New Panasonic DVD recorder: DMR-E30

[NormL]

New Panasonic DVD recorder

Model#: DMR-E30



Feature Highlights:

~ The world's first DVD video recorder to offer Time Slip™ Function
~ Extended-time recording DVD-RAM: up to 12 hours (EP mode), DVD-R: up to 6 hours (EP mode)
~ Hybrid VBR technology delivers high-quality picture (DVD-RAM and DVD-R)


Performance Features:

~ Time Slip Function:
- Chasing Playback
- Simultaneous REC. and PLAY
- Time Slip Roller and Button
~ Direct Navigator for quick access to desired program
~ Playlist Playback
~ One-Touch REC & PLAY
~ Seamless Playback
~ Disc Protect
~ Commercial Skip


Recording Technology Features

~ Hybrid VBR Technology
~ Real-time VBR
~ Visibility Modulation Technology
~ Picture Quality Improvement Function
- Input TBC
- 3D Y/C Separation
- 3D Noise Reduction
- Block Noise Reduction
- Mosquito Noise Reduction
~ 4-Mode Recording + FR Modes (XP/SP/LP/EP/FR)
~ Dolby Digital 2-channel Audio Recording


Video Features:

~ Progressive Scan Video Output - Selectable 480P/480I
~ Picture Control (Brightness, Colour, Contrast, Gamma)
~ Picture Mode Selection
~ Discrete Component Video Out
~ Cinema Mode


Audio Features:

~ Optical Digital Output for DTS & Dolby Digital Surround Sound
~ Advanced Surround (V.S.S.)


NTSC Tuner Features:

~ TV Channels: 2-69
~ CATV Channels: 1 - 125
~ VCR Plus


Convenient Features:

~ DVD-RAM Video Playback
~ DVD-R1, CD-R/RW2 Playback
~ Joystick Universal Remote Control

MSRP: CAN$1299.95

[hugh]

The DMR-E30 allows you to digitally record up to 12 hours on a double-sided DVD-RAM disc, and up to six hours in a single sided DVD-RAM or DVD-R disc using Panasonic’s Hybrid VBR technology.


Time Slip, allows viewers to replay a scene recorded 30 seconds earlier without disrupting the recording process by simply touching a button on the remote, explains the firm. It also allows the recorder’s Simultaneous Record and Play feature to function, allowing consumers to, for example, watch last week’s episode while recording this week’s from the same disc at the same time. The DMR-E30 also provides a 16-program timer recording feature, notes the firm.

The Progressive Scan doubles the scan lines of the interlaces signal (from 480i to 480p) by scanning all 525 lines in 1/60 of a second for each pass, creating a higher-density video signal, says Panasonic.

the DMR-E30 allows users to use the DVD recorder as a personal video recorder (PVR). It will automatically find blank space on the disc and begin recording, and because of the fast transfer rate, users can view the recorded portion of an ongoing program from the beginning, while at the same time recording the program in progress.

When connected to home theatre components, the DMR-E30 enables consumers to enjoy playback of multiple digital entertainment formats, including DVD video, music CDs, CD-R and CD-RW discs. The Direct Navigator function lets users instantly access recorded material from an on-screen menu that lists recording dates, times, channels, and (user-entered) titles. The Playlist function also lets the user perform simple, non-linear video editing such as rearranging the order of scenes, skipping over unwanted scenes and creating custom playlists of favourite scenes on a disc.

Revised suggested retail price of $999.95

[Alan Bealby]

I picked mine up last Wednesday.

Generally satisfied that I will be able to retire my Laser Disc Player and S-VHS unit. I can transfer the laser discs and VCR cassettes I have left without problems as none of them have any copy protection. At least it checks out with a few VCR cassettes and most of my laser disc content. I'll finish with the laser discs and then go back to the VCR cassettes. With the laser discs I am just transferring those I can't get in DVD format, mostly live concerts. I don't have any VCR tapes left of commercial movies so my remaining tapes should transfer okay. I haven't noticed any significant degradation of the video quality in SP (2 hours) or LP (4 hours)modes.

