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Combination (Keyless) Door Locks

28K views 34 replies 19 participants last post by  miskc 
#1 ·
Does anyone have any experience with those combination locks that allow you to unlock your door by entering a number sequence instead of a key? I believe that Westlock and Schlage both make them.

They sound ideal. No more fumbling for a key, especially if your hands are full or you are in a hurry. Just press a series of numbered buttons and away you go.

I have visited a couple of different Home Depots to purchase one, and every box on the shelf has been taped closed, which means someone has returned it. Just wondering if there is some inherent flaw in the design that I should be aware of.
 
#2 ·
I have visited a couple of different Home Depots to purchase one, and every box on the shelf has been taped closed, which means someone has returned it. Just wondering if there is some inherent flaw in the design that I should be aware of.
Maybe they have issues operating in sub-zero temperatures. Although the guts are inside the house. Maybe they're hard on batteries.
 
#3 ·
I wouldn't want to go with them based on my experience where I work. The keys stick and it can take several tries to get in. This is interior. Not good if the whether is miserable or you are trying to bring groceries in.

If they are battery operated, how do you get into your house if the battery dies?
 
#4 ·
We had one in our house for several years when we lived in north western Ontario. Cold weather was not a problem, and I remember several days and nights seeing -30 and colder. The mechanism is on the inside so it doesn't see the worst of the cold. The operating solenoid had lots of oomph to move the lock in the coldest weather. The lock has a low battery alarm that gives you a few days warning. There is a key lock on the mechanism that can be used if the battery fails. (I know it defeats the purpose, but I always carried a key just in case.) It was great for our kids who could not get the hang of not losing their keys.

On the down side, the lock did not match the profile of the one that was previously in the steel door, and some cutting was required. That was not fun. Stores don't stock many different finishes and it may be difficult to match the knob or latch you have now. I checked at Home Depot a couple of year ago when we moved to a new house, and all they had was the polished gold and antique brass models. There was not a match to the pewter finish our installed set had. I believe they do make several different finishes, but many of them are special order, and even then are not guaranteed to match what you have. You can buy the rest of the knob/latch hardware to match the finish, but there may be even more work to fit your door.
 
#5 ·
I have one on my side entrance door which is pure mechanical (no keys/batteries) with a 4 number 5 buttons combination. I live in a really cold region (50th parallel) and the door is on the dominant wind side. Really good stuff I got from the locksmith: KABA Ilco model 7002-03-41. Of course you need a regular lock on some other door in emergency.
 
#6 ·
Unless you get a door lock like a Medeco (there are some other high end brands which elude me right now) the deadbolt is almost useless against burglers. One quick kick or a screwdriver and they're in.

The deadbolt sticks out of the door an inch, however the bolt part that stays inside the door is often only 1/8" and then a very thin piece of metal takes over, instead of the full thickness of the bolt also being inside the door.

If you want security, stay away from the less expensive brands of bolt.

(Yes, if you have a determined burgler, he's going to get in, but each "inconvenience" you put in his way will move him on to another house and not yours:

- No small pieces of glass to break
- A good deadbolt
- An alarm system, and/or alarm system sign
- A dog, and/or beware of dog sign
- No expensive stuff (or car keys) on display, near entrance
- Lights on timers
- Etc.

Some of the combination locks are not deadbolts. If not, they're next to useless and not recommended.
 
#8 ·
The danger with the 5 button mechanical locks is the low number of combinations. With a 3 digit code there are only 60 possibilities and those can be tried in a couple minutes. Even with two buttons at once, then a couple numbers the possible codes are low ( ie 1 and 3 together, 4, 2).

I speak from experience working in offices with lots of these locks. Most doors can be entered in 5 min or less, faster if you know if it is 3 numbers, 2+1+1, 4 numbers.
 
#9 ·
I'm currently looking at these keyless bump proof deadbolts. The code on the ones I have seen ranges from 4 to 12 digits which is plenty for me. Ill make sure to check the quality of the deadbolt that stays inside of the door when locked. So far I have seen a Weiser Powerbolt 1000 at Homedepot and a Weiser/Kwikset made for Rona. Ranges between 127$ and 99$.

See my earlier post for pics.
http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/showpost.php?p=530099&postcount=32
 
#10 ·
Home Depot advertised in a recent flyer a lock that opens based on your finger print .

There is a combination lock on our front door, but it doesn't work. It came with the house, we just use the key. What is apparent on this lock is considerable wear on a couple of digits. Likely the previous owner's code was 2233 or something like that. Pretty easy for someone to figure out....
 
#11 ·
I have seen these biometric fingerprint deadbolts. Very compact look. But I cant imagine removing my gloves in the winter to open the door. Also they are currently more expensive. Maybe in a few years...


