, 01:22 PM
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I've listen to the ad and nowhere does it state you can get channels anywheere. It clearly state RECORED" programs you have on your PVR.

1,2,3 Come Party With Me 3,4,5 Kept The Spirit Alive 1,2,3 I'm Feeling So Free 3,4,5 Keep The Party Alive
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post #87 of 155 (permalink) Old 2017-12-24, 01:27 PM
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just use sling box in my humble opinion. i watched live tv from the states, watched my pvr recordings, and even streamed my security camera from the usa,
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post #88 of 155 (permalink) Old 2017-12-24, 05:39 PM
 
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Thank you all for your responses.

Apparently Sling Box is no longer manufacturing units for sale so that option will soon disappear.
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post #89 of 155 (permalink) Old 2017-12-27, 09:59 AM
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I found 4 different sources of info for the Fibe app on the Bell site and I put the links in post 1.

Quote:
Originally Posted by goalsgo View Post
I like your analogy of the Beta tape, not the least because I still have a Betamax machine!!. Without wanting to start a philosophical debate here, I’m still puzzled at the restriction for watching live TV.

You suggest a possible reason is the fact live TV is being broadcast to everyone by the provider. But when I watch live TV in my living room, I am making a very personal choice and that choice really has nothing to do with the fact that millions of other people are able to watch at the same time. The same reasoning would apply when I decide to record a program: it is a simple personal choice. So why would one personal choice be restricted and the other one not?

Another way to look at it is when Fibe came out, both live TV and recordings were restricted. What happened since then for Bell to lift the restriction on recordings? It could have been a technical issue but I am very doubtful: the internet is the internet.
The difference between live TV and recordings is that live TV is licensed by the content owners (usually U.S. studios) to be broadcast only in an individual country. So you can make a personal choice to watch a program in your living room or anywhere else in Canada, but you can't choose to watch the program outside of Canada, since the station isn't authorized to transmit the program outside the country. Bell's ability as a TV provider to transmit the program is governed by the station's licence agreement with the content owner. Bell was able to negotiate additional digital rights with some stations to transmit the programs outside the home where the subscription is authorized (on the go,) but only within Canada. Similar rights apply to On Demand programs.

The reason I chose Sony Betamax is because of the famous U.S. Supreme Court case which decided that recording a program on a VCR for personal use was not a violation of copyright. Either Bell negotiated additional rights to transmit a facsimile of a recording that is physically present on your PVR in Canada or their lawyers are basing the worldwide rights on prior case law involving VCR recording.

Quote:
Dr. Dave yesterday quoted from Rogers’ website where they clearly state that their app only works from Canada. Bell does not. To me this is misleading and possibly false advertising and that is clearly not allowed.
Just for clarification, in post 81 I quoted Bell's web site which says the Fibe TV app is limited to Canada.

It's not surprising that the front-line agents and even the supervisors aren't up to date on the fact that recordings can be viewed anywhere in the world.
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post #90 of 155 (permalink) Old 2017-12-27, 12:26 PM
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There is a fundamental difference between broadcasting content and watching a recording of that content. The analysis regarding broadcasting is quite correct in that stations and BDUs are not allowed to transmit copyrighted programming outside the granted geographical area. However, once a recording is made then a completely different set of rules apply that are similar to owning a (somewhat restricted) physical copy of that programming. Under those rules, the "owner" of the copy has no limitations on where they may view it, only on how.
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