: Samsung PN50A650 Owners discussion


Pages : [1] 2

fameb
2008-12-07, 04:09 PM
I just got this Samsung 50 inch plasma. It's still on the factory settings, and I'm not too pleased with the picture.

Does anybody know the ideal picture settings for this tv. Where it will look best?

57
2008-12-07, 05:23 PM
There are no ideal settings for any TV since each TV is unique due to variances in the manufacturing process. See the following post on the topic:

http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/showpost.php?p=449673&postcount=2, with a link on how to optimize your TV.

In your previous thread I supplied a link useful for those new to the forum. Please read that link as it has answers to many questions asked by those new to HDTVs.

ported
2009-01-08, 07:58 PM
I agree with 57. I have the same model of Samsung tv and the factory settings are fine for our family.

PPL4GOLF
2009-01-08, 09:55 PM
I agree with 57. I have the same model of Samsung tv and the factory settings are fine for our family.
I can assure you with high level of certainty that 57 (or the majority of the forum member for that matter) will not agree with you that the 'factory settings' are fine.

Factory default Color settings are >90% going to be good as is...but the Contrast & Brightness definitely needed to be adjusted and is not that hard. Doing it is good for the plasma and the hydro bill...

Vicky71
2009-01-09, 01:46 PM
I've had this TV for about six months, I remember hunting the web to find calibration settings. I found these on tweaktv.com:

User Menu Settings

* Picture Modes
o Picture Mode : Movie
o Color Temperature : Warm 2
o Aspect Ratio : 16:9
* Picture Settings
o Cell Light : 8
o Contrast : 100
o Brightness : 52
o Sharpness : 15
o Color : 44
o Tint : G51/R49
* Detailed Settings
o Black Adjust : Off
o Dynamic Contrast : Off
o Gamma : 0
o Color Space : Auto
o Fleshtone : Off
o Edge Enhancement : Off
o XVYCC Color : Off
* Picture Options
o Color Tone : Warm 2
o Size : 16:9
o Digital NR : Off
o DNIE : Off
o HDMI Black Level : Normal
o Film Mode : On
o Blue Mode : Off

Note: The above calibration are for HDMI inputs, for DVD/BD viewing. For component or composite inputs increase Color to 52, Use Warm 1 color temp setting, Contrast 100.

Hope this helps.

PPL4GOLF
2009-01-09, 04:09 PM
Vicki,
I read somewhere that these Sammy panels, the Cell Light setting should be 10.
It is a dumb down setting that is not necessary but they chose to have one so the menu is just like the LCDs because the LCDs have backlight setting which makes a little more sense.

The other note is these 1080p Samsung plasmas seems to almost maxed out in the calibration...

stemfi
2009-01-13, 03:29 PM
Use Movie mode (the default Color Tone will be Warm2, which is what you want).

Set Cell Light to 10.

Set Contrast to around 78 80 for viewing in a dark room. Bump up the contrast if needed for viewing in a room with a lot of light.

Brightness should be close to 50 (most numbers I've seen have been between 50 and 56). To nail it down, you need to set it using a test pattern from a setup disc.

Set Sharpness to 0.

Set Color to around 47 or 48 and Tint to 50/50. To fine-tune these settings, make use of the TV's Blue-Only Mode and use a test pattern from a setup disc.

All enhancements should be off (Black Adjust, Dynamic Contrast, Edge Enhancement, Flesh Tone at 0).

It's a guessing game where the Gamma should be, but it's usually between -3 and 0.

As for the Color Space and White Balance settings, there's just too much variability from set to set, so it's best to leave it at the defaults rather than using someone else's settings (Auto for Color Space and everything at 25 for the White Balance).

If the Size setting isn't greyed out, you can choose Just Scan so that the entire image fits the screen and there is no overscan.

Set Digital NR to Off.

HDMI Black Level: Use as a "coarse" setting for Brightness. If your Black Level is set to Normal and Brightness is set in the 30s, change Black Level to Low and readjust Brightness up closer to 50.

Energy Savings set to OFF

If you can do all of the above, that's pretty much the best you can do on your own without instrumentation. To set the Gamma, Color Space and White Balance, you really need a professional calibrator or learn how to use a meter.

Fred Flintstone
2009-01-20, 11:06 AM
Thanks for these settings, will give them a try. However, wanted to know about WARM 2, the default setting when you choose Cinema. I find that WARM 2 makes it too orangy, and slightly washed out. When I flick between the options, changing that setting to OFF seems to me a better picture. But I'll try with the list of settings posted above. At the very least WARM 1 seems to be a more realistic colour....

I am very impressed by the picture quality most of the time. However, last night I watched War of the Worlds, and I was disappointed. I started trying to adjust the image mid-movie, which pretty well takes away from the viewing pleasure. I found that the image was grainy, but worse the colours were not realistic. They kind of looked like when a black and white movie is colourized, the reds were too red while the rest kind of looked all the same greyish tone. Since it was probably me, I reset it to factory settings, but it seemed to be about the same.

