: HD DVD fans: It really isn't that bad.... really!


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oilblue
2008-01-10, 05:48 PM
Considering you already have a PS3, returning the A3 is the clear choice. What to do with the $259 is the question. I'm sure something will come up. :D

caduddin
2008-01-11, 12:02 AM
Should one format die which was always going to happen really, any manufacturer that can launch a dual format player at a reasonable price, and by reasonable I mean on par with the standalone winner player, will make a lot of money off the runner up supporters who don't want to part with their collections. Ok LG has released a model but it's way too expensive for the average consumer. I thought it was a mis-print when I read the price tag after it was first released. There's a lot of movies out there in both formats right now, and will consumers who backed the runner up cough up again to change their titles into the winning format? (yes maybe if they'd only bought one or two, but for those who have larger collections?)

Yes I purchased a HD-DVD player after the offers at future shop, and have bought maybe 6 HD-DVD titles, and chose HD-DVD because the titles I was really after were on that format. But if it became a choice of going blu-ray or dual format if the price is comparable and HD-DVD dies, I'll probably buy the dual format so i can expand on my existing HD collection and not have to replace my existing titles. I already own an upconverting DVD player (because it also does mpeg4) so I don't want too many dvd players on my tv stand.

Any smart manufacturer should be able to recognise that there'll be a lot of consumers who own HD movies and won't want to part with their collections if their format loses. This could be a great opportunity by the winning format and its backers by being magnanimous in victory towards consumers that chose the other format and start producing players that can do both formats.

Apart from better audio on Blu-Ray (which you'd probably need a home theatre system to reap the benefits of) and size, there wasn't much in the 2 formats, and most who chose HD-DVD will probably have done so due to the cheaper cost of the players and choice of titles, not because they hate Sony or any of its backers. But then, will a large corporation like Sony care about that if they win? Time will tell.

caduddin
2008-01-11, 12:22 AM
HD DVD Still Kicking
Despite the move by Warner Bros. into the Blu-ray high-definition video camp, Samsung said Wednesday that it still plans to go ahead with the launch of a second generation dual-format Blu-ray/HD DVD player this year. In an interview with the Gizmodo website, DongSoo Jun, head of Samsung's digital AV unit, said that while he agrees with those who say that all the major Hollywood studios will eventually adopt Blu-ray exclusively, there will nevertheless remain a market for dual-format players because of the strong foothold Microsoft and Toshiba will continue to hold in the PC market for high-definition recorders. (Microsoft's Xbox 360 also plays HD DVD disks.) Jun said he expects HD DVD to remain the choice for personal hi-def videos and Blu-ray, for professional videos.

Atrial
2008-01-11, 09:23 AM
Hi, first post here.

I'll be putting together a home theatre in April when I move to my new place so I've been reading through these forums.

There are three things that have made me go 'hmm' after reading this tread:

1) If HD DVD tanks I definitely want to get a player. The movies will get very cheap as will the players. I'm thinking that there might be fire sales next Christmas with $10 per movie. Heck, when the ship is almost sunk in a year or two I'll buy a couple of spare players for future use.

Over the last 9 years I've amassed around 800 SD DVD titles so having an HD player for upconversion makes a lot of sense.

2) Even if HD players become hard to find or even unavailable 5+ years down the road I'm sure that there will be an easy way to rip HD discs to a HTPC and play them off the computer.

3) I think I'll hold off on buying BR movies for now. I'm a big fan of extras and special features. I'm worried that the constantly developing BR standard means that the movies already released on BR will not have content that will take advantage of the new features (e.g. PIP). So there is a good chance that many existing BR movies will be re-released in the future. So I figure it's a good idea to wait for BR to settle into a defined/mature standard and have definitive movie releases.

I'll probably get a PS3 as an interim BR player for now (but mostly as an excuse to get the game system), but at first I plan to buy the movies that are the cheapest. In the near future (this summer) that will most likely be HD.

zyad
2008-01-11, 09:42 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

259 + taxes.

The only problem is there is nothing at futureshop I want. I dont want a BlueRay (I have PS3).

I think It might go towards a evga 8800GT 512 MB.

