Hi,

I live on the south-shore of Montreal (west) and I have it mounted a 4-bay clone on my roof. Its actually on a satellite mast attached to the roof edge at the highest point.

I have a hard time getting a strong enough signal, I have tried many positions and I can get some channels with only 12 & 2 being the most decent.

Its actually pointing up into the sky at an angle, was the best way to get a decent signal. I cant pickup any digital stations.

So basically my question is in what direction should the antenna be pointing in order to get a strong signal of cfcf12 and cbc 6 ? And is it possible with some of the US stations at the same time or will I need a rotor of some kind to move the antenna ? Or does it need to be mounted alot higher?

Also a signal booster ?

thanks for any help.

When my old large antenna came down from the roof in a storm several years ago after two decades of service, I did not put another one up. No one wants to work on my roof, three stories up on one side, two on the other, and I decided I don't want to mar the historic look of my 200-year-old stone cottage again anyway. Not even with a tower, which I brought home from a neighbour's. Besides the aesthetics, my tin roof is now overshaded by mature oak and maple in the direction of reception from Montreal.

I would like to set up a large antenna (deep-fringe) on top of a telephone pole we installed for a yard light that we never bought. The pole is situated about 100 feet from my house and I would run the wires underground. It already has an unused power line available from underground. I've heard that reception suffers the greater the distance of the antenna from the TV. Is this true? Can this effect be ameliorated with a pre-amp, which we never needed before?

I also understand there is special wire for undergorund, but does it need to be encased in a protective pipe as well (such as PVC)? And what should I check up on, if I find someone claiming to be capable of doing the installation, such as the type of grounding, perhaps? I have a tower I hauled over from the neighbour's, but it may not be as tall as the pole: would it be possible/safe to attach it at the top or halfway up?

My stone cottage is 200 years old and of local historical value, so when the large antenna on the roof that had served well for 25 years blew down in a storm over four years ago, I decided not to mar the appearance again, and besides, trees are in the way of the Montreal signal. An alternative and even higher location, but aesthetically less pleasing, would be atop my 100-year-old, tin-roofed barn.

It is increasingly difficult to find anyone to work on antennas, especially one on a tin roof with a two-storey drop on one side and three-storey on the other. But it is hard to find anyone to do antennas now. The last guy to make an assessment was totally unencouraging and in fact wanted to put up another antenna right away on my roof, one he happened to have in the back of his van and which was clearly way too small. Does anyone know if there are any reputable antenna guys left in my area (75 km southwest of Montreal, close to NY border)?

Well, I'm not an expert, I've only been watching TV over-the-air since June now, but I've picked up quite a bit of info here. With that distance, you would probably be in need of a preamplifier (mast mounted). The preamplifier will overcome the losses due to a long coax cable. Your expected reception depends a lot on where you are located.

Check out the OTA Reception Results thread for the area in your vicinity; it will give you an idea of what antennas work in your area. The people on this message board are very helpful and knowledgeable. You might even find someone willing or able to help with your install.

I've read on this message board earlier that there is coax cable intended for burial, from what I remember it is somewhat tougher than regular coax but it is meant for cable technicians who bury cable for a living using a tool which just shoves the cable under sod and which would likely damage regular coax. If you take the time to lift the sod and bury the cable gently, then I believe regular coax is fine. Definitely use RG-6 for that kind of length.

Reception will be dependent upon lots of factors, but should be no worse that what you used to get when the antenna was on the house.

To achieve good results, the signal wll have to be amplified first at the pole, before the 100' long run from there to your beautiful house. So either a low-noise pre-amp, or a low-noise amp at the pole. With power already at the pole, there are many options for the exact amplifier to be used there.

Since you are apparently near Montreal, we'll have to caution that many people in your area are having very inconsistent results with amplifiers that normally excell in improving signals. So whatever amplfiier is used, it should have adjustable output power to allow for some initial tweaking.

The KitzTech amplifier is the best currently available for the money, and has adjustable power. It's also cheap, and definitely worth a try. Mount it inside a weatherproof box near the bottom of the pole (above snow levels) for easy access/service. An upside-down plastic ice-cream container makes an excellent enclosure, if painted to protect against UV rays. Or a plywood box.

Run one length of RG-6 coax from the amplifier up the pole to the antenna. Wrap electrical tape tightly around all coax connections. Run another length of RG-6 coax from the amplifier to the house, preferably inside some buried electrical conduit for protection and easy replacement in the future.

A coax grounding block is required where the coax enters the house. From there, it's just like any other cable for TV.

Given the difficulty of adjusting an antenna that is a long distance away and up on a pole, it's probably worthwhile to install an antenna rotor at the top of the pole, and then put your main TV antenna on top of that. Run the rotor control wires down the pole and through the same electrical conduit back to the house.

When installing all of this, you should include a complete separate run of RG-6 coax alongside the original, in the same conduit. This will allow you to have a second TV antenna lower down on the pole, pointed in a different direction than the original. This will be very handy (TV signals come from different directions, depending upon the station). But you won't need the second antenna initially, just allow for one by running the coax at the beginning.

With this setup, any good (10-14' long) UHF/VHF combo antenna will do the job nicely and without much fuss.