I was quite annoyed at how tedious it was to setup for using VCR Plus+. Instead of allowing entry of channels numbers using the numeric keypad, you have to scroll through the selection of the VCR Plus+ channel number and then scroll through the tuner channel numbers to assign a tuner channel number to the VCR Plus+ channel number. You don't have to do it very oftern but to have to go through that tedious, long chore when first setting up the recorder does not leave a good impression on the ease of use for the rest of the features. In fact, the rest of operating controls are reasonably easy to use. I will remember the dumb setup of the VCR Plus+ feature for a long time though.

I knew from my research that there would be limited capabilty to record from a digital cable channel because the DMR-E30 doesn't have a built in digital cable channel tuner. The same problem exists for my VCR and I assume all other VCRs. I didn't realize, though, that I wouldn't be able to use the "Chasing Play" or "Time Slip" feature with the digital cable channels because of the way I have my A/V components connected. I would need to split the A/V output from the cable box to go to both the A/V receiver and the DMR-E30 or get another cable box to be able to use these features on digital cable channels. I was talking to the saleman who suggested one fix was the second cable box for about $200. It would also allow watching and recording simultaneously from two digital cable channels. I doubt it would be worth it for me but I'll have to see. If the DMR-E30 supported an IR blaster to change the cable box channels automatically it would make a big difference.

It is an expensive solution but I will be able to get rid of my laser disc and VCR cassette collection and just have CDs and DVDs. That will be a relief.

[57]

I was quite annoyed at how tedious it was to setup for using VCR Plus+.

I find it interesting that anyone uses VCR Plus for the following reasons.

1. Difficult and non-intuitive to programme in the first place (as you noted)
2. When the channels change, you need to reprogramme the appropriate VCR+ channels.
3. One typo in a magazine and you're recording the wrong programme.
4. Programming a VCR is not very difficult - anyone who can set up VCR+ in the first place obviously has the smarts. I even taugh my Luddite 72 year old mother-in-law how in only 5 minutes. She's really proud of herself and records all her favourite programmes now. She finds it easier and more intuitive than VCR+.
5. I usually add some extra time to most of my recordings - a lot of time in the event of a live sporting event. This requires manual input of the times, so why not do this in the first place.
6. Most of my "time shifting" is "weekly" programming, so there is no time saved, since I put this in once at the start of the season, and I'm done until there is a time change, or the start of next season, if necessary.
7. With the IPG on the STB, with IR input to the VCR (VCR Commander), it's even easier.

The DVD recorder itself looks interesting, and is obviously of interest to you because you want to transfer one archive (LD, VHS) to another (DVD), but for time-shifting alone, I would think a PVR/DVR is a better way.

Are you planning on using DVD-RAM for your time-shifting (at some minor cost) or are you planning to use DVD-RW at slightly higher initial cost, but re-recording capablility - although for how many writes, we don't know....

If you plan to go the latter route, it'd be interesting to hear from you in a while how it's gone, or from others who have re-written a lot...

[NormL]

57, I think you're a little confused about the formats.

DVD-RAM is a re-writable format. Estimated at 100,000 re-writes. There is no other cost except for the disc.

DVD-R is a write once format.

DVD-RW is also a re-writable format. Estimated a 1,000 re-writes.

The Panasonic E30 is a DVD-RAM/DVD-R recorder and is not capable of using DVD-RW.

Aside from that, it can be used just like a VCR, along with time-slip capabilities.

I'm debating with getting this recorder or waiting a few months and getting the new DMR-HS2 which comes with a hard-disc-drive built into the machine.

[57]

Sorry, I was confusing DVD-RAM with DVD-R. Thanks for the clarification/correction

[Alan Bealby]

[quote="57"]

Are you planning on using DVD-RAM for your time-shifting (at some minor cost) or are you planning to use DVD-RW at slightly higher initial cost, but re-recording capablility - although for how many writes, we don't know....

