ON - London, St. Thomas, Woodstock, Goderich - OTA

[RingtailedFox]

the barrie station was probably CKVR-TV 3, a CBC-turned-A affiliate owned by CTV (formerly owned by CHUM Television)

[Emerald_Boar]

@panamark
Thanks for the ghosting info.

@Davage
I cant see why there would be a antenna restriction by law? LookTV (sold out to rogers) uses a 6 foot tripod. Bell/Shaw sticks Dishes on roofs all the time (wihtout grounding). Most of the buildings downtown have antennas on them. So you should be safe to stick a tripod on the roof with little worries.

If you intend to go 6'+ higher the your roof top. Put up a full tower.

Dont forget to read full installion instructions.

I dont think that there will be any issues with your neighbours. So long as your antenna isnt an "eyesore".

Read ya l8r,
Al

[Davage]

Emerald Boar - Regarding antenna being an "eyesore" - None of my neighbours have complained about my 8ft satellite dish in the back yard, so I'm guessing that an outdoor antenna shouldn't be too much of an issue for them.

I am not exactly sure which model of antenna I am getting yet, but all of the ones that I've looked at are pretty modern looking. I'm sure that putting up an antenna will raise questions from some of the neighbours similar to what I got when I installed the 8ft dish such as "Do those things still work?" I don't think that most people realize that an outdoor antenna will receive more than 1 channel.

[Emerald_Boar]

@davage

I recommend that you get 2 different antennas.
One for VHF - GTN(6), A(10), CTV(13) & SRC(7) are assigned to use the VHF after DTV switch. Plus Erie has a nice multiplex on 12 (NBC, CBS & CW). If you can get it.

And one for UHF - Most of the local channels use this. TVO(18), SUN(19),OM2(20), CITY(31), CTS(38), OM1(48), CBC(49).
Plus you can pick up channels from Detroit, Cleveland, Erie or Buffalo on good DXing nights.

Read ya l8r,
Al

PS. Hopefully CBC combines its SRC feed into its main feed. But it likely CBC would be able to get a higher budget if they had 2 broadcast instead of one.

[PanaMark]

hi Guy's
As you may already know I treat OTA as a hobby here from my home in north London, On with the nearest intersection which is Sunningdale and Adelaide. My advantage from this location is elevation.
I own a two story home and take advantage of this. I have mounted a Channel Master tripod on my roof. This brings my height for my antenna between 30 to 35 feet above the ground. Height plays an importance regarding receiving signals. With this in mind I have no need for a tower to mount my antenna.
I own a few Channel Master 4221HD antennas. I have modified two of them following the procedure mentioned in another thread.
Keep in mind we (anyone north of the 401) are roughly 100-120 miles from any Americian DTV market. This includes Buffalo, Erie, Youngstown, Cleveland, Toledo, and Detroit.
I have tried a bunch of different configurations over the the past 6 months. I have stacked, ganged, combined, amplified....you get the point and all have it's advantages.
At the end of the day I have had the most success with a one antenna system at this point in this hobby.
Recently I realized that when I introduced amplification (preamp) to my system I would get what I thought was over amplification on channel 10 but I have now figured out it is FM bleeding from local FM towers. I now use an FM trap and this repairs the issue.
The Cleveland market is by far my most reliable choice. With the modifications I have made to my antenna I also pick up on occasions Youngstown, Erie, and Detroit while pointing towards Cleveland from the side lobes of the antenna.
I have heard from some of you's in London particularly those that live in apartment buildings facing the proper direction to a market have had nice success too. The whole height factor plays a major factor regarding this matter.
I am going to ditch the two antenna system for now, realizing the from our location anytime you introduce a combiner and another antenna that many issues result from them. It is hard enough trying to pick up fringe signal's without complicating things and introducing more things in the loop that cost precious signal loss.
Recently I have upgraded my coax run from the bedroom to the roof in hopes this will repair an issue I have had recently with some preamp mast's that were constantly frying. I think I may have found the issue as recently while upgrading my coax I was doing some checks with my volt meter and I found AC current between the house ground and the one I introduced for the mast.
I had the coax grounding block ground running to the house ground but the mast ground went to a seperate ground that I introduced (a 4ft cooper rod driven into clay soil). I now have the coax ground block on the same one as the mast. I am keeping my fingers crossed that these things I have done will repair the pre amp mast frying issue.
A big thanks to everyone whom has assisted my to this date. I appreciate all the advise and insights. I would have never got to the point where I am with out it.
Thank you
Mark

[BCF]

Panamark, you too have been helpful for reception of OTA DTV for Londoners. I too have learned lots regarding OTA tv reception.

For the past week or so, I've kept my antenna pointing towards Cleveland, and tested OTA reception of US DTV. I've found William Hepburn's
Worldwide Tropospheric Ducting Forecasts to be an invaluable reference website. Although the forecasts change each day, the "near-term" forecasts provided seem to be fairly accurate.

On any given Tropo day, WKYC-HD 3-1 (NBC) & WXPLUS 3-2, WEWS-DT 5-1 (ABC), WVIZ-HD 25-1 (PBS) & it's 3 subchannels, and WQHS-DT 61-1 (UNI) come in relatively strong.

I find WUAB-DT 43-1 (MyTV) & THIS TV 43-2 and WBNX-HD 55-1 (CW) are not always steadily available on Tropo days. This is probably due to WUAB 43-1/THIS 43-2 is broadcast from Lorain,OH, and WBNX 55-1 is broadcast from Akron,OH, not Cleveland.