My room is quite dark, and it is possible it is the quality of the transfer which is in question, but normally big budget movies have good transfers. For instance, I watched King Kong recently, and it was nothing short of brilliant. All of my watching is from a DVD source with a Samsung DVD-1080p8 set to upconvert to 1080p. TV is a Samsung PN50A530 50" 1080p. I do not have any real Full HD sources <yet>. DVD player is connected via HDMI to a Yamaha 6160 receiver, which in turn is connected via HDMI to the plasma.

Any tweaks appreciated.

FF.

57
2009-01-20, 11:17 AM
As discussed in the optimization link available through the link in post 2, the warmest colour setting is almost always the closest to the NTSC standard.

Yes, when you first switch to this it will look "orangy" to some people, however, that is only the first step of the optimization process. You then need to optimize the contrast, brightness, colour and tint. Once those are optimized, when you bring up a screen with a fair amount of white or grey, look at it for a while. Once you've looked at it for a while, if you change away from the warmest setting, or back to "vivid/dynamic" picture mode, you'll then notice how "blue" the screen is and how "accurate" the warmest setting is.

Fred Flintstone
2009-01-20, 02:15 PM
Had all 3 of the optimization DVDs you recommended. I just ordered one online. Thanks for the info, am looking forward to trying it out as soon as it is available. Also, watched that Australian demonstrate the settings on CNet, was very interesting stuff. I will forgo the list of calibration settings previously posted, and see if I can optimize it myself using the Essentials DVD.

Thanks,
FF.

Fred Flintstone
2009-01-23, 08:47 AM
and I am not sure I understood their Contrast suggestions. Are we supposed to set the TV so that the top white square is nearly identical to the one directly underneath it? She spoke about making sure there was no white bleeding into other squares, and as far as I could see, that didn't happen even when setting contrast to 100. All the other instructions were clear, but I found contrast left a little up to interpretation. I finally settled on 30 as the settings, but I see that others here recommend 100. I know the default was 95. I'll run through the procedure tonight again to see if I can figure it out, but just wondering what exactly I am supposed to be doing.

Thanks,
FF.

57
2009-01-23, 10:17 AM
Many newer TVs cannot produce significant amounts what's called white crush with the contrast setting. That's why many people are able to run very high contrast settings without issue - you can still see the "folds and wrinkles" in any white shirts that people are wearing, etc.

Black Crush is much easier to get - simply reduce the brightness and at some point there will be no "shadow details". The same thing can be seen in the test patterns when the last two "blacks" blend into each other.

Some TVs are quite capable of white crush - depends on the make/model and of course the specific TV in question.

A contrast setting of 30 seems very low. Most optimizations I've done have the contrast more like 70-100.

(Front Projectors are totally different in this regard and are more like the older CRT-based TVs, which would have lower contrast settings)

Fred Flintstone
2009-01-26, 07:47 PM
The Sound & Vision Home Theater Tune-Up was fun and informative, but it seemed very dated. They spoke almost exclusively about setting up CRTs, with only a passing mention of plasma at the end as a "very expensive upgrade option". The DVD has a 2001 copyright on it, which seems just about right considering that there was no mention at all of HDMI, and component-out was considered the greatest thing ever invented. It was very good for audio setup however, as that hasn't changed all that much in the last 8 years.

I'll try out the AVIA, but I already know it has an even older copyright; 1999. There is an AVIA II which just came out, and it looks to be for all the latest equipment (says all widescreen, etc.) except they want 50 bucks for it.

I also have the Digital Video Essentials on order from the library, copyright 2003. So that will likely be the most useful. Thus far the S&V from the library was missing the filter, which meant the colour and tint calibration wouldn't work.

I'll reset contrast to 70 and see if it makes a difference.

Thanks,
FF.

Fred Flintstone
2009-01-27, 08:26 AM
Ran the Avia video calibration last night. The explanation for contrast was much more detailed than the S&V Home Theatre Tune-up, even though both have been produced by Ovation Software. The test patterns were the same, but the explanation was much more detailed. Also, the demo stopped at what should be the correct setting on their CRT after explaining each test, which the S&V did not do. Was very helpful. For instance, when describing "blooming" which does not occur on plasma TVs but is something CRTs may experience, the test shows the blooming occurring then backs off the contrast setting until it visibly goes away. Then it stops indicating that is the correct setting for their demo TV.

My contrast is now set for 80, which looks to be the best match following their "moving white bars" test. Once again, no colour filters present in the DVD case (it's from the library). I'll try out the Digital Video Essentials DVD when it comes in, and if it also has no filter, then I'll just buy the one I like best.

FF.

Fred Flintstone
2009-01-27, 08:58 AM
Thanks Stemfi,

Just reread your post. Both the DVDs I have gotten from the library to set the TV have had missing blue filters, but just discovered that I can turn on the blue-mode setting which disables red + green input, thereby giving you exactly what you see with a blue filter! I'll go back and run the S&V colour + tint calibration tonight.

thanks again,
FF.