If you plan to go the latter route, it'd be interesting to hear from you in a while how it's gone, or from others who have re-written a lot...

The DMR-E30 only supports DVD-RAM for erasable recording and DVD-R for one time recording. No support for DVD-RW. I plan on using DVD-RAM for time shifting and DVD-R for content I might want to keep for longer than a few days. Mind at $5 to $10 per DVD-R it will be expensive to record to DVD-R. I have ordered some generic DVD-R's for $5 apiece and will have to see whether they work. I have tried 4 Verbatim and 8 Maxell ranging in price from $10 to $12 without any problems.

I expect most of my recording after I complete converting my old content will be to DVD-RAM and will be temporary.
\
I ordered 5 DVD-RAM 9.4 GB double sided media for $35 a piece. I hope that will carry me for a long time. The DVD-RAMs are supposed to have a long life time. We'll see.

[Alan Bealby]

Originally Posted by NormL

I'm debating with getting this recorder or waiting a few months and getting the new DMR-HS2 which comes with a hard-disc-drive built into the machine.

Yeah. I went through this internal debate but decided not wait. The problem of not being able to control recording cable digital channels properly would, in my mind, eliminate some of the neat feature of PVR functionality. I may be wrong and regret my decision if that turns out to be wrong.

If you get one I would like to see a posting summarizing your experience with it.

[Alan Bealby]

Originally Posted by 57

I find it interesting that anyone uses VCR Plus for the following reasons.

1. Difficult and non-intuitive to programme in the first place (as you noted)
2. When the channels change, you need to reprogramme the appropriate VCR+ channels.
3. One typo in a magazine and you're recording the wrong programme.
4. Programming a VCR is not very difficult - anyone who can set up VCR+ in the first place obviously has the smarts. I even taugh my Luddite 72 year old mother-in-law how in only 5 minutes. She's really proud of herself and records all her favourite programmes now. She finds it easier and more intuitive than VCR+.
5. I usually add some extra time to most of my recordings - a lot of time in the event of a live sporting event. This requires manual input of the times, so why not do this in the first place.
6. Most of my "time shifting" is "weekly" programming, so there is no time saved, since I put this in once at the start of the season, and I'm done until there is a time change, or the start of next season, if necessary.
7. With the IPG on the STB, with IR input to the VCR (VCR Commander), it's even easier.

<snip>

Reagarding VCR Plus+. I have never used it before and just set it up in case it was useful. I agree with most of your comments regarding a VCR Plus+ versus manually timed programming. I'll certainly start with with manually timed programming method and only switch over to VCR Plus+ if I am not satisfied.

What STB are you using to get IR input to the VCR? I have probably seen you refer to it but I have forgotten. Is that what they call an IR Balster My GI DCT2000HT from Shaw doesn't support that.

I am curious. Can you set up a timed programming event on your STB and then have it control your VCR instead of doing the programming on your VCR? That would make my DMR-E30 recorder that much more useful. According to a Motrola news release last May, Shaw is supposed to start deploying the DCT 5100 STB in Q4 this year. It is supposed to have an IR Blaster port as a standard interface. Even if it does have the port, though, it doesn't mean that Shaw would provide it with software to support it. The lack of Dolby Digital output on my DCT200HT when it is hardware capable is a major annoyance right now.

[Alan Bealby]

A few updates.

Got the generic DVD-Rs and tried them. No problems in burning three. They cost $4.45 apiece and I noticed today that price has dropped to $4.25. They are bulk, no-name discs in sleeves. I will put them into a DVD jukebox so the sleeves are nice for protection until they are burned. The cost is more than for CD-Rs and VCR cassettes but not that much more. Maybe the cost of supplies won't be too onerous after all.

