Purchasing From U.S. Vendors: Taxes, Duties, Shipping, other Issues, etc.

[Gord Lacey]

Yes, I'm 100% sure it's a duty as it's listed as "Customs Duty" in one place, and "Duty on Imported Goods" in another. There's also a $7 handling fee, along with "GST on Imported Goods." I'm in Alberta so I don't pay PST. I'm very familiar with the Canada Post fee, and I've told UPS to shove their brokerage fees many times, but I've never, ever, ever, ever seen a duty applied to DVDs being brought in from the US. I run a DVD website and I get probably 150+ packages a year.

I spent about 3 hours looking around the government website, and while I found a number of places that talk about duty, and even the Classification codes, I couldn't find anything that listed what does, and doesn't, have duty applied to it.

I just love how the government tries to make money off something that I didn't pay anything for. Last time I looked, 6% of $0 is still $0.

Gord

[elapsed]

Does anyone have any experience in purchasing from Outlaw Audio in the States? I'm very interested in purchasing an Outlaw 990 pre-pro and two Outlaw 2200 monoblock poweramps. Total list price including XLR interconnects is US$1,844.

Now according to Outlaw:

Our Canadian customers are subject to a variety of Duties and Taxes and these vary from province to province. 1) A Federal "Goods and Services Tax" of 7% is due on all international shipments. 2) A Federal "Duty Tax", from 1% to 3%, can be applied to a purchase depending on its country of origin. Products manufactured in Mexico and the US are covered by the NAFTA accord and may be exempt from Duty. The Outlaw Model 7100, 755 and 770 are built in the US and, thus, are exempt, while the Model 200, 950 and our other products are built in Asia and are not. Products sold by us that are produced outside of the NATFA countries may be subject to other taxes. 3) A "Provincial Sales Tax" varies from province to province. Typically it is 8% to 10% (0% for Alberta) but, depending on the province, it may not be applied to an imported shipment. 4) Certain shippers, notably UPS, apply a "Brokerage fee" to Canadian shipments and this can be 10% or more depending on the value of the item(s) being shipped. Many of our Canadian customers tell us that a general rule of thumb to convert a US price (in US dollars) to a final landed Canadian price (in Canadian dollars) is approximately 1.5 to 1.6 times the US price. To determine exactly what taxes or additional fees may apply to your order specifically, we recommend that you call Revenue Canada Customs Border Services at 1-800-461-9999.

That price seems awfully excessive. Would it be worth shipping to my PO Box in Bellingham, WA and declaring at the border? I've never brought exensive electronics back over the border.

[jvincent]

They seem to have all the extras pretty well identified. The one that you should be able to avoid is UPS brokerage.

If you pick it up yourself and declare it at the border you'll have to pay all the same ones so unless it's convenient you might as well have them ship it.

[3.2vtec]

My wife and I buy alot of things online. I've had alot of electronics (cameras to laptops) shipped to me over the years from overseas, including US and Asia. Avoid UPS at all cost. They charge a higher then usual brokerage fee on top of the regular duties. You live in Vancouver like me so most likely you'll see the same charges I usually do... our usuall gst and pst added the the price declared from the shipper.
Now here's the wierd thing... i've had items such as expensive cell phones and cameras shipped form Asia (mostly HK) to me and I've experienced no duties I had to pay on them. But almost eveything I've bought from states, there was duties included on them. Either I had to pay on delivery or I got sent a bill later on.

[stampeder]

Several similar threads have been merged into this one so there are some great warnings, tips, etc. in here.

How would you rate purchasing from U.S. vendors: Taxes, Duties, Shipping, Customs Brokers, Delays, Warranties, other Issues, etc.? Take the poll and discuss in this thread.

[Gord Lacey]

Apparently DHL is odd and doesn't realize DVDs are manufactured in North America, so they applied duty to the shipment. They require a NAFTA certificate in order to waive the charges.....which sounds insane.

Anyway...just an update for the few people who read this thread.

Gord

[trellaine]

I have read ALL 10 pages of this thread and I don't see a clear answer for this question:

I am having a hard time finding the mp3 player I want, besides being WAY overpriced here in Vancouver.

I want to buy this at Circuit City Bellingham. I will declare this when crossing the border.

Anybody have any idea on specific duty charges on an Mp3 player valued at $250CDN probably made/assembled in Asia I am guessing. China?

Thanks

[WestCDA]

Anybody have any idea on specific duty charges on an Mp3 player valued at $250CDN probably made/assembled in Asia I am guessing. China?

Here's the customs tariff - have at it! You're probably interested in Section XVI.85 ...

Current Customs Tariff

[trellaine]

OMG! lol thanks. That absolutely gives me a dizzying effect. I can't imagine in anyone right mind, they could interpret this gibberish.

Way too difficult to understand for anyone in the world.


I will call border services and see if I can get some clarification.

Thanks though.

[WestCDA]

Looks to me like it's free of duty - though I'd get that clarification if I were you.

85.20 Magnetic tape recorders and other sound recording apparatus, whether or not incorporating a sound reproducing device.

