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Old 2010-02-09, 01:24 AM   #76
WillDekkard
 
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Sorry as I did not read this entire thread. I am sure there is more info posted here in this thread then at the FreeHD Canada website.

The site has not had an update in over 6 months and has not changed in a year ?

If they are serious about getting up and running? You would think they would want to create some buzz and support to gain furture customers? Well, maybe not? JMO
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Old 2010-02-09, 02:52 AM   #77
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not the weather network, the text only environment canada weather channel.
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Old 2010-02-09, 08:58 AM   #78
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I know which channel you are talking about, I was just saying you would lucky if you got Weather Network let alone Environment Canada. I think that is a Shaw channel anyway.

merve - in order for Shaw and Bell to add more HD channels it would require the broadcasters to become motivated because as long as they hold off on creating more HD channels there is only so much Shaw or Bell can offer or add to the lineup. Then again there's always the issue of bandwidth and limitations with all or most providers. They could fix this, but they don't want to it seems.
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Old 2010-02-09, 01:19 PM   #79
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I dunno, it used to be on videon back in the day too. It's basically environment Canada weather data on a computer screen type deal. they could fairly easily make a 720p environment canada public service channel with pretty high def images of canada in the background, but it wouldn't necessarily have to be broadcast in HD.

But its all moot anyways until they actually launch their services.
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Old 2010-02-09, 02:47 PM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackburst View Post
I can't understand what the difference will be between them and Bell TV & Shaw Direct.
Local channels will be free on freesat. Those other providers have them for pay.
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And why would you want to pay for their hardware anyway. You might as well go for Bell TV or Shaw Direct. Makes no sense. Even if they came onto the market, Bell TV and Shaw Direct would adjust their packages in order not to loose clients.
And Bell/Shaw making their locals free would be bad how?
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In the end everything will be HD anyway. If you get HD OTA you have no reason to purchase this service. If you have Bell TV / Shaw Direct, they will respond with new HD packages for you. What a waste of time and money.
This service is HD, or will be as long as the stations provide an HD signals to them.

You might be confusing HD with DTV broadcasting. Part of the intent of FreesatHD is to provide a platform for local stations to digitally broadcast from, instead of setting up a DTV transmitter, or possible in addition to, whatever the CRTC and IC decide.
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Old 2010-02-09, 02:48 PM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrazyInSane View Post
Whether I go for this will depend on how simsubbing will work/be implemented with FreeHD
That remains to be seen, but given the presumption they will have actual locals on spot beams, it is likely that they will sim-sub at the receiver, like Shaw Direct does.
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Old 2010-02-09, 02:55 PM   #82
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Originally Posted by Blackburst View Post
If this whole thing goes through, I think you'll be shocked when you find out that just becuase they have the word "free" in their name, that doesn't mean free. You will have to pony up some money for it.
My understanding, is that after the hardware purchase, there is no more costs just for locals.

The money will be made in subscription to specialty and premium services, as well as an EPG and likely DVR service.
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And I'm sure, the CRTC will require them to carry all those useless must carry speciality channels that they require the BDU's to do.
Likely they will, but as their basic pay tier.
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Old 2010-02-09, 03:41 PM   #83
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This is a joke. You will only get your locals for free. Everything else will be $$$$ including out of market and time shift OTA channels.
That's $300/per tv set for your locals.

They will load 24 SD channels or 8 HD/transponder in MPEG4 8PSK. They will NOT use DVB so that you have to buy the equipment from them. That leaves off the shelf DirecTV equipment that they can buy in bulk for $100/unit. So they will make $200/unit profit.
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Old 2010-02-09, 03:42 PM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackburst
I can't understand what the difference will be between them and Bell TV & Shaw Direct.
About $220 over the first two years.
FreeSat = $300 for basic package.
Others = $100 + ~$35/mo for basic package.

