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post #76 of 238 (permalink) Old 2010-09-09, 07:11 PM
 
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One more moon shot

Hey Jim,

I think I've got it figured.

101 deg = 163.6 T @ 30.6 Elevation
111.1 deg = 168.4 T @ 31.3 Elevation

September 20th
Start of Arc: 21:26 (BC Time) 159 True AZ @ 25 deg EL
Under 101: 21:38 163 True AZ @ 26 deg EL
Under 111.1: 21:59 168 True AZ @ 27 deg EL

September 21st
Start of Arc: 22:13 160 True AZ @ 30 deg 41’ EL
Above 101: 22:25 163 deg 36’ AZ @ 31 deg 18’ EL
Above 111.1 : 22:41 168 deg 9’ AZ @ 32 deg EL

September 22nd
Above 101: 23:09 163 deg 25’ AZ @ 36 deg 26’ EL
Above 111.1: 23:24 169 deg 10’ AZ @ 37 deg 5’ EL

I included a "start of arc" when you should probably be out looking already. You can see by the numbers that there isn't an exact match, but it starts out on the 20th under the target (meaning if you have a clear view of the moon that satellites should be easy) - on the 21st very near the targets and on the 22nd a little above the targets.

I never checked the moon phase on the 20th, but at least it's at night time.
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post #77 of 238 (permalink) Old 2010-09-10, 09:02 AM
 
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Found Moon Phase Data

Moon will be FULL on the 22/23 -- nearly full on the dates above. This looks like the best chance of all the attempts: night time, with a full moon. I sure hope you make it up there and the weather cooperates.
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post #78 of 238 (permalink) Old 2010-09-10, 09:35 AM
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Underground, even in conduit, is considered wet. Getting flooded coax is the best to counter that. Or at least get an underground grade RG6.
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post #79 of 238 (permalink) Old 2010-09-10, 08:25 PM Thread Starter
 
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Classicsat,

Thanks. I passed it along to my Brother in Law who is supposed to be getting the Cable wholesale through a friend of his down the lake who's a contractor.

Regards,
Jim
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post #80 of 238 (permalink) Old 2010-09-11, 09:11 AM
 
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Hi Jim,

Just a thought. If you had a nighttime shot of the sky of a known date and time, in which a couple of planets or stars are recognizable, we could do a sort of overlay.


http://i998.photobucket.com/albums/a...psTestShot.jpg
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post #81 of 238 (permalink) Old 2010-09-11, 11:37 PM Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tico View Post
Hi Jim,

Just a thought. If you had a nighttime shot of the sky of a known date and time, in which a couple of planets or stars are recognizable, we could do a sort of overlay.


http://i998.photobucket.com/albums/a...psTestShot.jpg
Tico,

I don't really have any night photos of the Mountain (Harper) behind the Cabin. Perhaps if one of my brother's who's into photography a bit goes up soon I'll ask him.

Regards,
Jim
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post #82 of 238 (permalink) Old 2010-09-12, 12:15 AM Thread Starter
 
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Cool

Oksat, Moose, Tico, or ?

I forgot to ask about grounding this system. It seems superfluous to do anything at the Dish, especially if we mount it on a Steel Pole. (It will certainly be grounded by nature.) Lightning stikes are a rarity in the valleys around here as the trees up the mountains take almost all the hits. Is there anything in the national electric code on this type of application? ( I plan to install a whole house surge supressor in the main electrical panel.)

But what should I do when the cables get to the house?
I'm either going to mount a lot of the Hardware on an outside wall in some sort of Box, or possibly inside an insulated, but at time unheated, garage (where the Boats are in the winter). I've seen ground block type couplers that I could use, and run a ground wire to a common point to avoid circular ground currents. But then insertion losses increase which I'd like to avoid.



I bought the Philips SDW5058 Satellite Multiswitch primarily because it was 5X8 and outdoor rated. Whereas the Eagle Aspen version was indoor rated only. It comes with the typical isolated (ungrounded) wall wort type AC power supply. I went to Princess Auto and bought the last Phillips SWD5058/17 5X8 Multiswitch on the shelf. I didn’t want to wait in case it sold out.

It was listed for $39.99 but with a sale sticker for $36.01. I noticed when I got outside, the net after tax was $35.85 so I checked the bill, and it scanned in at $32.01 plus taxes. The cashier said I could return it if I didn’t like it anytime as long as it’s not worn...(Sounds better than Costco -and a lot cheaper than SD!)





I then went to Home Depot and bough 50 Ideal RG6 Quad F connectors in a plastic bottle. They have a long shank after the compression point and a ¼” or so flat gasket inside where the cable exits the connector. I think these are pricey little buggers => $45 for 50 connectors. I hope our compression tool works with them??? I'm going to cover them with (heat) shrink tubing.

Then I got home and tried to find out if these Ideal 92-650 connectors were the right ones on the Web, and stumble across these on eBay - 100 for $14 => so I bought them. It they have the same gasket I’ll return the Home Depot ones. If not I’ve got lots of cheap inventory for inside connectors. You may want some too!

