New colour wheel problem - all red!

[Bruce Fan]

I just had my HLP4663W colour wheel replaced two weeks ago with a new air bearing unit to reduce the noise. That's fine but yesterday I started to get very red images. I must turn it off and on a few times to get back to normal. It stays fine until I turn it off and then back on again later.

Has the colour wheel gone bad or could it be something else?

thanks!

[G30]

BruceFan,

I don't believe it! I had the same problem but haven't gathered enough information to post anything about it yet.

In fact, this Red Screen problem was the reason I returned my 3rd HL-P4663. The first time I expereinced it was on Super Bowl Sunday. I even took a picture of it. Now on my 4th TV, I experienced it again last week.

Here are the details. Tell me if this meshes with your experience.

1) Each time it occured was upon turning on the TV the morning after an evening of trouble free viewing. I haven't seen a normal picture turn red while watching it.

2) Picture has a heavy red tint to it. I have also seen a Blue tint on one occasion.

3) Each time the input with the red tint was from my Roger's STB. This is true for both Component and DVI cabling.

4) Other inputs work fine. Once cycling through them and arriving back at the STB input, the Red goes away and the picture is normal.

5) I think I was changing resolution setup on the STB the night before it happens.

Do we have any points in common?

[Bruce Fan]

G30 - we meet yet again!

Interesting you should say that you had just changed the set-up because I did as well. I changed the set-up to disable 1080i and left the output of the STB to auto dvi-hdmi. Thinking that may the problem I changed the output to upconvert 2 last night. But this morning it was red again. I had to turn off and on a few times to get it to normal.

1 - Yes, it only happens after it has been off for a while. It has never changed red while watching.

2 - Yes, very heavy red tint.

3 - I only have the STB via HDMI

4 - I have not tried other inputs ie DVD to see. I'll try that next time.

5 - just answered that above.

So...has it been resolved for you? Maybe I'll play around with set-up again.

[G30]

Originally Posted by Bruce Fan

G30 - we meet yet again!

Yes, we meet again. Funny that. It seems like our TV paths are intertwined.

Originally Posted by Bruce Fan

Interesting you should say that you had just changed the set-up because I did as well. I changed the set-up to disable 1080i and left the output of the STB to auto dvi-hdmi. Thinking that may the problem I changed the output to upconvert 2 last night. But this morning it was red again. I had to turn off and on a few times to get it to normal.

The reason I mention fiddling with the settings is because I think changing modes may 'confuse' the TV (or STB for that matter). Let me explain...

Have you ever set up a progressive scan DVD player incorrectly? If you have you will know that if progressive scan is not setup right, then it can result in brightly tinted images. I wonder if playing with Progressive (720P) and Interlaced (1080I) sources on the STB is causing the Red Screen in our case?

Originally Posted by Bruce Fan

1 - Yes, it only happens after it has been off for a while. It has never changed red while watching.

So if it's the TV, then it's some kind of initialization/startup problem.

Originally Posted by Bruce Fan

2 - Yes, very heavy red tint.

Let me know if you ever see blue.

Originally Posted by Bruce Fan

3 - I only have the STB via HDMI

That means it can occur on HDMI, Component and DVI. Therefore, it's probably not related to the input type.

Originally Posted by Bruce Fan

4 - I have not tried other inputs ie DVD to see. I'll try that next time.

Yes. I would like to hear what happens. On mine, the other inputs look fine. I'm not sure what this suggests. I would say that it's probably not the TV, but perhaps changing inputs re-initializes the display so that it is corrected. This would also explain why it is fine when you cycle back around to it. On the other hand, is it possible that changing inputs breaks the connection to faulty STB signal, and then re-establishes a good connection on cycle through? This one is for the electronics engineers to answer.

Originally Posted by Bruce Fan

5 - just answered that above.

So...has it been resolved for you? Maybe I'll play around with set-up again.

No definitely not resolved. It has only happened once on this TV, but I cannot figure out why. I suspect that it might be:

a) As per your suggestion- initialization of the new colour wheel. You have an October 2004 build right? I wonder if it's the same part number that's in my January 2005 build? This theory is supported by the fact that the problem seems new. I haven't been able to find anything about it on the net.

b) The STB. If it's the TV, then why do the other inputs look fine?

c) Both, but related to us playing around with Interlaced and Progressive sources.