You can just return it for future store credit.

caduddin
2008-01-11, 09:48 AM
Welcome to the board,

I expect you'll be right in that prices of HD DVD movies and players will drop if Toshiba pulls out and admits defeat as lots of people will want to offload their HD-DVD collections once they are no longer manufactured. There'll be a fair amount that won't have quantified what the cost will be to replace them over the cost of a dual-format player.
Some will keep them as a good SD upconverting DVD player. I'll probably offload my player and buy the dual-format. My SD DVD upconverter is region free (moved from UK to Canada and brought my DVD collection with me) and it also does divx.
Although the Toshiba HD DVD player is region free for HD, I tried a UK SD movie and it wouldn't recognise it. Anyone had any other experience with this?

I wouldn't be too surprised if 5 years down the road there's a new format to replace Blu-Ray anyway. The Hdmi 1.3 cable standard is capable of 1440p isn't it? Will 1440p high Def DVD media be available in 5 years? I'd personally like to see a solid state media instead of a disc that is so vunerable to scratches. Something like a smart card you just plug in, it'll make the player a lot smaller for sure.

Ruthless82
2008-01-11, 10:45 AM
I don't know where you're getting this 1000 movies available number, and even ignoring the fact that there will NOT be 1000 movies any individual out there would like to own available on HD DVD.

Alright, so I double checked my numbers and the 1000 in a stretch, but I'd say that having 500 HD-DVD titles to choose from by the time it cuts out isn't. There are already almost 400 right now http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=76614&highlight=hd-dvd+titles

Also, your assumption of why I would tell someone to stick with HD-DVD is wrong, I'm no fanboy. In fact, I'm positive the format will fail, but that doesn't mean someone should part with their player, even if they paid 250$ for it. Given that the format will fail the title prices will plummit, firesales and people selling off their collections, etc. I'd say that if there are even 20 HD-DVD titles out there that you were interested in then you'd be saving money since it would be more than likely that these titles will hit less than half the price of the corresponding blu-ray copy. Even if you have a collection of 5-10 movies (like myself) why bother to shelf them for who knows how many months when you can keep picking up exclusive titles and buying up the other titles whose prices will start dropping. My motives are for no one other than the consumer, I'm not looking out for HD-DVD.

But like I said, if you convince these people to return their players and sell off their current collections then it's going to work out great for me, and others like me.

Arthur Dent
2008-01-11, 11:06 AM
Zyad has the exact opposite of my philosophy - content matters not, the only thing that guarantees peace of mind is to own stuff that is not considered obsolete by "experts" on the Web. Until it also becomes obsolete, of course - next year or next week. I bet that he would also recommend dumping your CDs on eBay now, while it's not too late. :)
Another valid point of view, just completely different from mine. My take on it is that you would hardly be able to enjoy what you have, because the fear of being obsolete is very obsessive - it will eat you out if you let it. And sooner or later turns to be much more expensive than sticking to stuff being dubbed "obsolete".

james99
2008-01-11, 12:56 PM
I don't know where you're getting this 1000 movies available number

Over 1,000 HD DVD titles currently exist today worldwide.

http://d.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20080107/capt.8408957458184d7c9a8e0de943beae42.gadget_show_blu_ray_tr iumph_nvps115.jpg?x=400&y=266&sig=N.a.2MSanFpy80hLoNVTuw--

TOSnapper
2008-01-14, 07:08 PM
Preamble: I don't own a hi-def player, Blu-Ray or HDDVD. I don't know much about the specs and features of either. I have been tempted to buy an HDDVD player for some time though...

Let's move on. Toshiba has announced today a big round of price reductions on their HDDVD players. Let's suppose we see big discounts here in Canada too.

Let's also suppose that HD-DVD is on it's last legs with Warner's announcement being a big nail in the coffin. Does it make sense to consider buying one? I'd have to say no for two reasons:

1) Whatever catalogue has be released to date, in the future there will probably not be much more. If all the blockbusters are released on BR from now on, people will not be satisfied with their obsolete upconverting DVD player.

2) With the price reductions, it's still an expensive upconverting player. I bought my Samsung HD860 last year for $70. There were other players to choose from but I went with price and brand name. At the price, would the A2 or A3 be able to compete with all the other upconverting DVD players?