Fred Flintstone
2009-01-28, 11:37 AM
First, thanks to everyone who has been replying, this has been a real learning experience. My TV has a noticeably superior image quality now when watching upconverted DVDs in my nice dark room. I no longer have the problem of too much red in actors cheeks during dark scenes sometimes making it look like a colourized black & white movie. Also, the blacks are blacker and the fleshtones much more realistic (Tom Cruise DOESN'T actually turn into a zombie in War of the Worlds despite his previously grey skintone). I'll keep these settings for at least a week before I fiddle with them again as I still am getting used to WARM 2.

My TV is a Samsung 50" plasma, model PN50A530

The settings below were calibrated using Sound and Vision Home Theater Tune-Up DVD with the Blue-Only mode in the TV's advanced settings (very handy, you don't need a blue filter held up in front of your eyes with this option). Then I ran the AVIA DVD, which essentially had me set the same settings but provided more detailed explanations of what I was changing. Finally, I ran S&V a third time to tweak.

Settings now are :

Movie mode along with WARM 2
Cell light 9
Contrast 80
Brightness 50
Sharpness 40
Color 47
Tint G/R G53/R47
HDMI Black level - Low
All dynamic and automatic settings are off.

Thanks,
FF.

stemfi
2009-01-29, 02:51 PM
A couple of comments on your current settings based on what I have read (Doug Blackburn):

Apparently the cell light changes the Luminance curve, with "10" being the "Off" position.

Set Sharpness at 0 sharpness because higher values add edge definition that is not in the original source

You can't measure Gamma without the proper equipment but you can play around with between 0 to -3. (The lower the number the highter the Gamma, so -3 produces the highest gamma). The only thing you can do by eye is to pay attention to the midtones... forget the shadows and highlights and concentrate on everything in the middle. Gamma affects the middle (midtones) more than shadows or highlights. When the midtones are too bright, images will look flat and kind of boring. When midtones are ideal, there will be an almost dimensional look to images. When midtones are too dark, images tend to look too dark but there will be plenty of shadow detail and highlight detail (false detail, but detail nonetheless).

PPL4GOLF
2009-01-29, 09:04 PM
I set the gamma to 0, -1 passes my eyeballing test as well.

About sharpness, I didn't like the 0 setting. I tested using HTPC via HDMI, the sharpness can be set no more than 2 and anything more the windows and texts look bad. So I am setting it at 2.

For analog sources, I set the sharpness to 50, the picture is not bad...for ATSC tuner, I set it to 5...the picture seems to pop out more.

Cell Light 10
Contrast 85
Brightness 55
Sharpness 5
Color 50
Tint 50/50
Warm2
Everything else is OFF

Fred Flintstone
2009-01-30, 09:06 AM
A couple of comments on your current settings based on what I have read (Doug Blackburn):

Apparently the cell light changes the Luminance curve, with "10" being the "Off" position.

Set Sharpness at 0 sharpness because higher values add edge definition that is not in the original source

You can't measure Gamma without the proper equipment but you can play around with between 0 to -3. (The lower the number the highter the Gamma, so -3 produces the highest gamma). The only thing you can do by eye is to pay attention to the midtones... forget the shadows and highlights and concentrate on everything in the middle. Gamma affects the middle (midtones) more than shadows or highlights. When the midtones are too bright, images will look flat and kind of boring. When midtones are ideal, there will be an almost dimensional look to images. When midtones are too dark, images tend to look too dark but there will be plenty of shadow detail and highlight detail (false detail, but detail nonetheless).
Hi, I don't understand this comment :

"Apparently the cell light changes the Luminance curve, with "10" being the "Off" position."

What is the luminance curve, and how will that affect my image? Should this be set to 10?

Thanks,
FF.

stemfi
2009-01-30, 03:56 PM
Hi, I don't understand this comment :

"Apparently the cell light changes the Luminance curve, with "10" being the "Off" position."

What is the luminance curve, and how will that affect my image? Should this be set to 10?

Thanks,
FF.
Again from Doug Blackburn: Cell Light is a "control" with no useful purpose.

Measuring different Cell Light settings reveals that progressively lower Cell Light settings introduce an increasingly "S" shaped luminance curve that does no favors to anybody. So "10" remains the only useful setting for Cell Light for those trying to achieve the best images from their panels. Since there's no benefit to making the Luminance curve "S" shaped there's no benefit to using Cell Light for anything. "10" is essentially the "Off" condition for Cell Light and puts Samsung panels on the same footing as other brands that don't have a Cell Light control.

I am not an expert, so if you want further details on Luminance curves you can try to Google it. For me, I understand the general theory but I wouldn't trust myself to explain it correctly. I noticed your current settings are pretty close to what was recommended so I would set it at 10.