What do you think Bruce Fan?

By the way, are you a fan of Bruce Springsteen, or is Bruce Fan your name?

[Bruce Fan]

Well, my wife spoke with our service guy when he called yesterday and he said Samsung has never heard of this problem before. He said it could be caused by power spikes over night. He recommended unplugging the set for 4 hours and see. I'm not sure if I buy that but what the hell. I unplugged it overnight and when I tried this morning it started fine. We'll see if it returns. Very odd.

On another positive note he said he's ordered a new screen for me to resolve the magic smudge that appeared after the replaced the colour wheel. My guess it is guess some dust that got stuck to the screen when we worked on it. My reading shows smudges don't just appear.

Nope, no blue. It's always been red. It hasn't happened since so I haven't tried other inputs but I will if it happens again -- hopefully I won't have the chance to try.

I'm not sure what it could be. Maybe the wheel isn't spinning and stuck on red. Now I think about it, it might have been the same thing I saw when he put the new wheel in. At first it was a weird image then I mentioned the sticker on the wheel about the jumper. We turned it off, removed the jumper and it turned on fine. However, it was working for two weeks with the new wheel before it happened. Like you, I was changing the settings to Upconvert 2 and no 1080i output the night before it happened so that seems to be related. Hmmmm..


Yep....I'm a huge Springsteen fan! You?

[G30]

I don't buy the power spikes theory. I run my set off a UPS with surge supression and automatic voltage regulation and it still happened.

Do you know what I mean about setting up a progressive scan DVD player though? I think that the red tint is caused when you change the STB settings. I would really like to hear from anyone else that has seen this behaviour. More clues would definitely help.

That's good about the new screen. I hear it just pops off for replacement.

Yeah, Springsteen is good. I was just curious what the nick meant.

P.S do you watch The Apprentice? If yes, did you notice that there was a Samsung DLP in the Sony boardroom? That's pretty funny.

[Bruce Fan]

I've got everything on a surge protected power bar so I'm not sure if I believe it either but we'll see if it happens again.

I've never seen what you talk about with DVD players. Maybe it's similar.

The service guy said it will take him about 3 hours to replace the screen. WHAT? I've also heard it is quick and easy. We'll see.

Yep, I saw it in the apprentice last night. Actually it was my wife that pointed it out -- "hey...that's our TV!".

[G30]

I noticed the TV, but it was my wife that made the funny observation that its a Samsung in a Sony boardroom.

Anyhow, hopefully someone else has seen this red screen problem and can provide some clues.

[vango44]

Samsung 5063W - September/04 build -
I've also seen the "red tint" problem 2 or 3 times in the 5 months I've owned the set when cold starting it.
Each time I just shut off and on again which "fixed" it.
I'm not sure if it was a common input or resolution which caused the problem but until a month ago I was making lots of changes to my setup as I searched for the best one.
Since I've settled on my current setup for over a month now I haven't seen the problem again.
Currently have the STB(Motorola 6208) set to output 1080i and overide "off" Via component, and my LG upconverting DVD player set to 1080i via DVI cable.
Also using the VGA input for PC.

[Bruce Fan]

Well....since unplugging it overnight I've been ok. Friday morning start was fine, as was the evening (after being off all day) and this morning.

[G30]

Originally Posted by vango44

Samsung 5063W - September/04 build -
I've also seen the "red tint" problem 2 or 3 times in the 5 months I've owned the set when cold starting it.
Each time I just shut off and on again which "fixed" it.

Thanks for posting. Did you happen to notice if the other inputs were OK?
This may seem off topic, but have you experienced the high-pitched whine from your colour wheel? Colour Wheel Noise

Originally Posted by vango44

I'm not sure if it was a common input or resolution which caused the problem but until a month ago I was making lots of changes to my setup as I searched for the best one.
Since I've settled on my current setup for over a month now I haven't seen the problem again.

