Switch on front of PC faulty, power supply or something else - Page 2 - Canadian TV, Computing and Home Theatre Forums

ScaryBob · 2012-02-09, 02:03 PM

Depending on the PCs, I would be tempted to just leave things as is. If one of the PCs is fairly new and/or valuable, I would put a new P/S in it. It really does not matter which P/S is in which computer provided that they are rated to supply enough power. The 8 pin ATX connector is not necessary unless a high powered CPU is installed.

Jake · 2012-02-09, 04:31 PM

I was "youtubing" and found that in some instances you can switch your meter over to AC voltage to see how much is present. I would need to find a few places on the board where I could check it. I would think the CPU fan header, the front switch header. This assumes I can get it running.

One factor complicating my life is that the cables are modular and sealed so that you cannot probe the connector pins from the back.

lightbender · 2012-02-09, 05:45 PM

didn't you say it worked on the old PC? You could check for dirty power on the old PC with the suspected faulty PSU. You connect it up to an unused molex connector on the PSU. Make sure its the same rail that is connected to the PC. You probably need a reference, compare the spare PSU with the suspected faulty PSU.

The other thing that could be happening is that the old PC doesn't put much of a load on the suspected faulty PSU so it looks like its fine. i.e. the PSU keeps the power steady under a certain load. Where, your current PC puts out more of a load, and triggers the PS to fail.

There might be a much easier way to verify if your PSU is bad. You should be able to easily remove the front cover off of the PSU, should be only a couple of screws. Check the caps carefully in the secondary section of the PSU (the smaller ones, not the big ones on the primary) for a rounded top or any signs of leakage. The top only needs to be slightly rounded to indicate that it has failed. Yo can post pictures if you are not sure.

Jake · 2012-02-09, 06:30 PM

Thanks for the tips lightbender.

Yes it worked in the old PC.

The load I don't think is a factor since I removed everything except the ram and CPU. I am well under 150W total for testing according to PSU calculator.

I think I will try checking the caps. This is more of an educational experience. Plus the satisfaction knowing if it was the motherboard, psu or both. I would hate to purchase a new PSU and only find out that in a few months I am back where I started.

Jake · 2012-02-11, 05:08 PM

Well I finally took the PSU out and pulled the cover.

I see 3 caps that are slightly bulged.

3300 uF 16V
2200 uF 10V
3300 uF 10V

That is enough to convince me to scrap the PSU. For fun I measured the AC voltage on the rails. I know it is rms but I got,

5VDC: 0.8CAV
3.3VDC: 0.2VAC
12VDC: VAC unstable.

The PSU board is labelled ATX 66. When I googled I found this unit linked below. The exterior is different but the components inside are identical. The reviewers were not impressed.

http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/artic...r-Supply/413/1

lightbender · 2012-02-11, 05:23 PM

Don't scrap it. Its probably just the caps that need to be replaced. Replace all the the caps that are bulged plus all the rest except for the 2 big primary ones, and the tiny secondary ones. Hardware secrets are pretty tough, the unit should be okay for your old PC. You can get info on which caps to replace from badcaps.net

Also, check your motherboard for bloated caps as well. Those are easily replaced as well.

ScaryBob · 2012-02-11, 05:30 PM

I wouldn't bother fixing the P/S unless the caps are really cheap. A new P/S is maybe $40-$60 after sales and rebates. It will have better power regulation, better failure protection, more power, higher efficiency, etc. That old P/S will cost more in the long run than a new one is worth. Buy something decent and you may be able to use it in a new build a year or two down the road.

lightbender · 2012-02-11, 05:47 PM

Caps are pretty cheap. Should be about $10.00- $15.00 including shipping. The shipping is what costs, as the caps are usually under $1.00.

This is an example, but you need to make sure the specs of the new cap are better than the old cap in terms of ripple, and equal or slightly better in resistance.
http://search.digikey.com/ca/en/prod...1536-ND/589277

Agree though that if you are considering a new PC down the road get yourself a good one, but if you are like me you might enjoy fixing it

Jake · 2012-02-11, 07:09 PM

It looks like a fun DIY but I think I will pass. Some of the caps are tight against the heatsink. The screws that remove the heatsink are tight against the two main caps. And I don't think they can be bent aside. Plus there are 20 caps!

lightbender · 2012-02-11, 07:13 PM

re-capping PSUs are tougher than motherboards because of the tight space and large heatsinks. Sounds like a horrible design with the cap right up against the heatsink. Check your motherboard caps.

Jake · 2012-04-23, 08:51 AM

Just to close this, I ended up picking up a new PSU. I eventually picked Corsair. The CX430 V2 was well reviewed but primary I wanted to know about the quality of the construction. What I discovered is that there are a lot of crappy PSUs out there. Even the big name companies will cut corners on some series.

Here are the few review places I checked with first.

http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/artic...Review/1284/10

http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php...tory5&reid=239

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/C...X430_V2/8.html

2012-02-09, 02:03 PM	#16
ScaryBob Veteran Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: The Dandelion City Posts: 7,133	Depending on the PCs, I would be tempted to just leave things as is. If one of the PCs is fairly new and/or valuable, I would put a new P/S in it. It really does not matter which P/S is in which computer provided that they are rated to supply enough power. The 8 pin ATX connector is not necessary unless a high powered CPU is installed. __________________ At 20 I had a good mind. At 40 I had money. At 60 I've lost my mind and my money. Oh, to be 20 again. --Scary

2012-02-09, 04:31 PM	#17
Jake Moderator Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Gatineau and Ottawa Posts: 10,193	I was "youtubing" and found that in some instances you can switch your meter over to AC voltage to see how much is present. I would need to find a few places on the board where I could check it. I would think the CPU fan header, the front switch header. This assumes I can get it running. One factor complicating my life is that the cables are modular and sealed so that you cannot probe the connector pins from the back. __________________ Tip: See an offending post? Don't reply, report it by clicking on the 'Report Post' icon.

