video graphics/3D card

[bolmsted]

I currently have an IBM PIII 866MHz system that came with a fairly decent Nvidia Mach64 TNT2 card with TVout (svideo) support and fairly good at most stuff/low end games.

About a year ago (yeah I'm not a major gamer but I would like to start playing more role/strategic games) I purchased the Spiderman and Dungeon Seige games for fairly cheap from CompuSmart and found that the video card wouldn't support Spiderman so I was using a simulator program so that I could at least half play it (and another game I have). I never opened Dungeon Seige but would like to do so as I've always liked these type of games (from Ultima on my C-64 on up).

My computers h/w warranty will be coming to an end shortly (3 year plan at the time)... believe Jan 04 so I can "go nuts" now.... what is a fairly decent ATI card (preferrably (CDN eh) or other manufacturers too) that would blow this card out of the water as far as performance but I don't want to pay for a real expensive card???? I'm not a doomer/quaker type of guy but would like to be able to play games like Spiderman or Dungeon Seige, etc where this video card I have doesn't cut if rom a Direct3D/frame rate perspective I guess.

Also not sure if a newer video card would let me play the T2 Extreme DVD or not (or if I would have to get a new machine). This wouldn't be a requirement but nice to be able to play the HD version (on the PC only; not my HDTV). I don't want to play T2UE on my TV (unless they have a specific hardware DVD player come out to support WMV/WMA) as computer and TV are in different rooms and don't want to hook up via my only DVI connection (along with TV manufacturer warnings about doing this).

I still find my P3 to be a fairly fast machine for what I do so maybe a bit more "ooomphf" from the video side is all I need to play some of these type of games. I can then move my current nvideo Mach64 over to my mom's computer (P3 450MHz I believe) since I won't be tied to my h/w warranty anymore.

Would the ATI Radeon 9200 (or XFX GeForce FX 5200) blow this video card away and would it be overkill for my P3 and will it be good for a P4 system later (if I build my own later)???? Both types of systems use AGP slots I believe

I realize I don't have the latest technology but at this point I don't need a P4 multi-gig machine and I got the P3 for a deal through work at the time (cheaper than most clones so I said why not; plus got a nice 19" monitor at the time for "free" based on price difference between clone systems).

I really don't want any gizmos either like tuners/DVR function as I'm waiting for a set top box to do this with my TV.


I'm looking at cards on the FutureShop site here for my quick scan of what's available.



8)

[sleemo]

You can find better prices here, if you don't mind getting an OEM video card. I wouldn't bother paying the extra for a boxed version of the lower end cards, you should get the same driver and utility software, you just won't get the extra garbage game software that comes with it.

I would get the fastest card you can afford. Shoot for the ATI (if you want to stick with ATI) 9600 and up. There are lots of benchmarking results on the web. Do a search for "video card review".

[I_Want_My_HDTV]

Then there is this deal from ATI :wink:

[sleemo]

I don't understand the trade-in pricing. For example, if I want the AIW 9800 Pro and send in my old video card, I pay them $349US, which would convert to $457.22 Canadian?

That isn't much of deal considering I can buy an AIW 9800 Pro for $459CND and not have to pay any shipping charges. Am I missing something??

[I_Want_My_HDTV]

That is a good price but is that an ATI AIW or a Saphire. I do not think that Saphire makes AIW but the heading is a bit confusing. I agree that ATI's trade up pricing is often not that good a deal. The comparison prices I had for the 9800 AIW Pro were over CDN$500 + shipping so it seemed reasonable.

[bolmsted]

Originally Posted by sleemo

You can find better prices here,

sweet thanks will take a look

Originally Posted by sleemo

I would get the fastest card you can afford. Shoot for the ATI (if you want to stick with ATI) 9600 and up.

not sure if I want to pay that much for a video card.... the $130-140 price looked pretty attractive... the $99 OEM price looks nice too but how much will S&H add (have to look at site in detail).

Do you think the NVidia cards are better than ATI? I haven't had any problems with the NVidia but thought if the ATI is cheaper and/or does same job then why not support CDN company.

[bolmsted]

Originally Posted by I_Want_My_HDTV

Then there is this deal from ATI :wink:

thanks...not sure if it is much of a deal as was alluded... I don't know if I want to spend $350USD (or CDN) for a video card for a computer that probably doesn't have a book value of that much :wink: I will likely get a P4 system at some point but perhaps buying a lower end card that is better than what I have now will be better plus give another computer the speed I currently have.

[sleemo]

Originally Posted by I_Want_My_HDTV

That is a good price but is that an ATI AIW or a Saphire.

I'm not sure which which one, could be a Saphire since it's so cheap but that store always has very good prices. I thought the AIW Saphire card had an XT at the end of it, anyway a phone call could probably sort that out. Some prices at other stores for the [b]ATI[/b} AIW card are $509and $499.99.

Originally Posted by bolmsted

...but how much will S&H add (have to look at site in detail)?