Summary:

-- low-noise amplifier: $65
-- 300' of RG-6 coax: $50
-- 100' of 3/4" electrical conduit and fittings: $220
-- UHF/VHF combo antenna: $75
-- antennal rotor w/control unit and 150' rotor wire: $90
-- tape, fittings, etc: $25
-- ice-cream: $5
-- labour: triple the above totals, or do it yourself with a friend.

I should really become a "pro" antenna installer someday. ;)

-ml

Hello cheryldj, please see the OTA FAQ for lots of important information about putting up antennas.

Long distances between the antenna and the TV(s) are okay if you use low-noise amplification and thick coaxial cable of at least RG-6 grade, but in your case since you want to bury the cable too I strongly suggest RG-11, which is thicker and more expensive, but does not suffer the same amount of line loss and is also very durable for burial. A very strong preamp like a Winegard AP-8275 will provide lots of power for overcoming line loss of such lengthy cabling, and can then be attenuated if it is too strong. You would probably want to set up either a large, deepest fringe combo antenna such as a Winegard HD8200P on a rotor so that you will get all the VHF/FM/UHF stations from the direction you point it, or else you might want to consider one of those big HD8200Ps aimed permanently at Montreal with a second smaller combo antenna like a Winegard HD7696P aimed permanently at the U.S. stations.

Also please follow the instructions in Post #10 of the OTA FAQ so that we can see your TVFool results.

The pole is situated about 100 feet from my house and I would run the wires underground.
Yeah, youll definately need a preamp to make up for the approx 150 ft of cable run youll have.

Thanks so much for the replies.

Here are some of my TV Fool results (out of about 51 stations listed). I have some doubts about them, since the first dozen stations are listed in green zone, meaning an indoor antenna should pick them up. But the DAE-100C antenna I set up atop a patio umbrella as an interim solution didn't bring a single channel in to my new HD converter box. Tested the box at a friend's 10 miles south and it registered CBC and CTV from Montreal and WCFE. Shadow of Adirondacks is a factor, I'm told. Also my woods, although I am on a slight ridge, and trees around house.

CIVM 50.5 NM (dB) -40.4 Pwr (dBm)
CBFT 50.1 -40.7
CBMT 47.9 -43
CJOH 44.4 -46.4
WCFE-DT 43.6 -47.2
CFCF 36.2 -54.7
CJNT 25.7 -65.1
CFTU 19.8 -71
WPTZ 10.4 -80.4
WCAX 10.1 -80.8
WNPI 8.1 -82.8
WVNY 6.9 -84
WETK 0.4 -90.5
WFFF -4.3 -95.1
CBMT-1 -16.9 -107.7

Wow. I feel like I had a flat tire and was aided by several Formula 1 pit crews.
Definitely think you could find jobs in my area. Great to have break-down. The cable seems so cheap I think I can go with stampeder's suggestion of RG-11 and feel safe.

Here are some of my TV Fool results (out of about 51 stations listed). I have some doubts about them, since the first dozen stations are listed in green zone, meaning an indoor antenna should pick them up. But the DAE-100C antenna I set up atop a patio umbrella as an interim solution didn't bring a single channel in to my new HD converter box. Tested the box at a friend's 10 miles south and it registered CBC and CTV from Montreal and WCFE. Shadow of Adirondacks is a factor, I'm told. Also my woods, although I am on a slight ridge, and trees around house.

CIVM 50.5 NM (dB) -40.4 Pwr (dBm)

Pprobably the listing for the Mount Royal location at full power. Currently operates at lower power from the mast of the Big Owe.


CBFT 50.1 -40.7
Currently operates at low power from the top of the Maison Radio Canada at lower power


CBMT 47.9 -43
Currently operates at low power from the top of the Maison Radio Canada at lower power


CJOH 44.4 -46.4
inactive


WCFE-DT 43.6 -47.2
You should get this one. Maybe the trees are in the way


CFCF 36.2 -54.7
Inactive


CJNT 25.7 -65.1
Inactive


CFTU 19.8 -71
Inactive

in the way
WPTZ 10.4 -80.4
Probably need a better antenna if there are trees in the way


WCAX 10.1 -80.8
Probably need a better antenna if there are trees in the way


WNPI 8.1 -82.8
Probably need a better antenna if there are trees in the way


WVNY 6.9 -84
Probably need a better antenna if there are trees in the way


WETK 0.4 -90.5
Probably need a better antenna if there are trees in the way


WFFF -4.3 -95.1
Probably need a MUCH better antenna if there are trees in the way


CBMT-1 -16.9 -107.7
Inactive, and not likely to ever be built.

Like you know, W52CD-LP started to broadcast WGMU part of the RTV network.

Yesterday night at 7:00 pm I was getting it on Ch 52 (Analogue) at about 40 %. These numbers are just value with my eyes because there is no signal meter in analogue.

This morning on my TivoHD I had nothing, so I put the coax on my Samsung TV because of the TivoHD tuner is not really sensitive in analogue.

I was getting it on the Samsung at about 10 - 20 %.

Remember, they are at 50 % output right now.

