Grounding Info & Standards: OTA/Dish/CATV/Telecom

[Armby]

So I have spent hours going through this thread and then searching for a suitable in-line coax surge protector I can use at the cable entrance for my Bell TV service.

I have found various places to get TII 210/212 series protectors but I am not confident that these pass the necessary bandwidth (up to 1.5 GHz or do I need up to 2.0 GHz?). Lots of places sell a device call the Surgender SE-10 and variations but no where is there even minimum technical specs on this device, which makes me leery.

What are other people using to add a surge protector on the coax before it enters the house?

[roger1818]

Armby, it does look like the TII 210/212 series protectors are only rated for 1GHz, which makes them only useful for OTA and CATV. For satellite, you would need a 3GHz protector. A quick Google found the L-com AL-F (rated to 2.5GHz, which should be good enough). You could then screw that into any grounding block (which should be fine up to 3GHz as it is basically just a coupler with a ground screw). The Source sells a dual grounding block, which would be good if you have dual coax.

I am sure there are other options as well. Check your local FTA store and see if they have anything.

[Armby]

Thanks, Roger1818. I don't know how you did that with a "quick Google search" I spent more than an hour yesterday searching and didn't come up with anything. Much appreciated.

[ScaryBob]

I need to find a place that sells 8-foot grounding rods...

I used a 10' length of 1/2" galvanized steel water pipe. It's probably better than most of the grounding rods sold by retailers. To get a proper galvanized steel grounding rod, an electrical wholesaler is the best bet. The local Home Depot sells grounding plates. YMMV.

[jmrudow]

I have found various places to get TII 210/212 series protectors

Armby, would you happen to have a list of these places? I'd prefer to buy one of these instead of a grounding block + surge suppresor.

You could then screw that into any grounding block

roger1818, if I were to screw a surge suppressor directly onto a grounding block, would it matter which one came before the other?

[roger1818]

^^^I would put the surge suppressor between the grounding block and the antenna.

[jmrudow]

This seems like it would work as a combo surge protector / ground block for my OTA antenna:

https://www.durhamradio.com/sp200-ld...protector.html

("LDG SP-200 Surge Protector 200 Watts" from Durham Radio)... would this be somewhat equivalent to TII 210/212 series protectors?

[jmrudow]

...annnnnnd - how do you feel about tinned copper wire vs bare copper wire vs insulated copper wire? Is it necessary to get tinned or insulated to avoid any discoloration on the outside of my house from the copper wire when it oxidizes?

[roger1818]

The LDG SP-200 you posted has a 50 ohm characteristic impedance. TVs here in North America use 75 ohm coax, so that would not be appropriate for use.

[jflarin]

Hi,

I've been trying to ground my antenna according to Canadian Electrical Code (2012) and it has a devastating effect on the number of channel I can pick-up now. My setup is:

1) Antenna.
2)60 feet of RG6 going down to 2 feet of the soil
3)gounding block
4)RG6 to go inside the house
5)Amplifier
6)another 60ish feet to go back up to the TV
7)TV.

In the past, before I installed the grounding block, I had
1)antenna
2)30 feet (of good RG6)
3)amplifier
4)10 feet of coax
5)TV

And everything was nice (beside the fact that the mast and the antenna wasn't grounded.) Now I'm trying to see if I could go back to my old setup with less wire. Reading the code I see:

54-800 Lightning arresters for receiving stations
(1) A lightning arrester shall be provided for each lead-in conductor from an outdoor antenna to a receiving
station, except where such a lead-in conductor is protected by a continuous grounded metal shield
between the antenna and the point of entrance to the building.

Nowhere is it written that the grounding block has to be close to the soil (I say soil not to mix up with "the ground" which is the connection to the soil).

I also see:

54-908 Grounding conductor to be run in a straight line
The grounding conductor shall be run in as straight a line as is practicable from the lightning arresters or antenna mast, or both, to the grounding electrode.

I don't see anything saying that the grounding conductor has to be as short as possible?

Am I missing something?

Thanks,

jf

[stampeder]

Grounding usually does not affect signal reception, so all that extra coax cable you added is probably to blame. Once you've returned to your original amount of coax cable just run copper wire from the grounding block's screw terminal to a ground rod and you will be fine.

[roger1818]

jflarin, Getting a pre-amp that you can put up near the antenna should solve your problem (and make things even better). As Stampeder says, the issue is the coax between the antenna and amplifier.

[jflarin]

Originally Posted by roger1818

jflarin, Getting a pre-amp that you can put up near the antenna should solve your problem (and make things even better). As Stampeder says, the issue is the coax between the antenna and amplifier.

Hi,

Regarding the pre-amp: yes, it is my plan to get a CM7777. It is just that it is a 90$+tx solution. If some of the weaker channels are marginal, then reducing the noise at the source by putting the amplifier close to the antenna makes sense.

But the old cable was 35 feet. The new cable is 60 feet (both RG6, different build, but RG6 still) I have problem believing that adding 25 feet of RG6 can take my second strongest US channel at 8/10 and bring it down to 0/10.

In any ways, I've been pumping money to reach electrical code compliance (to ground the mast) and so far I haven't had succees because of other problem (not related to the loss channels). So to get the optimal (cheapest) solution, I'd rather make sure I have all the right fact before I try something else. Putting the grounding block 20 feet from the ground would make sense in any ways, independently of the amplifier location. But is it compliant with the code?

Thanks,

jf

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by jflarin

I have problem believing that adding 25 feet of RG6 can take my second strongest US channel at 8/10 and bring it down to 0/10.

Agreed. My guess is a bad connection. It is very easy for a single strand of braid to touch the centre conductor, with devastating results. This is the most common source of problems.

[stampeder]

Can we put a ground block anywhere on our coax lines? Theoretically yes if it is properly grounded, but in reality, no.

Theoretically, if you were to lay out two new, equal 10 meter copper wires in parallel and on one put a ground block half way through it but on the other put a ground block near the end you would have a very difficult time detecting any difference in how quickly or efficiently an electrical charge applied to the beginning of the wires would be drained off to ground.

In reality, the final word is that the appropriate Electrical Code requirements for grounding your home must be followed and definitely not messed up or thrown out-of-Code by your OTA grounding solution. As discussed many times in this thread, we always try to keep any excess electrical charges from entering the building. If this is not possible, we always try to establish the most direct route of grounding to the power panel's ground point.

So, putting it plainly, make sure that your home is grounded according to Code, then ground your incoming OTA/Dish/CATV/Telecom connections to it so that your home remains within Code afterwards.