Blu-ray Disc Prices not Dropping Any Time Soon - Page 2 - Canadian TV, Computing and Home Theatre Forums

PhotoJim · 2008-09-18, 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Professor Frink

with the exception of the pillaging of the remaining HD-DVD inventory I don’t think I can remember any other product that was intended to be mainstream that has been met with more public indifference than HD-DVD and Blu-ray.

Marginal return on investment... that's always the question. DVD was orders of magnitude superior to VHS. VHS was far more convenient than going to the theatre and made watching movies at home an option. Blu-Ray, on the other hand, is an incremental upgrade to DVD. The convenience is the same. The quality is better but the quality of DVD is already very good. There is no upgrade in the audio quality (not of significance anyway). The benefit to consumers is just not that large.

We saw similar things with SACD and DVD-Audio. They are markedly superior to CD but they are no more convenient and they did not succeed. (In fact, we are regressing with the more convenient but lower-quality digital download.)

I think the marginal return on Blu-Ray is higher than that of DVD-Audio, but probably not high enough that the public will go crazy over it. I'm sure it will become the standard for movies before very long, but it is still very much competed with by standard old DVD.

Toolatecrew · 2008-09-18, 11:59 AM

No significicant upgrade in Audio? Have you ever listened to an Uncompressed True HD soundtrack or DTS Master Audio directly compared to Dolby Digital. My opion is that there is a significant difference (an option shared by many of my friends)

Luis_A51 · 2008-09-18, 12:10 PM

Agreed.
The audio is a huge selling point to some people. 7.1 high def audio is a huge improvment over DD5.1

There are plenty of people who refuse to buy DD5.1 discs.

james99 · 2008-09-18, 03:26 PM

The average consumer doesn't have the hardware to tell the difference in audio.

In fact most people have the TV tell the difference in PQ either though that is slowly changing.

johnsmith · 2008-09-18, 03:40 PM

Quote:

No significicant upgrade in Audio? Have you ever listened to an Uncompressed True HD soundtrack or DTS Master Audio directly compared to Dolby Digital. My opion is that there is a significant difference (an option shared by many of my friends)
__________________

Wow is all I can say with the difference between DD5.1 and DTS HD Master Audio. Hereos Season 2 Blu-ray the main episodes are DTS HD MA, while the extras are DD5.1. We played them and even my wife said what happened to the sound quality. That is a wow for me, she never notices stuff like that.

Luis_A51 · 2008-09-18, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by james99

The average consumer doesn't have the hardware to tell the difference in audio.

In fact most people have the TV tell the difference in PQ either though that is slowly changing.

Whether mos people have the hardware or not isnt relevant. In the original post it said theres NO upgrade in audio. I just pointed out that for some of us, theres a significant upgrade.

spensar · 2008-09-18, 08:19 PM

Quote:

that for some of us, theres a significant upgrade.

That's the point, there is some market, but that's not a mass market.

PhotoJim · 2008-09-20, 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnsmith

Wow is all I can say with the difference between DD5.1 and DTS HD Master Audio. Hereos Season 2 Blu-ray the main episodes are DTS HD MA, while the extras are DD5.1. We played them and even my wife said what happened to the sound quality. That is a wow for me, she never notices stuff like that.

How about compared to DTS as found on DVD? I've always thought DTS was way better than Dolby Digital 5.1, so the incremental improvement may not be as dramatic.

Toolatecrew · 2008-09-21, 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhotoJim

How about compared to DTS as found on DVD? I've always thought DTS was way better than Dolby Digital 5.1, so the incremental improvement may not be as dramatic.

Its still an improvment. DTS is compressed. HD audio is not.

Fact is you said there is NO improvement. Its simply not ture.
And its not even as big a hardware deal anymore. All you need to experience the uncompressed ausio is a reciver that will accept uncompressed PCM which many lass expensive ones available at BB or FS will do. The PS3 and all lower end BR will internally decode the HD soundtrack. You don't need a fancy BR player or a fancy reciver that will decode bitstreamed HD.