I will be working on my 4228 tomorrow if the weather is good. The balun on it right is a cheap Addison interior balun and since last year I learned a lot about baluns because of this website and MLord also.

I have to change my coax bettween the CM 7777 and the 4228 (cheap generic Addison Chinese coax). I going to try a Winegard balun left over for my FM antenna and ..... a coax balun tuned for ch 52.

I am really going balistc with these coax baluns.

I will see how the other channels; 3.1, 5.1, 33.1, 44.1 and 57.1 react to the coax balun tuned for 52.

Intravino

Hi,

I know there was a thread on this forum which explained all types of OTA antennas. Unfortunately I cannot find that thread anymore (might be closed, I don't know...).
So, I want to buy a OTA antenna for my 40" LCD TV. I'm looking for an indoor antenna with the biggest gain. I live close to Montreal (South shore - Brossard).
Thanks !

Pasaris, I've moved your post into this thread covering the South Shore so that you can read through it and see what other people have done for OTA success. :)

See these links too ------------------------------------->

I brought a corner reflector antenna at the country house to see if I could get anything there. I am in Ayer's Cliff and my antenna was on a chair at lake level. In DT, I could only receive WCAX. Signal was stable though at roughly 50 % (or medium level). I could not get anything else. I even tried with a channel 13 Yagi antenna but could not detect WVNY.

If only Mount Washington had a few transmitters on it...

Actually, Yagi, there might be more hope for you than you might think. My cottage is on Lake Memphremagog, in Ogden (if you're in Ayer's Cliff, you should know around where that is) I put up a Channel Master 4228HD a month ago with RG-6 and I get all the major networks more or less, WFFF being the exception in bad weather and WVNY requiring my "wrap-RG-6-around-power-cable" trick ( see my posts before). WCAX, WETK, WPTZ all come in fine, rain or shine!:D

In regards to WVNY, I've noticed is that my signal has not changed - 300ohm twin lead with RS VU-90, RG-6with VU-90, or CM 4228HD with RG-6... In all cases, I only get a signal by wrapping the cable around the power cords. Otherwise, with every antenna, the signal is at 17% - too low to lock. Any ideas?:confused:

I wonder if 57 will come in with the power boost, although I doubt it. At least the power boost gives it a presence (albeit at the bottom) on my Tvfool list.

EDIT: Yagi, try putting your antenna higher up. If I lower the antenna ~10ft, I loose everything but WCAX. I also suggest trying all the other channels before going for WVNY. WVNY is actually more stable on my Channel Master 4228HD than the RS VU-90 Yagi style antenna.

Thanks cptmds.
I tried the UHF antenna from the window on the second floor. I get a slight improvement on WCAX but I cannot lock the other channels. However, my TV set seems to detect a presence on WETK. I think it will be worth trying a better antenna (4228HD for instance) attached to a mast on the roof. However it will not be this year. My priority is to install my antennas in Montréal where I can get all the major channels except WCFE.
Yagi

I have no problem to get SRC - CBC & RQ in south shore of Montreal but i can't get TQS(V). Could I have the frequency in hertz please?

Thanks in advance

indida you can get that info for all stations in Canada here:

http://www.user.dccnet.com/jonleblanc/Canada_TV_Stations/

Hello ! I'm looking for a UHF/VHF/FM antenna. FM Fool tells me I'm surrounded by FM stations. TV Fool tells me TV stations come from three directions. I live 5 miles from downtown Quebec City. I don't know a local retailer with the antennas from the Stampeder's list. One local retailer has the Philips MANT950 for 40$. Reviews look average to good for this antenna and I believe the price is very good. Do you know this antenna? Looking at the shape, I thought it was (bi) directional, but people seem to say it's an omni... I also understand it's an amplified device, but I'd prefer unamplified. Could I simply use it without the amplifier? Thanks for you advices,

I am from the South Shore of montreal and after reading the Reception results forum, I decided to give it a try. I picked up a Channel master 4228HD along with a Channel master 7777 pre-amp. I was able to pick up all channels except ABC, which I know is VHF. I love the picture and was impressed with OTA so far.

The problem I have is that I want ABC HD :) The 4228HD does UHF and I have made sure the pre-amp switch is set to accept combined UHF/VHF. Any tips on how I can get ABC to work??

I have the antenna mounted on the roof about 20-25ft high. I also picked up a bunch of analogand CFCF12 and Global are the two most watched channels on the analog side, but with global, I can not seem to get a nice picture while maintaining good levels on digital.

EDIT: I ALSO JUST NOTICED 6.1 IS NOT THERE! Last night i put the antenna inside in my tv room and was able to get 6.1 but now that its outide its not getting it. Any ideas???

Any advice or tips would be greatly appreciated!

You need a VHF antenna. The CM7777 can combine the VHF and UHF antennas on seperate inputs with no loss.

Some have reported that the CM4228HD does hi-VHF. Though, IMO, the gain on hi-VHF would only be enough to support local stations.

There are several VHF options. Antennas Direct has the C5 compact VHF high. Winegard sells them as well.

Your best bet right now might be Delhi. They're selling off their stock on VHF antennas. Check your local Delhi-Wade distributor.