2012-02-09, 06:30 PM	#19
Jake Moderator Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Gatineau and Ottawa Posts: 10,193	Thanks for the tips lightbender. Yes it worked in the old PC. The load I don't think is a factor since I removed everything except the ram and CPU. I am well under 150W total for testing according to PSU calculator. I think I will try checking the caps. This is more of an educational experience. Plus the satisfaction knowing if it was the motherboard, psu or both. I would hate to purchase a new PSU and only find out that in a few months I am back where I started. __________________ Tip: See an offending post? Don't reply, report it by clicking on the 'Report Post' icon.

2012-02-11, 05:08 PM	#20
Jake Moderator Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Gatineau and Ottawa Posts: 10,193	Well I finally took the PSU out and pulled the cover. I see 3 caps that are slightly bulged. 3300 uF 16V 2200 uF 10V 3300 uF 10V That is enough to convince me to scrap the PSU. For fun I measured the AC voltage on the rails. I know it is rms but I got, 5VDC: 0.8CAV 3.3VDC: 0.2VAC 12VDC: VAC unstable. The PSU board is labelled ATX 66. When I googled I found this unit linked below. The exterior is different but the components inside are identical. The reviewers were not impressed. http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/artic...r-Supply/413/1 __________________ Tip: See an offending post? Don't reply, report it by clicking on the 'Report Post' icon.

2012-02-11, 05:30 PM	#22
ScaryBob Veteran Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: The Dandelion City Posts: 7,133	I wouldn't bother fixing the P/S unless the caps are really cheap. A new P/S is maybe $40-$60 after sales and rebates. It will have better power regulation, better failure protection, more power, higher efficiency, etc. That old P/S will cost more in the long run than a new one is worth. Buy something decent and you may be able to use it in a new build a year or two down the road. __________________ At 20 I had a good mind. At 40 I had money. At 60 I've lost my mind and my money. Oh, to be 20 again. --Scary

2012-02-09, 05:45 PM	#18
lightbender Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Montreal, Quebec Posts: 131	didn't you say it worked on the old PC? You could check for dirty power on the old PC with the suspected faulty PSU. You connect it up to an unused molex connector on the PSU. Make sure its the same rail that is connected to the PC. You probably need a reference, compare the spare PSU with the suspected faulty PSU. The other thing that could be happening is that the old PC doesn't put much of a load on the suspected faulty PSU so it looks like its fine. i.e. the PSU keeps the power steady under a certain load. Where, your current PC puts out more of a load, and triggers the PS to fail. There might be a much easier way to verify if your PSU is bad. You should be able to easily remove the front cover off of the PSU, should be only a couple of screws. Check the caps carefully in the secondary section of the PSU (the smaller ones, not the big ones on the primary) for a rounded top or any signs of leakage. The top only needs to be slightly rounded to indicate that it has failed. Yo can post pictures if you are not sure.

2012-02-11, 05:23 PM	#21
lightbender Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Montreal, Quebec Posts: 131	Don't scrap it. Its probably just the caps that need to be replaced. Replace all the the caps that are bulged plus all the rest except for the 2 big primary ones, and the tiny secondary ones. Hardware secrets are pretty tough, the unit should be okay for your old PC. You can get info on which caps to replace from badcaps.net Also, check your motherboard for bloated caps as well. Those are easily replaced as well.

2012-02-11, 05:47 PM	#23
lightbender Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Montreal, Quebec Posts: 131	Caps are pretty cheap. Should be about $10.00- $15.00 including shipping. The shipping is what costs, as the caps are usually under $1.00. This is an example, but you need to make sure the specs of the new cap are better than the old cap in terms of ripple, and equal or slightly better in resistance. http://search.digikey.com/ca/en/prod...1536-ND/589277 Agree though that if you are considering a new PC down the road get yourself a good one, but if you are like me you might enjoy fixing it

2012-02-11, 07:09 PM	#24
Jake Moderator Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Gatineau and Ottawa Posts: 10,193	It looks like a fun DIY but I think I will pass. Some of the caps are tight against the heatsink. The screws that remove the heatsink are tight against the two main caps. And I don't think they can be bent aside. Plus there are 20 caps! __________________ Tip: See an offending post? Don't reply, report it by clicking on the 'Report Post' icon.

2012-02-11, 07:13 PM	#25
lightbender Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Montreal, Quebec Posts: 131	re-capping PSUs are tougher than motherboards because of the tight space and large heatsinks. Sounds like a horrible design with the cap right up against the heatsink. Check your motherboard caps.

2012-04-23, 08:51 AM	#26
Jake Moderator Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Gatineau and Ottawa Posts: 10,193	Just to close this, I ended up picking up a new PSU. I eventually picked Corsair. The CX430 V2 was well reviewed but primary I wanted to know about the quality of the construction. What I discovered is that there are a lot of crappy PSUs out there. Even the big name companies will cut corners on some series. Here are the few review places I checked with first. http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/artic...Review/1284/10 http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php...tory5&reid=239 http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/C...X430_V2/8.html __________________ Tip: See an offending post? Don't reply, report it by clicking on the 'Report Post' icon.

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