-Other magnetic tape recorders incorporating sound reproducing apparatus:

8520.32.00 00 -Digital audio type NMB Free CCCT, LDCT, GPT, UST,MT, MUST, CIAT, CT, CRT: Free

I realize that an MP3 player is not 'magnetic tape' but the digital audio type is an 85.20 classification which includes magnetic tape 'and other sound recording apparatus'.

This part of the tariff makes for interesting reading - after all these years, turntables and record players are duty free - unless they have an 'automatic record changing' mechanism - then it's 3.5 percent!

[que3jxp]

Let me doublecheck when I get to work.

There was a severe screwup on the part of the CBSA this year. One of my technicans is responsible for obtaining the most up to date compilations of the tariff so I will see if the mess is straightened out and I can then confirm with one of the raters for you.

[que3jxp]

The proper tariff code is: 8519.81.29. It states a duty of 5% but...


Tariff Code 9948 can be applied to these goods, as per CITT decision on Appeal No. AP-2001-097.

With that, it makes it duty free...



Freaking Government complications...

[trellaine]

Very interesting findings after talking to Border Services staff via the phone. And exactly what I wanted to hear.

I told him I wanted to buy an Mp3 player.

He said if the mp3player has a radio tuner, then no duty, just PST and GST.

If the mp3player doesn't have a radio tuner then 5% duty plust GST and PST.

Craziness.

[que3jxp]

Actaully, the appeal reference that I posted will get you off no matter what. It states that any device that can be connected to a PC is duty free.

Yes that sounds vague but it would definitely apply for any device that can connect and be read from or written to.

[Kevin S]

I've read most of the thread and thought I would offer my two experiences with UPS...

After my first experience shopping cross border, I swore I would never buy anything stateside again - I was sent a bill after the fact (about a month later) for more than the original product and shipping total combined in additional fees from UPS. Note that if you call them out on their hidden fees (assuming it wasn't COD hidden charges), UPS may wipe out the charges. I refused to pay it due to the fact they do not give any forewarning whatsoever of these fees (nor will they tell you ahead of time what they are - so it is a complete shot in the dark and the fees are all over the map). They agreed to drop it as a "goodwill gesture" since I was a first (and last) time customer. There is absolutely NO excuse for hiding these fees the way they do - even if you call them up and ask what the fees might be, they WILL NOT tell you. Such shoddy business practices wipes them off my list for cross border shipping, and heck, even in country shipping.

I've had one seller on ebay mistakenly use them since, and they now require COD before you even get your product - which they will hold ransom until you pay (unless you refuse, which often may be the better choice unfortunately). In that case I ended up spending $30 extra to ship a car stereo faceplate on top of the $5 I paid for it and the initial $6 shipping charge. This can be very frustrating at times. That is $36 total shipping on a weightless, tiny and nearly worthless item. Pure insanity what UPS and FedEx pull on cross border shipping, and they should be ashamed of themselves for hiding the fees.

In short, a customer should not have figure out all the ins and outs with inside information to learn how to get a package shipped at a reasonable price when the prices/fees should all be up front. I will not buy anything stateside unless the seller agrees to ship USPS, plain and simple - nothing to worry about.

Another HUGE advantage to using USPS and Canada Post - they will not leave a package at your doorstep for anyone and everyone to walk away with like FedEx and UPS will. If you are not home at the time of delivery (most people are not) - it goes to the post office and they leave a card for you to pick it up. It is absolutely INSANE that companies will leave a product at the door step when they have no idea what it is, and how easily some kid can walk away with it - and I am sure if something did happen they would respond with "our responsibility ends once the package is delivered" or something.

Anyways, here is a post from a automotive message board I am on that explains some tips:

This is what I do and I only pay GST on the imported item (no duty or taxes). 1) Only deal with vendors who will ship USPS (United States Postal Service) surface or air mail. Unfortunately this involves a trip by them to the post office. Companies like Summit / Jegs or any of the other larger companys don't want to do this because they like the UPS / Fed Ex etc courier truck to come to their back door for package pickup. Going to the post office is a bit of a hassle for the high volume guys. Courier companys charge fee upon fee when the item gets to Canada (brokerage/duty/taxes/processing/bonding/management fees........on it goes....all of us Canadian enthusiasts have experienced this - its unbelievable how much $ this adds to the purchase price. 2) Tell the vendor to make sure they place on the customs declaration that these are "Auto Parts" ...... Under free trade and the auto manufacturing tax treatys that are in place (Ontario) all the Canadian Gov't will charge you is GST on the Canadian $ value of the item plus a $5.00 processing fee. If the declaration says moulding or carpet you are screwed so again make sure it says "Auto Parts".

I have shipped up tons of parts this way ......try it, it works and you save big Vs ripoff Canadian vendors. Most of my purchases are via Ebay (Mikes Montes for example) or this board where the vendor is normally more sympathetic to going to the post office. Ask them however before bidding/ordering.

Of course you shouldn't tell them something like it is "automotive parts" if it isn't as this would be illegal (not sure if there are other descriptions that will help here that may apply). Having it marked as a "gift" will get it to your door and NO extra cost provided it is under $30 or so, but again, it isn't proper (not that they could prove this one wrong).