Truth be told I think they have done a poor job of selling this feature. On a smaller screen or bigger viewing distance the acerage consumer may not see the reloution difference with BR. But as long as you have a reciver that accepts the uncomperssed PCM you'll hear the difference regardless of your setup (within reason)

haystack · 2008-09-21, 12:29 PM

In the local future shop Saturday and the blue ray isle looked like they were going out of business. Disks were averaging over $30. I have a player but only 1 out of 10 disks I purchase are blue ray.

TheIgster · 2008-09-21, 12:58 PM

Well, then you are really missing out on a great picture then buying SD DVD's.

Everytime I go to BB, the Blu-ray aisle is packed and expanding more and more. Ton's of movies at $20 price points or less. When I go to FS, the displays are no where near as good as BB nor are the prices.

toybox · 2008-09-21, 01:22 PM

To not get too off topic.

I think to clarify the argument of whether VHS to DVD and DVD to Blu-ray has that "improvement factor" you need to understand this.

Originally to jump from VHS to DVD you would buy a DVD player pop in the desk and see a big improvement in picture/sound/functionality. The cost wasn't as significant.

Now to jump from DVD to Blu-Ray, you need to buy a new player, Receiver, AND HDTV. This is a huge cost to see a big improvement.

WHile I agree with lots of you that BD are a great improvment over DVD. IMO most people don't want to go that route simply because of all the perephials that you have to buy to see the difference. Me being one of them.

Roweig · 2008-09-21, 01:38 PM

Basically true toybox, but over time the cost of electronic equipment goes down. I believe the price of BD will continue to fall as well. I remember in 1967 when colour TV came out in Canada your average set sold for between $800.00 to $1000.00 and in some cases higher. Remember that's in 1967 dollars. That was a huge amount back then. But eventually prices came down and people started buying. The same will happen to BD and BD players. I suspect that around Xmas time or just after, you will notice a decline in prices. However, one unknown is the financial crisis that is plaguing the US and now the world. We shall see.

TheIgster · 2008-09-21, 08:30 PM

Not really true though is it? Many people are buying new TV's anyway because it's time to get into HD for everything, not just disc media. Cable and satellite companies are adding more and more HD channels every day. Even reality TV shows are being filmed in HD now.

As for the receiver, you really don't need to buy a new one either. I've got an older Sony receiver and I have my BD player hooked up via digital optical. That's good enough sound for most people I would imagine. Sounds great to me anyway. I want to upgrade down the road to a new receiver, but not right away. It's not really needed instantly.

You can go to BB right now and pick up a Sony 300 for $229. Most models are under $300 now to get into Blu-ray, so the cost is nowhere near as bad as it was previously.

JonO · 2008-09-22, 09:51 AM

Hate to bring this thread back on topic...

In a surprise move, 20th Century Fox Home Entertainment appears to have introduced a new pricing level.

While back in March Fox introduced a $30 retail price for some of its less popular releases, the studio is now following Lionsgate with a budget level $20 retail pricing strategy for a subset of the studio’s older releases.

Not very official, I admit, but at least it's a little something to discuss...

2008-09-18, 11:59 AM	#17
Toolatecrew Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Dartmouth NS Posts: 520	No significicant upgrade in Audio? Have you ever listened to an Uncompressed True HD soundtrack or DTS Master Audio directly compared to Dolby Digital. My opion is that there is a significant difference (an option shared by many of my friends) __________________ Denon 3808, Paradigm Monitor 7 C370 Mini v3 Funky Waves Fw 15.1 SonyPS3, HD-A3,HD PVR, Slingbox, Epson HC 720 92" screen Last edited by Cyclism; 2008-09-21 at 08:32 PM. Reason: Removed Unnecessary quote.