Tried some editing of a movie with commercials I recorded to DVD-RAM. Didn't take too long to excise the commercials and shorten it from two hours to about 90 minutes. The shorten segment feature is crude in that I couldn't easily catch the exact start and end of the commercial segments but it worked out okay for me. It will leave a minor annoyance of bits of commercials or small gaps in the movie. With patience one can minimize these but I doubt whether I will spend that much time fiddling with the editing to optimize the edits. In fact I probably won't do this too often in any case. I avoid watching movies on channels with commercials as much as I can.

I purchased a 4-way audio/video distribution amplifier from Radio Shack to spilt the cable box output to my A/V receiver and the DMR-E30 so that I can see whether I can get the PVR like feature "Chasing Play" to work with cable digital channels. I watched a 90 minute comedy show on CBC from an analog channel on Friday that I started watching about 75 minutes into the program. Skipping comercials was easy and real handy.

All in all, the DMR-E30 is working better than I anticipated.

[57]

Originally Posted by Alan Bealby

1. What STB are you using to get IR input to the VCR? I have probably seen you refer to it but I have forgotten. Is that what they call an IR Balster My GI DCT2000HT from Shaw doesn't support that.

2. I am curious. Can you set up a timed programming event on your STB and then have it control your VCR instead of doing the programming on your VCR? That would make my DMR-E30 recorder that much more useful.

1. See my signature below (SA3100HD). They call it a "VCR Commander". See this post on the VCR Commander for some limitations (I'll discuss a little more below in point 2)

2. Yes, if you leave the VCR on "Channel 0" (or whichever channel is appropriate) and don't record using the VCR's functions, just from the VCR commander/STB, this is possible (and very easy to do). The STB simply turns itself onto the correct channel at the correct time, turns on the VCR, activates the VCR's "record" feature (without changing channels - so you have to leave the VCR on the correct channel), then turns everything off at the end. If you want to add some extra time, do weekly events, etc. That's all possible on the STB' menu. The only drawback comes when the item you want to record is not yet on the IPG (Too far out). You can still do the programming "manually" on the STB and this is quite easy, but it's like programming a VCR instead of simply highlighting the programme.

All of what I've discussed relates to VCRs. The IR "frequency" and the way your DMR-E30 records, may not be the same as a VCR. The STB does have all of the various VCR frequencies (remote codes), but your box may have a different frequency and may not work like a VCR...

I think the VCR commander is about $25 or so from Rogers. I got mine for free when the service guy was here - Rogers had told me that it would work and it didn't, so the tech who brought me the new STB and commander simply left it saying "you're right - it won't work properly using S-Video or composite cables." (This was after he'd spent about an hour trying to get it to work). It does work using co-ax. (I used to have the 2000HD STB and it couldn't do the VCR commander function at all - it was removed for the HD functionality, but that's ancient history now...)

[Alan Bealby]

Originally Posted by 57

1. See my signature below (SA3100HD). They call it a "VCR Commander". See this post on the VCR Commander for some limitations (I'll discuss a little more below in point 2)

Oh. That's where I saw it. Sorry about that. I am not much on the ball these days, obviously.

Originally Posted by 57

2. Yes, if you leave the VCR on "Channel 0" (or whichever channel is appropriate) and don't record using the VCR's functions, just from the VCR commander/STB, this is possible (and very easy to do). The STB simply turns itself onto the correct channel at the correct time, turns on the VCR, activates the VCR's "record" feature (without changing channels - so you have to leave the VCR on the correct channel), then turns everything off at the end. If you want to add some extra time, do weekly events, etc. That's all possible on the STB' menu. The only drawback comes when the item you want to record is not yet on the IPG (Too far out). You can still do the programming "manually" on the STB and this is quite easy, but it's like programming a VCR instead of simply highlighting the programme.

All of what I've discussed relates to VCRs. The IR "frequency" and the way your DMR-E30 records, may not be the same as a VCR. The STB does have all of the various VCR frequencies (remote codes), but your box may have a different frequency and may not work like a VCR...