Would you know what brand of keyless lock you have on your door?
 
#12 ·
I posted the original question on keyless locks, and ended up buying two of them from the Home Depot website. They are made by Schlage. We are quite happy with them. They seem quite sturdy, have ten individual digits on the keypad that you can program with up to 19 different combinations. You can disable any one or all of them at any time, and change any of them if you notice the keypad starting to wear. The unit easily installed in place of the existing deadbolt lock, and also comes with a key, should the battery die (supposed to last 2 years and give you ample audible warning before it cuts out).
 
#14 ·
The thing to remeber about consumer grade fingerprint/biometrics is that they're REAL easy to fake if someone get your fingerprints (okay not likely to happen, but still...), and they're more susceptible to dirt/moisture/cold/heat than any other kind of lock.

If you're really interested in keyless locks, RFID is the way to go!
 
#16 ·
There is a flaw with them.

I have a friend that works at Home Depot, and he has seen quite a few of them returned for basically the same reason. The "auto locking" part of the lock (when you push the lock button), it not very strong. Any type of resisitance against the "bolt" will keep it from moving all the way out of the jam. That means if the plate is not lined up perfectly with the "bolt", the "bolt" may hit the plate, and if that happens the "bolt" will not go into the hole.

I was going to buy one as well, and when he told me this I went to the display to test it for myself. Sure enough, if I placed a finger over the "bolt" (when it was in the "unlocked" position.... all the way in), and then proceeded to push the "lock" button, any little preasure made against the "bolt" would make it stop it dead in it's tracks. If that type of thing happened on your front door, you would be leaving the house unlocked (even though it sounded as if "bolt" moved into the locked position.

Another problem I noticed was... if the lock/bolt moves just enough to go into the plate/hole, but doesn't extend all the way out, it will feel as if the door is properly locked, but any force against the bolt can make it move back into it's "unlocked" position.

The dead bolt position for these locks is when it's all the way out or in. If it doesn't reach that complete "out" travel, you are basically leaving the front door unlocked.

The next time you guys see that lock display at Home Depot, try "the finger against the bolt" test and you'll see what I mean.
 
#17 ·
Just have to make sure you install it properly. It should not strike or slide against the strike plate. I made a few adjustments to mine so it was centered. If I could have found a mechanical one like Chev mentioned I would have got that. We use them at work.
 
#20 ·
Just have to make sure you install it properly. It should not strike or slide against the strike plate.
Even if installed properly, in a Canadian climate with huge temperature variations and some minor house settling, it's almost impossible to keep a door "perfect" so that the bolt doesn't rub against anything.

If you lock a door manually this can be noticed whereas an "automatic" lock will not allow for this.

As mentioned earlier in this and other threads, these locks employ very inexpensive internal mechanisms which will not compare to something like a Medeco or Abloy.
 
#18 ·
I agree with the poster who said that consumer grade biometrics are pretty poor, but so are consumer grade locksets, hinges and doors! :eek:

One thing to consider if you want to go a little more on the high-end is the possibility of adding a wireless keyfob to your alarm system, and then having the alarm panel pop a "real" door strike that is professionally fitted by a door company. Probably cost you 2x-3x as much, but it might be worth it.

(Note: not all resi door frames are conducive to strikes, particularly if the door has a sidelight.)
 
#19 ·
I agree with the poster who said that consumer grade biometrics are pretty poor, but so are consumer grade locksets, hinges and doors!
That'd be me, and lol, yeah they are. Luckily for me I live in a fairly rural where I don't have to worry too much. Which is a good thing 'cause I live in a ground floor apartment that the average 12 year old could break into.

Luckily I'm probably the best break-in artist in town, but I only use my powers for good :)

Even just today I had to slip a non-deadbolt lock at work when someone locked themseves out of their office.
Kinda freaked them out when I got the door open in about 5 seconds, lol!

I like wireless too. My preference is for a simple RFID instead of a more complicated "remote" based system.
The added advantage to wireless over key or code locks is the "no fumbling". For those in a less safe area than me, you are most vulnerable while trying to get your door open.
 
#21 ·
I agree with 57's assesment, but there is a simple and free way to make sure it locks. Check the door before you leave.

Not that that excuses cheaply made locks, but you should ALWAYS make sure the door is locked anyways. Of course fiddling with the door while repeatedly checking to make it's locked woould be moronic so I'd still give that a big NO.

It's funny how people will spend tens of thousands filling their houses with stuff, but WAY under a grand making sure it's safe. CRAZY!
 
#22 ·
To Phatboyc: Yes, the one that you have indicated is the one that I purchased.