FreeSat is using free channels to get a foot in the door in the Canadian BDU market. They will also be looking to get people to buy other packages once they have the receivers. It also looks like they will be trying to get extra revenue by distributing signals to other BDUs. Personally, I think the Canadian market is too small to support another satellite BDU.
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Old 2010-02-09, 11:45 PM   #85
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"They will load 24 SD channels or 8 HD/transponder in MPEG4 8PSK. They will NOT use DVB so that you have to buy the equipment from them. That leaves off the shelf DirecTV equipment that they can buy in bulk for $100/unit. So they will make $200/unit profit."

How do you know this? For starters, I thought they are not carrying any SD channels?
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Old 2010-02-10, 08:46 AM   #86
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there is no such thing as "off the shelf" direct tv hardware. They use proprietary equipment and only they have the licence for DSS based systems.

Turbo 8psk is what Dishnetwork uses. There are now FTA equipment that can handle 8psk already in the market. They will use DVB for sure. It would be too expensive for them to licence DSS from DirectTV.
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Old 2010-02-10, 09:13 AM   #87
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This will be an encrypted system so they will use either NDS or Kudelski. Either way they will be able to buy receivers in bulk at around $100 each.

Bell and SD could offer this same service level tomorrow by offering the same deal with receivers and dish install at real - not subsidized - cost.

Remember Primestar, USSB and Voom. If the US with 10X the population of Canada cannot support 3 satellite companies, how can Canada?
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Old 2010-02-10, 11:16 AM   #88
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Originally Posted by smootherator View Post
there is no such thing as "off the shelf" direct tv hardware. They use proprietary equipment and only they have the licence for DSS based systems.
DirecTV owns the "DSS" format, outside of licenses they pay for MPEG2/4, Dolby, and a few other things. AFAIK, their HD is now full DVB S2 MPEG4. The benefit of using DirecTV hardware is that it simply exists on the market, so there would be little lead time for R&D to get hardware on shelves. current DirecTV hardware also directly can do Ka band.
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Turbo 8psk is what Dishnetwork uses. There are now FTA equipment that can handle 8psk already in the market. They will use DVB for sure. It would be too expensive for them to licence DSS from DirectTV.
It is pirate FTA hardware that does that though. There is noe way a legitimate provider would let that happen.

I don't think it would cost a heck of a lot more to license one technology over another.
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Old 2010-02-10, 11:31 AM   #89
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Correct me if I am wrong here but how can they offer locals for free without approval from the broadcasters?! I would think CTV, Global et. al. would have to give their okay to this first so basically right now FreeHD is just full of empty promises. I think they were trying to get the CRTC to mandate that they be allowed to offer locals for free but the CRTC sidestepped the issue by not formally ruling on this part of their application.

I agree with others, I don't think Canada is big enough to support 3 DTH providers, hopefully though what this will do is get Bell & Shaw to improve their services if they sense that FreeHD will actually launch and they will have a competitor to deal with.
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Old 2010-02-10, 12:49 PM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mon_Key_C View Post
This will be an encrypted system so they will use either NDS or Kudelski. Either way they will be able to buy receivers in bulk at around $100 each.
Why does it have to be either of those two, there are a number of other security systems out there for pay TV.

Of course, partnering with DirecTV or Echostar for hardware will provide the scale of users to make receiver relaistically affordable.

I don't thing the wholesale price for a a quality HD non-DVR DVB-S2 receiver would be that low. Maybe $199 at the lowest, which makes the $300 price realistic. You have to keep in mind most pay providers sell their receivers at cost or lower, on the hopes to pull in subscribers.
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Bell and SD could offer this same service level tomorrow by offering the same deal with receivers and dish install at real - not subsidized - cost.
But as long as nobody else is giving away free locals, they won't.
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Remember Primestar, USSB and Voom. If the US with 10X the population of Canada cannot support 3 satellite companies, how can Canada?
You might be right with Primestar, but I think their downfall was their inability to grow and innovate.

Voom was a niche HD service before HD became popular enough to support it.

USSB is a different case entirely, in that it wasn't competitive with DirecTV exactly, so they cannot be called a separate provider. Rather it was a co-provider alongside DirecTV, which carried one suite of channels, while DirecTV carried another, both on the same satellite and receiver platform, and one could subscribe to both with the one receiver.
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