As far as I can tell the DMR-E30 acts the same way as a VCR for the basics of starting recording and stopping it. Just push the RECORD button to start recording and the STOP button to stop recording. There are some settings which it might be nice to be able to control on a recording by recording basis but the only one that I think would be that useful is the recording speed, and even that, isn't that important. One slight problem with the DMR-E30 is that it takes awhile to start recording and to stop recording. I haven't timed this yet but it is 10's of sconds. That is diffrent from a VCR that has to be accomodated.

I haven't checked yet whether the IR codes are standard as I haven't tried to set up my Marantz RC 2000MkII universal remote for its codes yet. I don't anticipate a problem with this as I expect it to use standard IR coding, even if different codes than a VCR. I find it is better to leave programming the universal until I am more familiar with the device to know what buttons are used more often or in what comination before trying to setup the universal remote for it.

Originally Posted by 57

I think the VCR commander is about $25 or so from Rogers. I got mine for free when the service guy was here - Rogers had told me that it would work and it didn't, so the tech who brought me the new STB and commander simply left it saying "you're right - it won't work properly using S-Video or composite cables." (This was after he'd spent about an hour trying to get it to work). It does work using co-ax. (I used to have the 2000HD STB and it couldn't do the VCR commander function at all - it was removed for the HD functionality, but that's ancient history now...)

Do I understand that the STB doesn't output a composite or S-Video signal when it is in VCR commander mode? That would be another problem with my complex tangle of wires. I just finished putting in a Audio/Video distribution amplifier between my STB and my A/V receiver and the DMR-E30. What a rats nest. This change should allow me to start playing a recording of a digital channel while it is still recording. I couldn't do if before or I don't know how to do it without the splitter or another STB box dedicated to the DMR-ER30.

[57]

Do I understand that the STB doesn't output a composite or S-Video signal when it is in VCR commander mode?

There is a menu item in the STB that lets you choose the output (Coax or Video) or something like that.

Actually, I think all the outputs are always live, if the STB is on and tuned to a channel. The only difference is, if you use the coax setting, the STB sends a signal to the VCR to tune to channel 3 before recording (as I mentioned in my other post). It doesn't know enough to send a signal to go to "channel 0" for the video output which is the "problem" - you have to remember to leave the VCR on channel 0 (L-1) if recording this way.

[Alan Bealby]

Originally Posted by 57

There is a menu item in the STB that lets you choose the output (Coax or Video) or something like that.

Actually, I think all the outputs are always live, if the STB is on and tuned to a channel. The only difference is, if you use the coax setting, the STB sends a signal to the VCR to tune to channel 3 before recording (as I mentioned in my other post). It doesn't know enough to send a signal to go to "channel 0" for the video output which is the "problem" - you have to remember to leave the VCR on channel 0 (L-1) if recording this way.

Okay. I follow. Again a little slowly.

Yeah. This would be a problem if mixing recording from analog cable channels and digital cable channels. If recording is done using the DMR-E30's coax connection for analog channels, which I currently plan on doing, at the end of the recording the DMR-E30 is left with the input set to the tuner channel. You have to manually change the DMR-E30 to L3 which is where I have the STB S-Video ouput connected to. Another solution is to record everything through the coax connection from the STB which is not that good for the digital channels. If I had an oportunity to get a STB with IR control for a VCR/DVD recorderer I can see glitches. As usual with lots of A/V gear, it is never simple if it can be done. Whine. Whine.

Thanks for the information on your setup and operation. It helps to know of potential glitches when thinking of new/better (?) equipment. Better to know in advance.

[Sketcher]

I think this one only plays DVDs recorded by Panasonic players.

Anyhoo, where can I find one of these fien machines? I checked online and couldn't find any stores with it. Aside from Panasonic.ca, I'm hoping to find a lower price than $1300. If possible