2008-09-18, 12:10 PM	#18
Luis_A51 Join Date: May 2007 Location: Calgary Posts: 785	Agreed. The audio is a huge selling point to some people. 7.1 high def audio is a huge improvment over DD5.1 There are plenty of people who refuse to buy DD5.1 discs. __________________ Sony KDS-60A2000, Sony Playstation 1/2/3 (60gig) and PSP, Sony STR-DG910, Pioneer/Sony 7.1, 39 PS3 Games, 120 BR movies Last edited by Cyclism; 2008-09-21 at 08:33 PM. Reason: Removed unnecessary quote.

2008-09-21, 12:58 PM	#26
TheIgster Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Calgary, AB Posts: 194	Well, then you are really missing out on a great picture then buying SD DVD's. Everytime I go to BB, the Blu-ray aisle is packed and expanding more and more. Ton's of movies at $20 price points or less. When I go to FS, the displays are no where near as good as BB nor are the prices. Last edited by Cyclism; 2008-09-21 at 08:33 PM. Reason: Removed unnecessary quote.

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2008-09-18, 03:26 PM	#19
james99 Moderator Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Burlington Posts: 24,791	The average consumer doesn't have the hardware to tell the difference in audio. In fact most people have the TV tell the difference in PQ either though that is slowly changing.

2008-09-21, 12:29 PM	#25
haystack Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 2,113	In the local future shop Saturday and the blue ray isle looked like they were going out of business. Disks were averaging over $30. I have a player but only 1 out of 10 disks I purchase are blue ray.

2008-09-21, 01:22 PM	#27
toybox Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Richmond, B.C. Posts: 459	To not get too off topic. I think to clarify the argument of whether VHS to DVD and DVD to Blu-ray has that "improvement factor" you need to understand this. Originally to jump from VHS to DVD you would buy a DVD player pop in the desk and see a big improvement in picture/sound/functionality. The cost wasn't as significant. Now to jump from DVD to Blu-Ray, you need to buy a new player, Receiver, AND HDTV. This is a huge cost to see a big improvement. WHile I agree with lots of you that BD are a great improvment over DVD. IMO most people don't want to go that route simply because of all the perephials that you have to buy to see the difference. Me being one of them.

2008-09-21, 01:38 PM	#28
Roweig Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Coquitlam, B.C., ARRIS Gateway, Panny TC-P65VT50, Panny Blu-ray BDT320PC, Denon AVR-1913 Posts: 126	Basically true toybox, but over time the cost of electronic equipment goes down. I believe the price of BD will continue to fall as well. I remember in 1967 when colour TV came out in Canada your average set sold for between $800.00 to $1000.00 and in some cases higher. Remember that's in 1967 dollars. That was a huge amount back then. But eventually prices came down and people started buying. The same will happen to BD and BD players. I suspect that around Xmas time or just after, you will notice a decline in prices. However, one unknown is the financial crisis that is plaguing the US and now the world. We shall see.

2008-09-21, 08:30 PM	#29
TheIgster Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Calgary, AB Posts: 194	Not really true though is it? Many people are buying new TV's anyway because it's time to get into HD for everything, not just disc media. Cable and satellite companies are adding more and more HD channels every day. Even reality TV shows are being filmed in HD now. As for the receiver, you really don't need to buy a new one either. I've got an older Sony receiver and I have my BD player hooked up via digital optical. That's good enough sound for most people I would imagine. Sounds great to me anyway. I want to upgrade down the road to a new receiver, but not right away. It's not really needed instantly. You can go to BB right now and pick up a Sony 300 for $229. Most models are under $300 now to get into Blu-ray, so the cost is nowhere near as bad as it was previously.

2008-09-22, 09:51 AM	#30
JonO Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Toronto Posts: 649	Hate to bring this thread back on topic... In a surprise move, 20th Century Fox Home Entertainment appears to have introduced a new pricing level. While back in March Fox introduced a $30 retail price for some of its less popular releases, the studio is now following Lionsgate with a budget level $20 retail pricing strategy for a subset of the studio’s older releases. Not very official, I admit, but at least it's a little something to discuss...