Based on your experience, do you concur with the developing theory that changing resolutions somehow "confuses" the TV?
Before you answer, consider that 99% of people that post this forum probably tweak their settings much more than the average Samsung DLP owner.

Originally Posted by vango44

Currently have the STB(Motorola 6208) set to output 1080i and overide "off" Via component, and my LG upconverting DVD player set to 1080i via DVI cable.
Also using the VGA input for PC.

Hmmm...this goes against the other possibilty that it is caused by the SA STB from Rogers. On the other hand, I spoke to Roger's Tech Support this weekend. The guy said that he has heard of the red screen issue on rare occasion, and believes that it is caused when the an update is sent to the STB. The last time he said an update was sent happens to coincide with the last time I saw the red tinted screen. Now I am the one who is confused.

[vango44]

G30

I've already posted in the Color wheel post(#24). No louder than a computer hard drive. In fact the fan seems slightly louder.

I'm not 100% sure but I seem to remember switching inputs the last time it happened(red tint) and the problem remaining till I turned the set off.
For a while I was using 720P out of the STB and it seems that's where I was getting the most problems but can't be sure of this. Several times I also had a problem where I turned the TV on and got an odd looking "split video" screen. Changing the channel fixed this.

Since I've settled on my latest setup, things are pretty good.
The only remaining issues I'm still living with are the way the set responds(or doesn't) to remote control input(I use a Harmony 659).
I have never gotten the discrete power on code released by Samsung to work consistently. This is a known issue.

Finally, the TV does not like to accept input changes immediately after being powered up. I have the Harmony set to delay the input change to the TV for 7 seconds when it starts up. This seems to work but takes away some of the "wife acceptance factor" that makes the Harmony remote so nice.

I don't know if these last problems are acceptable or not for this caliber of TV. My last TV was a 1990'ish RCA 25" and it didn't have any of these problems.

[G30]

Vango44,

After reading the thread again, I remember your colour wheel post now. Sorry I missed it.

The reason I asked is because Bruce Fan initially suggested that the red screen is a colour wheel problem. You do not have any colour wheel noise but have seen the red screen problem. Bruce Fan and I never experienced the red screen problem until we got non-noisy colour wheels. See where this is going? I wonder if we have a common colour wheel part number?

It's good to hear that your current setup is not causing any problems. It lends
credence to the other theory that playing with the resolutions messes up the TV.

I'm not familiar with discrete codes. What are they all about?

I agree about the questionable reliability of these TVs compared to old CRTs. On the other hand, let's not forget that these are fairly new inventions, but offer never seen before picture quality. In comparison, CRTs are senior citizens, so the quality issues have been addressed long ago. I just wish that someone from Samsung would actually read these posts, or otherwise listen to what customers are saying. I think that this is just a pipe dream though. I left a Samsung Canada support Supervisor 2 messages almost 1 month ago and I still haven't heard back. Unfortunately, it all about the bottom line.

[vango44]

Originally Posted by G30

Vango44,


...I'm not familiar with discrete codes. What are they all about?...

Discrete power on/off remote codes - Your and my Samsung TV remote has a power button. The TV sees this signal and switches to the opposite state of what it's currently in.
Most people with kids/wives/in-laws etc... want to be able to watch cable or a DVD with one button on the remote(Macros). In order for this to work perfectly, you need to be able to send a discrete On or Off signal to the various devices rather than just the "power toggle" signal most remotes ship with.
The remote I use actually tries to remember which devices are on and which are off but it doesn't always work perfectly.
Samsung actually has discrete signals for On or Off and even the individual inputs(which do work for me-cycling through all the inputs several times a day would have been a deal breaker for me) and you can get them off the internet if you have a remote that will accept them.

I'll follow these threads and post back if I learn anything new.
btw, did you get the extended warranty? I did.

[G30]

Ok, that makes sense. I have an RCA learning remote that can do Macros, but I don't think that it accepts discrete codes. It sounds like a good idea though. While on this topic, do you ever find yourself pressing the Power button more than once to turn off the TV?

I didn't buy the extended warranty. Maybe I should have for this purchase. To avoid a debate, however, lets just say that my Visa card doubles the original warranty, and leave it at that.