Shaw & FM Stations

[seaegg]

Have any of you ever been able to get FM stations or any radio stations for that matter on Shaw?

[brucea]

Originally Posted by seaegg

Have any of you ever been able to get FM stations or any radio stations for that matter on Shaw?

I split the cable feed and fed it into my A/V reciever (the other split to the cable box), and I'm able to receive FM.

Shaw Fort McMurray.

Bruce

[seaegg]

Thanks I tried it and got good reception on some channels and crappy on others so I went back to using an old tv antenna which I now know gives better reception. Thanks for the reply.

[meshmellow]

Originally Posted by seaegg

Thanks I tried it and got good reception on some channels and crappy on others so I went back to using an old tv antenna which I now know gives better reception.

I think the FM service is neglected. I agree about the poor reception. Some of the stations I receive with the cable connected do not match what's on Shaw's FM list at https://secure.shaw.ca/channels/chlistings.asp?

In the Vancouver area, I'm curious as to why they include "la chaine culturelle" from Calgary, when we have it at 90.9 off air in Vancouver. The audio from Calgary is unlistenable, but without the cable the signal from Vancouver is great.

I have old rabbit ears handy myself and switch to those when needed.

meshmellow

[Friedchicken]

meshmellow, do you have any proof that the FM service is neglected? Have you tried calling them to fix it? Shaw maintains the same standards for it's FM service as the other channel broadcasts.

You are supposed to split the FM line in the CSE and apply a noise filter if you have alot of interference. The splitter behind the tv is not well sheilded and could be the source of your poor reception.

[meshmellow]

Originally Posted by Friedchicken

meshmellow, do you have any proof that the FM service is neglected? Have you tried calling them to fix it? Shaw maintains the same standards for it's FM service as the other channel broadcasts.

What I receive does not match what is in the list of FM stations Shaw provides. (The list of television channels does match what I receive.) I have avoided calling them on this, because I've had to have something like 5 service calls over television issues since December. I've been more concerned with getting my DCT6200 working reliably, figuring out why the DCT2500s reboot themselves (now know why), and having service restored when it went out repeatedly (due to a faulty splitter in the box outside the house). All this is fine. Everything has been fixed. I'm not complaining. As for FM, it's just easier to switch to the rabbit ears for now.

The stations from Seattle have considerable background hiss/noise/static and I suspect Shaw can't fix that, since the signals come from quite a distance.

La chaine culturelle (Vancouver) has been available for over a year. Seems to me, since this is a Vancouver station and CBC, it should have been added automatically without my having to make phone calls.

Originally Posted by Friedchicken

You are supposed to split the FM line in the CSE and apply a noise filter if you have alot of interference. The splitter behind the tv is not well sheilded and could be the source of your poor reception.

Shaw has provided the splitters for my FM receivers. Nothing has ever been mentioned about a noise filter when someone has been out here on a service call. I don't know what CSE is.

meshmellow

[57]

When I had "crappy stations" in Toronto I found that my "balun" (resistor like thing that changes the 75 ohm to 300 ohm) was faulty.

It was allowing "ingress" from local stations that were on, or near, the same frequency as the cable station into my upstairs receiver where the locals stations were strong enough to encroach.

I had no such difficulties with my receiver downstairs which as a direct connector for the cable.

It may not be the signal from the cable company at fault...

[Bucknet]

I think as time goes on you’ll see cable companies discontinue offering this type of legacy product. Not today but not too far in the future. In the beginning it was a way to offer an incentive to purchasing cable enabling a customer to receive some times weak FM stations with the type of clarity FM was meant to be heard. Today when a card fails at a head end it can become increasingly difficult to find a replacement. Add the push to digital and most companies offering 30+ Dolby enhanced commercial free stations, and I can see cable companies looking to put that bandwidth to what they may consider better use. FM broadcast is not a revenue generating product for cable companies, which is a big strike against it. But just my opinion which if you ask my friends isn’t worth much. lol

[jbamford]

I do believe that carrying local FM and AM stations over Cable FM is a requirement of the license of most cable companies.

[shawguy]

Originally Posted by seaegg

Thanks I tried it and got good reception on some channels and crappy on others so I went back to using an old tv antenna which I now know gives better reception. Thanks for the reply.

Other than it copying all the FM stations to new frequencies, here in Winnipeg you do not have advantage to cable Radio, there are only two stations that would be added and one does not currently work.

VoicePrint on 100.7 is interfering with a new station started up on that frequency, also you are supposed to get Rhim Jim on 107.9 false again, but you do get Weaher Radio on 104.4 it says 104.3 but 104.4 works better.