This has been my experience for DTV channels originating from the Cleveland area. I think this week I'll either re-point my existing DIY 4-bay bowtie antenna towards Detroit, or build a new antenna, keeping one pointing towards Cleveland, and the other towards Detroit. I'll switch between feeds using an A-B type switch. Seems simple enough, considering the challenges and difficulties ganging, stacking, etc antennas cause.

Hopefully once the Canadian OTA DTV conversion is complete, OTA DTV for the "local" Canadian channels (like CBC, CTV, Global), will be equally impressive. So far, London's only DTV channel (Suntv 19-1) is great.

[goforit]

Panamark:

Nice recap.

We all share in each other's experiences. Dxing is always an added bonus to OTAing.

Just wanted to let you know that I'll probabaly be getting a 91XG in a couple weeks; I've heard so many good things- the monster gain it has, and for my area I think I would benefit from the narrow beam width. We'll see what happens..., stay tuned.

[micah]

Originally Posted by goforit

Just wanted to let you know that I'll probabaly be getting a 91XG in a couple weeks; I've heard so many good things- the monster gain it has, and for my area I think I would benefit from the narrow beam width. We'll see what happens..., stay tuned.

I'm eager to hear how it compares to your stack! I'd love to find something better than my hacked 4228HD.

[PanaMark]

@goforit.
ew cool, very interested in your results when they become available.

I am considering adding a rotor in my setup.
What I could do on heavy tropo nights and early mornings is I can rotate and DX without having to run up on the roof. I will not go on the roof in the dark. This as you would know is not a safe practice.
Since I am done experimenting with a two antenna set up, I think this would probably be the best scenario for the London area.
I'm in the early research stages for a rotor.
Hey you guys in London that are considering pre amplification for your antenna please keep in mind that there are some very strong FM signals in the area. This causes havoc for channel 10 CFPL and 13 CKCO.
I have tried an FM trap and it does an excellent job on keeping interference out of these two channels.
My only issue now is when my Winegard preamp comes in it does not have a built in FM trap.
I am researching for a stand alone outside mounted FM trap that will block all FM frequencies. If you know of a good one could you please PM me with a suggestion. I have not really found much on these FM traps in the forum.
Regards
Mark

[mjjl]

I find WUAB-DT 43-1 (MyTV) & THIS TV 43-2 and WBNX-HD 55-1 (CW) are not always steadily available on Tropo days. This is probably due to WUAB 43-1/THIS 43-2 is broadcast from Lorain,OH, and WBNX 55-1 is broadcast from Akron,OH, not Cleveland.

Although WUAB is licensed to Lorain and WBNX is licensed to Akron, both stations have their transmitters in Parma along with the other Cleveland stations. WVPX-23, on the other hand, has its transmitter in Akron.

[goforit]

What's the strongest Cleveland station? What's the RF?

[BCF]

Originally Posted by goforit

What's the strongest Cleveland station? What's the RF?

According to http://www.stationindex.com/tv/markets/Cleveland-Akron, WBNX (CW) is the strongest Cleveland area DTV channel at 1000kW on RF30 (digital 55-1). However, like many others that frequent this forum, I find WEWS (ABC) on RF15 (digital 5-1) at 870 kW comes in much better and more reliable than all other Cleveland area DTV channels, during Tropo days, of course.

Also check out Rabbit Ears for details on DTV channels.

[PanaMark]

I stopped by Save and Replay today to upgrade my setup.
I picked up and Antennas Direct DB8 and a Channel Master 7778.
Let me tell you guys, it works!
Most Cleveland stations are coming in now and at peak signal strengths.
This is truly unbelievable as I have never had these type of signal receptions from most of the Cleveland aside from decent tropo days.
Finally the right stuff for my location.
Even 23-1 ION is staying strong.
Note: 19 WOIO CBS and 8-1 WJW FOX does not come in.
I have taken pictures and will post them in the appropiate area.

stay tuned....
regards
Mark

[Emerald_Boar]

@Panamark
Does CM 7778 has separate VHF & UHF inputs? (Or is it the CM7777 that has separate VHF & UHF inputs).

Since FM is on VHF. I guess that solve your FM overload issue. Also it will prevent you from picking up VHF channels. Or you need a simple VHF setup <:

@BCF
If you look at the rabbitears.info database. WBNX uses a Directional antenna. Whereas WEWS uses a Non Directional antenna.
However when I study the coverage maps. WBNX broadcasts north and South with equal strength. Reduce signal strength East to West. And it appears that WBNX supports Canada better then what WEWS does. But results seem to support WEWS is alot easier to receive then of WBNX (for London)

@all
A quick break down of Cleveland channels.
WWJ rf 8 - 8.1 FOX
WOIO rf 10 - 19.1 CBS [due to CFPL using rf 10 you will never be able to get this channel in London]
WEWS rf 15 - 5.1 ABC [Second strongest Digital channel for the London area. SunTv is #1.]
WKYC rf 17 - 3.1 NBC
WVPX rf 23 - 23.1 ION
WVIZ rf 26 - 25.1 PBS
WUAB rf 28 - 43.1 MyN [tvo from kitchener also uses rf 28]
WBNX rf 30 - 55.1 CW [On paper this should be Cleveland strongest channel for London.]
WQHS rf 34 - 61.1 UNI [very reliable signal for London]
WGGN rf 42 - 42.1 REG [I have locked onto this channel. Maybe viewable if CKCO3 switches over to DTV on rf 27 vs current rf 42]
WDLI rf 49 - 50.1 TBN [You may get this channel for a short while. But CBC has been given rf 49 for DTV use]

[PanaMark]

@Panamark
Does CM 7778 has separate VHF & UHF inputs? (Or is it the CM7777 that has separate VHF & UHF inputs).

yes it does