The only future I see with this player is if the software is modified to play other hi-def formats such as x.264. (I know people are going to nitpick about AVC and h.264 and whatever - I just mean a Hi-def format that's not Blu-Ray or HD-DVD - see the preamble). Then people could back up HD television shows or movies on regular DVD9 (or other media). Since this isn't an option at the moment (from what I've read) then I don't see myself buying one of these players even if it is discounted.

How many mistakes did I make? :D

shabbs
2008-01-14, 08:17 PM
How many mistakes did I make? :D
Thing is, no one can predict the future. Yeah, it doesn't look good for HD DVD right now. The Warner move was a big blow. HD DVD's knees buckled and they're on the ropes. But it wasn't a total knock out blow. Universal and P/DW seem to be holding steady and sticking by HD DVD's side, for now. Who knows what lies ahead, hell, the HD DVD PG could pull out their own huge blockbuster bag 'o money offer and get some other studios to flip and we're right back in an even split. Although I think that's highly unlikely, nothing is guaranteed.

Personally, I'm waiting to see what the HD DVD team does. Today's announcement was a start but it's gonna take a lot more than that to change the tide. Buying into HD DVD at this point in time, IMO, is a gamble, especially with Blu-ray commanding 75% of the studios exclusively. Many feel that it is only a matter of time until Universal and P/DW go Blu. But, you can't beat the prices and if you go in with your eyes wide open knowing that HD DVD may very well end up on the losing side in the next year, it's a great way of getting the HD experience for a very affordable price, and your DVD collection will benefit from the up-conversion.

Cheers.

U
2008-01-15, 09:06 AM
TOSnapper,

IMO, the only safe bet right now is the Sony PS3. It's (more) future proof (BD is the likely winner and has 75% exclusive studio support), affordable, has some very interesting extras over any standalone players (HTPC features like playing video and music from disc, thumb drive or even streamed over the network, Divx support etc.). Plus it's a nice gaming system if you're into that kind of stuff.

scrooloose
2008-01-15, 09:22 AM
Unfortunately you're right. That means the entire HDM industry is dependant on a single game console. The masses aren't going to buy into that. I'm beginning to wonder if neither format is going to win this thing. Too many mistakes on both sides.

-Mike

oilblue
2008-01-15, 02:12 PM
So much for the frequently cited advantage of players from multiple CE vendors on the BDA side.

Not that the PS3 is perfect either...the lack of IR on the PS3 is mind boggling if they are serious about integrating with home theatre setups.

lawman
2008-01-15, 03:09 PM
I think all IRs devices should be moving to Bluetooth. IR needs line of sight, whereas BT does not.

U
2008-01-15, 03:22 PM
Unfortunately you're right. That means the entire HDM industry is dependant on a single game console. The masses aren't going to buy into that. I'm beginning to wonder if neither format is going to win this thing. Too many mistakes on both sides.

-Mike
Not really. You are assuming that BD standalone players will never come down in price. In time there will be more standalone BD players than PS3.

U
2008-01-15, 03:28 PM
So much for the frequently cited advantage of players from multiple CE vendors on the BDA side.

Not that the PS3 is perfect either...the lack of IR on the PS3 is mind boggling if they are serious about integrating with home theatre setups.
You can do this (http://www.remotecentral.com/articles/ps3-ir-remote2.htm) until someone comes up with a nicer solution... I.e. BT support in universal remotes and/or a USB to IR adapter specifically for the PS3.

nmaf
2008-01-15, 03:43 PM
the topic is technically true: See?
http://www.dailytech.com/Toshibas+New+Angle+Our+HD+DVD+Players+Are+Also+Great+DVD+Ups calers/article10337.htm

oilblue
2008-01-15, 03:57 PM
U: Thanks for the pointer. As the article mentions, the PS2 remote with IR receiver is the tricky piece of the puzzle to obtain.

BT in universal remotes won't help the perfectly functional non-BT Harmony remotes out there. The one we have should be good enough for a loooong time.

Just another reason we'll stay out of the Blu pool for quite a while yet.

calvin940
2008-01-15, 04:08 PM
U: Thanks for the pointer. As the article mentions, the PS2 remote with IR receiver is the tricky piece of the puzzle to obtain.

PS3 Nyko Bluwave USB IR receiver which I am using fine with a universal remote.

http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=73081