Shawguy in Winnipeg

[Friedchicken]

Meshmellow, here is my current list of stations offered through FM cable:

88.5 CKST - 1040 AM The Team 1040 - Sports Radio Vancouver
88.9 CKSR - 98.3 FM Star FM - Adult Contemporary Chilliwack
89.3 * CHKG - 96.1 FM Fairchild Radio - World Music Vancouver
89.7 ** KMPS - 94.1 FM Country Seattle
90.1 CKZZ - 95.3 FM Z 95.3 Hits / Top 40 / New Music Vancouver
90.7 KLSY - 92.5 FM Mix 92.5 KLSY - 80's 90's and Today Bellevue
91.3 CISL - 650 AM Oldies Richmond
91.7 CKNW - 980 AM News / Talk Radio Vancouver
92.1 KUBE - 93.1 FM KUBE 93 Urban Seattle
92.5 *** CJJR - 93.7 FM JR FM - New Country Vancouver
93.1 CBU - 690 AM CBC Radio 1 - Classical/Variety/Info Vancouver
93.5 KPLU - 88.5 FM Jazz / News Tacoma
93.9 CJSF Simon Fraser - Campus Radio Burnaby
94.3 CKBD - 600 AM Adult Favorites Seattle
94.7 CHMJ - 730 AM MOJO - Talk Radio for guys Vancouver
95.1 KUOW - 94.9 FM NPR - News and Variety Seattle
95.5 KJR - 95.7 FM Superhits of the 60's and 70's Seattle
95.9 KISW - 99.9 FM Album Rock Seattle
96.3 CKKQ - 100.3 FM The Q - Adult Rock Victoria
97.1 CKWX - 1130 AM News Weather and Traffic Vancouver
97.5 CHMB - 1320 AM Chinese Ethnic Radio Vancouver
98.1 KING - 95.1 FM Classical Seattle
98.5 CIOC - 98.5 FM Ocean FM - Easy Listening Victoria
98.9 KWJZ - 98.9 FM Smooth Jazz Bellevue
99.7 CFOX - 99.3 FM The Fox - New Rock Vancouver
100.1 CFUN - 1400 AM Talk 1410 - Talk Radio Vancouver
100.5 104.9 FM Clear FM Abbotsford
100.9 CFBT - 94.5 FM The Beat - Urban Vancouver
101.5 KPLZ - 101.5 FM Star 101.5 - Contemporary Hits Seattle
101.9 CITR - 101.9 FM UBC Campus Radio Vancouver
102.3 CBUF - 97.9 FM CBC French - Classical/Variety/Info Vancouver
102.9 CFRO - 102.7 FM Co-op Radio Vancouver
103.3 CJVB - 1470 AM Fairchild Radio - Ethnic Programming Vancouver
103.7 CKLG - 96.9 FM JACK FM - 80's 90's and current Rock Vancouver
104.1 CBC - 105.7 FM CBC Radio 2 - Classical/Variety/Information Regional
104.5 CFML BCIT - Campus Radio Burnaby
104.9 KQBZ - 100.7 The Buzz 100.7 - News / Talk Radio Seattle
105.3 CFMI - 101.1 FM Rock 101 - Classic Rock Vancouver
105.9 CBRF CBC French / Classical / Variety Calgary
106.3 CHQM - 103.5 FM QMFM - Adult Contemporary Vancouver
106.7 CISQ - 103.5 FM Mountain FM 107.1 - Adult Contemporary Squamish
107.5 KNDD - 107.7 107.7 The End - Alternative Rock Seattle
107.9 VOICE PRINT Reading Services Vancouver

Exceptions:
* 89.3 CHKG is not available in North Vancouver, and Abbotsford. Abbotsford customers will receive CJJR on 89.3
** 89.7 is CISQ Squamish in the North Vancouver system
*** 92.5 is not in use in Abbotsford CJJR is on 89.3

If you have any variances from this list, please let me know.

On other points:
I don't believe that it's mandatory for any cable provider to pick up every available radio station, but it's all a balancing act on popularity and diversity and finally bandwidth/frequency (88 to 108 MHz range) costs.

The CRTC does mandate that cable providers to support a certain % of local community and national broadcasts. The rest are optional.

[jbamford]

Originally Posted by Friedchicken

On other points:
I don't believe that it's mandatory for any cable provider to pick up every available radio station, but it's all a balancing act on popularity and diversity and finally bandwidth/frequency (88 to 108 MHz range) costs.

The CRTC does mandate that cable providers to support a certain % of local community and national broadcasts. The rest are optional.