I have used it for two months now and have not experienced the problems with the bolt not fully engaging. You need to make sure that the bolt is properly aligned with the plate when you install it, but you should do the same with any deadbolt. Yes, sometimes in cold weather it is slightly out of alignment, but the same happens with any deadbolt, and you just give the door an extra tug, and you can feel the bolt go all the way in.

By the way, the bolt is not automatic, you need to manually turn the knob and you can feel when the bolt is properly seated.

I am comfortable with the level of protection this lock gives me. If someone really wants to break in, they will find a way, no matter what kind of lock is installed.
 
#23 · (Edited)
Yes, sometimes in cold weather it is slightly out of alignment, but the same happens with any deadbolt, and you just give the door an extra tug, and you can feel the bolt go all the way in.
But with a regular key lock, you can feel (with the key) when the lock is all the way out/into the hole.


I agree with 57's assesment, but there is a simple and free way to make sure it locks. Check the door before you leave.

But that's the main problem with them. If it engages into the plate by a few mm's, it WILL feel as if the door is locked when you tug on it, but if fact the bolt can eventually slide back out of the plate, leaving your door unlocked.

Even if installed properly, in a Canadian climate with huge temperature variations and some minor house settling, it's almost impossible to keep a door "perfect" so that the bolt doesn't rub against anything.
57 is correct. Any rubbing can keep that bolt from fully extending/locking. The motor they usd is not very strong. It works well in the store because there is no plate in the display. No plate = no problems for the bolt to come all the way out and fully lock.


Another problem is the numbers printed on the pads. Over time they will start to rub off. That means a theif can see the numbers you are using to enter the house. Sure, with a long number code it's harder to "guess" the right combo, but if only 2 pads are worn while the others are nice, you've just given any one out there a clue as to what the numbers could be (and the same thing can be said for inside alarm pads).

Remember, all it takes is for one person to see you enter that code once, and that code has been compromised. (just take a look at the news report from Perason airport in Toronto last year. The news guy just stood around and carefully watched employees enter their codes into the door. He then just went over and tried what he saw. Presto, the door opened.) Same thing can happen with these locks. You will probably say "but I will mnotice a person standing around watching me". Really? Did you know that a cheap set of binoc's can easily read these numbers from 100 feet (or more) away? ;) I'm I being parinoid? Maybe, but I'd rather remove any likelyhood of these problems appearing.


If you guys still want to get one, please remember these things (and change the key pad code every month so the number pad wears evenly).


(imo, a good key/dead bolt is still your best choice)
 
#24 ·
For anyone reading this thread and who might me considering buying one. Here are a few more observations from a user.

Change the combo yearly to avoid the "wear and tear" or number guessing trick. Also use a 6 digit or longer code and non repeating digits. Also, with my lock the locking action is slow and loud. When it is obstructed it makes a distinctively different whining sound as the motor is overloaded temporarily. We know something is wrong if we hear this. I Also found (as 57 alluded to) the climate and weatherstripping can interfere with proper locking so make sure it engages by listening and checking. It becomes a habit just like listening and checking for my seatbelt to be properly engaged and snug.
 
#25 ·
Just to be clear - the one I installed does not have a motor. You turn a knob on the outside by hand to either open or close the door. Hitting the right number combination connects the knob to the deadbolt, otherwise it just rotates freely.

The action is similar to what you would experience with many other deadbolts that have a knob instead of a key on the inside. You definitely feel when it is fully engaged, just as with a key. I am speaking from using an actual installation, not a store mock-up.

For those of you worried about someone seeing you enter your passcodes, I assume that you do not use Interac or bank ATMs for the same reason. When VISA and Mastercard move to chip technology in the next few years, you will have to enter a PIN number for each transaction. I guess you will be going back to cash ...
 
#26 ·
So I cheked them last nigh at Homedepot and Rona. The Schlage seemed the best quality with the most heft to it. The popular Weiser Powerbolt seemed to be cheap in quality. I ended purchasing the no name Rona brand. Seems like mid-quality, between the Schlage and the Weiser. I found out the keyway is made by Weiser/Kwikset. Come also with to remotes with backup key in them and two regular keys.

The deadbolt itself is the same as most other deadbolt. It goes out the same length as a manual one. Actually I can even use the one I already have on my door. The keypad buttons are made of plastic. The numbers seems to be printed underneath, but I could be wrong. Either case, even if someone knows uses only 4 digit good luck trying all the combinations. It is allot faster just ramming the door.

Started installing then found out I have to resize the hole in my door to 54mm.:mad: Will have to wait t'Ill this weekend to use it.
 
#27 ·
Phatboyc: I will be curious to hear how you like the Rona lock after you get it installed. When I purchased the Schlage model, it was a toss up between the two. I thought the Rona model had a nice thin profile, but that the Schlage unit was more sturdy.

I hoped you are as happy with yours as I have been with mine.
 
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