They have a store is in Markham, not too far from Scarboroough, probably a 20 minute drive. Canada Computer is in Markham also, at Kennedy & Steeles.

[I_Want_My_HDTV]

not sure if it is much of a deal as was alluded

ATI just announced a new 9800XT card and a $200 price drop on the 9800 Pro cards. In light of these announcements the trade in offer is not that good a deal. If you want a 9800 Pro or AIW 9800 Pro, this is a good time to buy one at the lower price.

[thegrommit]

Assuming your current TNT2 Vanta sits in a PCI slot (most did), the AIW's aren't an option (they require an AGP slot).

If you're restricted to a PCI card, the fastest ATI option is a Radeon 9200. The fastest Nvidia option would be a FX 5200. Of those, the 9200 is probably the best performer.

FYI, Dungeon Siege will tax your system quite heavily due to its continously rolling game engine. It constantly preloads portions of the gameworld as you proceed through game - removing the need for regular loading screens.

Here are some benchmarks for a 9200 running Dungeon Siege:

http://www.beyond3d.com/reviews/sapp...dex.php?p=6#ds

Note their comments about the game being heavily CPU dependent.

If you do have an AGP slot, then you could of course go with an AGP card. However with your current processor, anything faster than a (non-Pro) Radeon 9600 would be wasted.

[bolmsted]

Well my TNT2 is an AGP slot card...4X I believe (or at least the M.B. can handle 4X).

Anyway I picked up the MSI FX5200 TD128 (8X AGP card) on the weekend from Infonec (thanks sleemo). The FX5200 seemed to be a newer card/chipset with Direct X 9.0 support vs the ATI 9200 with 8.0 support I believe. 9600XT would have been nice but possibly overkill for my system and budget at this point and the FX5200 will probably meet my needs for now until I start to become proficient at the games :wink:

However I think I'll be a little cautious about buying from them in the future because of their return policy only [7 day return if defective, 15% restocking fee otherwise (incompatibility, don't want it), 4% cash discount vs using credit cards], etc. I figured there was little risk of problem with the video card not working so I got it. [Actually, it is against the law for these (Markham based) computer dealers to do this with respect to cash discounting a product].

I haven't really put it through the paces yet as I was cleaning my hard drive and archiving stuff to CDROM. Installation was painless mostly and I used the latest drivers from Nvidia.com instead of the ones on MSI's site or the CDROM.

I'm going to try those two games shortly... this past weekend was busy and tonite was no different.



...Now to look at bigger HD now... are there any BIOS concerns I should have with a hard drive in a PIII 866MHz? I've heard that 32GB is a barrier but I'm pretty sure I could have gone to a bigger HDD at the time say 40-60GB or even possibly 80GB but they were really expensive. I'm looking at a 80-120G drive maybe and moving the 30G (actually 27.9G according to Windows) to my Pentium 166 (should I have any problems with the PI recognizing the 30G drive)?

[thegrommit]

Originally Posted by bolmsted

Anyway I picked up the MSI FX5200 TD128 (8X AGP card) on the weekend from Infonec (thanks sleemo). The FX5200 seemed to be a newer card/chipset with Direct X 9.0 support vs the ATI 9200 with 8.0 support I believe.

Correct. As neither card really has the horsepower to play DX9 games smoothly this isn't really an issue - especially on your current system.

...Now to look at bigger HD now... are there any BIOS concerns I should have with a hard drive in a PIII 866MHz? I've heard that 32GB is a barrier but I'm pretty sure I could have gone to a bigger HDD at the time say 40-60GB or even possibly 80GB but they were really expensive. I'm looking at a 80-120G drive maybe and moving the 30G (actually 27.9G according to Windows) to my Pentium 166 (should I have any problems with the PI recognizing the 30G drive)?

If your motherboard uses the Intel BX chipset, this shouldn't be an issue as it has LBA support. However, you won't be able to format it using FAT32 - you'll have to use NTFS.

[bolmsted]

Originally Posted by thegrommit

If your motherboard uses the Intel BX chipset, this shouldn't be an issue as it has LBA support. However, you won't be able to format it using FAT32 - you'll have to use NTFS.

well I was thinking about using it for Linux or BSD with 30G. I had Linux and BSD on it previously before putting Win98 on it for my mom... she now has a newer computer and i have it back. The BIOS does have LBA just didn't know if there are some restrictions in the Pentium BIOS.

[adit]

Also not sure if a newer video card would let me play the T2 Extreme DVD or not (or if I would have to get a new machine).

You will need a new machine with at least 3 GHz P4 to be able to play ( my 2.2 GHz P4 can't play it smoth in max res).

[adit]

If your motherboard uses the Intel BX chipset, this shouldn't be an issue as it has LBA support. However, you won't be able to format it using FAT32 - you'll have to use NTFS.

Up to 120 GB yes, but after that requires newer BIOS ( and of course NTFS, not FAT or FAT32). Not sure about OS but with correct BIOS Windows XP will work for sure, and most likely Windows 2000 also.