Just Google "100 qty Ideal Coax Cable F-Connectors Crimp-on RG-6 Q"

Regards,
Jim

Last edited by Jimsathome; 2010-09-12 at 01:04 AM. Reason: bad link
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post #83 of 238 (permalink) Old 2010-09-12, 01:00 AM
 
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I tried fixing the ebay link but it doesn't work. I have a feeling that ebaY links aren't allowed on this forum.
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post #84 of 238 (permalink) Old 2010-09-12, 01:06 AM Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ae_collector View Post
I tried fixing the ebay link but it doesn't work. I have a feeling that ebaY links aren't allowed on this forum.
Sorry, I didn't realise eBay links aren't allowed. I edited it out. Now just Google "100 qty Ideal Coax Cable F-Connectors Crimp-on RG-6 Q" if you are interested.

Regards,
Jim
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post #85 of 238 (permalink) Old 2010-09-12, 01:55 PM
 
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The multiswitch should have a ground point on it. Or you can make one with the 5th input (antenna) going to your ground block if you like. AFAIK there is no electrical code governing this - just look at the installations that the so called installation techs do. I've never seen a "professional" Bell or Shaw installation that is grounded. Cable co's usually have decent grounding. One extra barrel connection is not going to be a big deal for insertion losses, but I understand the desire to "do it right".

$0.75 to $1.00 is about right for quality compression fittings. You shouldn't need to heat shrink them unless you have an outdoor or buried splice - but some dielectric grease is a good idea.
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post #86 of 238 (permalink) Old 2010-09-12, 07:59 PM
 
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I realize that you are in Canada, so the following may, or may not, apply to you. But here are a couple of links that explain the "correct" (according to the NEC in the US) way to ground a satellite dish.

If this information doesn't discourage you from grounding your dish, nothing will....

Several installers I talked to (but would likely NOT hire to do an install) told me that they never ground a dish unless they are doing an install for a satellite service that requires it.

I didn't ground mine because the dish is on the opposite side of the house from the main ground ,and because there is no way on this earth that a seven-foot steel rod can be driven in the Arizona soil. Following the install, I had a few sleepless nights, and then promptly forgot about grounding it. I have never had a problem. But that's not to say I never will......

http://www.mikeholt.com/mojonewsarch...s~20020303.htm

http://www.sadoun.com/Sat/Installation/Grounding.htm
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post #87 of 238 (permalink) Old 2010-09-13, 12:44 AM Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tico View Post
The multiswitch should have a ground point on it. Or you can make one with the 5th input (antenna) going to your ground block if you like. AFAIK there is no electrical code governing this - just look at the installations that the so called installation techs do. I've never seen a "professional" Bell or Shaw installation that is grounded. Cable co's usually have decent grounding. One extra barrel connection is not going to be a big deal for insertion losses, but I understand the desire to "do it right".

$0.75 to $1.00 is about right for quality compression fittings. You shouldn't need to heat shrink them unless you have an outdoor or buried splice - but some dielectric grease is a good idea.
Gents,

tico's comment twigged my memory. I know an Admin at a Forum (Optical-Edge.net) I Mod who now works as an installer for a Bell contractor in New Brunswick. I asked him and he said they always ground their systems if possible (3rd floor apartment buildings and like don't cut it). I've now asked him for details.

I found the ground screw (cheesy) on the Phillips Multiswitch (thanks for the tip tico). I'll use it in whatever grounding scheme gets used. I remembered the Cable supplier at the Cabin (Lake Broadcasting Corp) doesn't ground it's cables at all.

(Just for grins I decided to check my Roger's /Shaw Cable install here at home, and it's using a grounding block similar to the one I posted above => at the point of first entry into the box on the side of the house. The ground wire disappears behind the siding, and I can't tell where it's tagged into, but the electrical panel /meter base which is less than a foot away doesn't have a stray ground inside; so it must be connected to the Case somewhere.)

The references listed on Joshuals links typically show only one cable coming from a dish and not all 4 from a Quad LNB. Is there intent to ground just one cable and assume the rest of the system is protected by that? Or do you ground all 4 cables with 4 blocks?

Regards,
Jim
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post #88 of 238 (permalink) Old 2010-09-13, 07:48 AM
 
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I don't think the grounding is for lightning but I remember reading it is to prevent buildup of static charges
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post #89 of 238 (permalink) Old 2010-09-15, 11:16 PM Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smp01 View Post
I don't think the grounding is for lightning but I remember reading it is to prevent buildup of static charges
One of the definite benefits of grounding electrical apparatus is to limit the damage Lightning can cause by providing a diect pathway for fault currents. It also limits damage from failures in upstream transformers and incorrect switching by Utilities putting the wrong voltage on powerlines. That's why proper grounding is required by almost all Electrical Codes. (I'm a licenced Electrician although I haven't used it in ages.)

The static discharge, and noise dissapation are good side benefits.

Regards,
Jim
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post #90 of 238 (permalink) Old 2010-09-16, 10:23 AM
 
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Another thing about grounding - there will be a change in electrical "ground" or "neutral" potential between two separated points. A 100' piece of wire running from your basement to your roof will have a couple of micro or nano amps running through it. Grounding the system at many locations to a common ground will prevent these "ground loops" and microcurrents from building up and traveling over the signal path of the coax. Grounding the same component (like grounding all 4 lines of the LNB) isn't going to be as useful as ensuring that there are good, common grounds at each end (and potentially in the middle). The body of the LNB and that of the multiswitch will serve as a "ground sharing" between the multiple coaxes.

The worst case would be a completely ungrounded antenna system that runs to a TV (also ungrounded) that then finally connects to a grounded cable system or X-Box or sound system etc. Now you are forcing the current to flow through the HDMI, component, or composite video connections to find a ground through the chassis of the TV.
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