Windows 8 General Discussion

[ScaryBob]

Most companies don't look at it that way. Driver upgrades are an expense and doesn't generate revenue. It's the first thing to get axed. I also doubt that printer makers are losing money on new printers these days. It's a mature technology and manufacturing is done in low cost countries.

The other side to the argument is that MS is failing to provide backward support for drivers. Which makes more sense, manufacturers updating drivers for thousands of devices or MS providing backward compatibility? MS takes a slash and burn approach to supporting older hardware. To their credit, MS makes an effort to support older software but hardware does not receive the same treatment.

[753951]

Originally Posted by ScaryBob

The other side to the argument is that MS is failing to provide backward support for drivers. Which makes more sense, manufacturers updating drivers for thousands of devices or MS providing backward compatibility? MS takes a slash and burn approach to supporting older hardware. To their credit, MS makes an effort to support older software but hardware does not receive the same treatment.

They are damned if they do and damned if they don't. In order to improve stability and security they HAD to change driver model. In old model, every driver was running at same level as kernel and had same access rights. It was sooo easy to crash or corrupt OS.

Also, they don't have access to hardware specs. Only manufacturers of hardware know enough to write device driver for it.

[ScaryBob]

I understand the issues surrounding hardware drivers. MS could support older hardware drivers with an emulator and run it in a sandbox. They do it for software, such as MS Office, with Win7.

[audacity]

ScaryBob, the complexity of what you're proposing is monumental, unless you're going to require all other applications which will require this device to also run inside the same sandbox. And what sandbox do you believe that Microsoft Office runs in?

Besides, old hardware is... old. Computer gear usually doesn't "live" that long (5 years, tops?) and that basically means that the benefits of putting all the compatibility shims in your OS has a limited time benefit, but a much longer term cost. If the hardware is so old already that the IHV isn't going to invest anything more in it, how much money/effort should Microsoft put in?

Personally, I think that driver support is what separates the wheat from the chaff. It's how you can tell the difference between the "good" companies (NVIDIA. HP, etc) and the "bad" companies (Creative, Canon, etc) - at least in terms of PC peripherals.

I think Microsoft is doing the right thing though. There is very little innovation in printers now, so Microsoft can just make a "class driver" and then the printers makers can produce their products to align with that specification so it will work with the class driver. Then they won't need to invest in Windows drivers themselves.

[mellaby]

I hope your right audacity. I have a fairly new hp 3050a printer that works with Win 8, but I can't install the software to use the scanner and other options. I'm hoping HP will bring out new software for it that's compatible with Win8.

[audacity]

Well, if the OS can see the device(s) then you can always get 3rd party software that will scan documents for you.

[ScaryBob]

The problem is that the O/S doesn't see the device because there is no working driver. There is one scanner app that includes its own drivers but it's fairly expensive. It would be better to just replace a cheap scanner.

[753951]

I suspect you are referring to SilverFast. Have you tried VueScan? You can download free 30-day evaluation copy and check if that solves your issue. If it works and you want to purchase it, price is also not that exorbitant.

[ScaryBob]

It is VueScan I was thinking of. It's probably not worth buying for a sub-$100 scanner. It would be worthwhile for a high end model. The Pro edition would be needed to ensure Win8 compatibility.

[Dr.Dave]

Windows 8 will be available as an upgrade or on a new PC starting October 26.

Source: http://windowsteamblog.com/windows/b...ilable-on.aspx

[e268]

My Sony Vaio notebook came with Vista Business which is very slow to load, so I just let it sleep, but waking up is still slow. I refused to give Bill another $100+ for WIN7. But, I have been running WIN8RP for a couple of months, and it is fast to load, and fast to wake up. I will buy it for $40 which will be a good deal for me.

BTW, I do not mind the Metro interface. All my applications go to desktop which behaves just like WIN7. Starting to use IE instead of my usual Firefox. I think this is the best Windows so far. I might even abandon Linus since it boots so fast.

[j0dest3r]

Yeah I saw something about those new Samsung Ultrabooks and Windows booting in like 9 seconds or something like that.

I have Windows 8 on a Dual monitor workstation. It's actually pretty sweet! Desktop on one monitor with Metro on the other. My most favorite feature is having desktop up on both sides and having the task bar on both screens!

You can pop up the start menu on either screen by clicking on it in the hot corner where the start menu used to be.

Also noticed IE 10 Metro supports flash! Not sure if that is going to be making it into the final version, I suspect it might. That would make Windows RT and the Blackberry Playbook the only tabs that support Flash. (not sure about other Android tabs but the Nexus 7 doesn't support Flash)

[viper359]

I think I will upgrade all 5 PC's in my house. Right now, they are all running Win7 64 bit home premium. <---Getting the home premium was my biggest mistake. I should have spent the extra money. Dealing with 5PC's and not having the control ability I was used to in XP drives me nuts. Updating alone is a PITA.

At the time though, I only had two computers to deal with, my "server" and my wife's computer. Then bought a Dell system for the parents, just because I was too lazy to build another, (don't even get me started on that nightmare with the crap they pre-load) then got another two more computers for the home.

The boot times seem cool, but I doubt I will see much of an improvement, I am using an SSD as the boot drive, so I already see sub 25 second power on to fully logged in.

The next IE is what I am looking forward to. I have been a loyal supporter of Firefox and Thunderbird. However, their last few updates have wreaked havoc on me. Thunderbird constantly crashing, and firefox not loading websites. Hours upon hours spent trying to figure out the problems. For email, I just got fed up and switched back to Outlook. Thunderbird had literally finished installing the update, restarted itself, and crashed.

The new restart feature might just have me turn auto updates back on. That was an annoyance, it restarting without any real warning. 20 minutes is nothing. Especially if I am running an program overnight on the server. Drove me nuts to wake up to find a restart had occurred for an update, and the work was lost because it rebooted before the application had completed what it was doing.

Microsoft Security Essentials is something I do not want. I have specific programs for specific functions. For example, virus scanning, I use Vipre. I don't want an all in one solution. I find they very rarely work as well as tailored solutions.

The new windows search, I hope its not a resource hog like it in on WIN7. I have this shut off.

Does anyone know if WIN8 will have anything tailored for it and SSD's? I know when I switched to an SSD I had to do a few specific things to ensure longevity and performance.

[audacity]

I know when I switched to an SSD I had to do a few specific things to ensure longevity and performance.

And what were those things?

Windows 7 should automatically detect your SSD and would not run defrag on it. Is there anything else that really needs to be done?

[mellaby]

It's a good thing win 7 was smart enough to not defrag your HD. I guess it's a no no for SSD's to be defragged. I don't know if there is anything else you have to do. Good move though, I'm waiting till later this year to get a ultrabook.