Okay, so I checked the regulations (http://www.crtc.gc.ca/eng/LEGAL/BDU.HTM). Every "local" radio station must be carried. CBC stations must also be carried if they are not "local", one English and one French. Also, any education station as designed by the province must also be carried, if it is not "local". They're not obligated to carry any "transitional" station, likely important for digital radio.

They define what "local" means. For FM stations it's any station that has a 500 FV/m contour, for AM it's any station within 32 km of the local head end and for digital it's any station that includes the local service area.

[meshmellow]

Originally Posted by Friedchicken

Meshmellow, here is my current list of stations offered through FM cable:

If you have any variances from this list, please let me know.

Thank you Fried Chicken for all your work in providing that list, which is almost identical to the one from Shaw's website. Yours was very helpful, because it includes the actual frequencies of the stations that have been shifted. Perhaps the moving of frequencies is problematic, because "off air" reception would vary in different parts of the Lower Mainland. I am on the top of a very high point of land in Surrey and the receiver/tuner in question is near a window on the top floor.

It looks like I have problems similar to what 57 described with interference from strong signals in my area. (I even get different results in the evening and the daytime.) I have tried three different baluns and checked reception in another part of the house. Here is what I do get with the cable attached:

(I am leaving out the ones with bad static or one station on top of another - in other words, those that would not be pleasant to listen to.)

89.3 CHKG
90.7 KLSY - Bellevue - not bad reception
*90.9 CBC2 FRENCH - la chaine culturelle (not on Shaw, but coming in anyway)
92.1 CBC2 - Victoria
92.9 KISM - Bellingham
93.5 KPLU - light static
*93.7 CJJR - much better than cable 92.5 (this is with cable connected)
*94.5 CFBT - horrible at cable 100.9
95.1 KUOW - usually bad static - one I would really like to have
*95.3 CKZZ - better than cable 90.1
95.9 KISW - light static - would not be enjoyable
*97.7 CBUF - French CBC1 (not 97.9 on mine)
98.1 KING - fairly light static - not bad - can listen
98.5 CIOC - Ocean FM Victoria
98.9 KWJZ - Seattle - light hiss
99.7 CFOX - some hiss - about the same on 99.3
100.1 CFUN - AM
*100.3 CKKQ - Victoria (2 stations at cable 96.3)
100.5 Clear FM - also good on 104.9
101.5 KPLZ - light static
101.9 CITR- light static
102.3 CBUF - French CBC1
*103.5 CHQM - horrible at cable 106.3/jumble of sound)
*104.3 KAFE - Bellingham
*104.9 Clear FM
105.3 CFMI
*105.7 CBC2 English - much better than cable 104.1
*106.5 KWPZ Praise - Lynden, Washington
*107.1 CFSR? Valley Radio - Abbotsford
107.5 KNDD - Seattle - considerable static

* stations which are either not in the cable FM list or listed at a different frequency, which I receive even when the cable is connected.

The receiver/tuner in question is almost identical to the one in another part of the house which does a little better at receiving the cable signals (also Technics, but a "higher" model), so I don't think it's the receiver or balum. More likely my difficult location is at the root of the problem.

meshmellow

[meshmellow]

[quote="jbamford"]

Originally Posted by Friedchicken

Okay, so I checked the regulations (http://www.crtc.gc.ca/eng/LEGAL/BDU.HTM). Every "local" radio station must be carried.

They define what "local" means. For FM stations it's any station that has a 500 FV/m contour, for AM it's any station within 32 km of the local head end and for digital it's any station that includes the local service area.

Thanks for your effort in finding that ruling, jbamford. Seems to me that Shaw cable should be carrying French CBC2 - FM (la chaine culturelle) then. It started broadcasting in the Vancouver area on September 22nd, 2002. It can be received off air at 90.9, but is a little weak in some areas. Curiously Shaw substitutes the equivalent station from Calgary. Perhaps the Calgary signal is listenable in some areas of the Lower Mainland, but I can't get decent sound on cable from that one anywhere in my house. With rabbit ears, it is fine. It is a pain to keep switching antenna inputs, though.

I will have to check on the 500FV/m contour requirement, although I have little idea of what that means.

As for the AM stations, I guess they are on the cable. It seems to me that I could receive them at one time, but most are unlistenable now (I can't tell from the static if some are even there at all.)

meshmellow

[Friedchicken]

While living at a high point is great for receiving off air stations from afar, it has a negative effect when you are trying to shield against it. It's a common issue with ingression when off air or rogue frequencies leak into a cable system. Is poor reception on your lower tv channels common? That is the first sign of it. All it takes is a bad coupler or a patch cable with a cracked case.