Prior to installing the amp, I was at -8 dB at 801 MHz (CATV). Now I'm at +4 dB, which is a way more amplification than what I was expecting out of this unit.
OK I'm a moron. Of course the amplification is +4 more than I expected. There used to be a 2-way splitter there (-3.5 dB). :rolleyes:

I doubt that the amp is self-terminating (that's usually a feature on high end gear) so if you haven't capped the unused outputs with terminators I'd recommend that.
Will do, thanks (until the basement is finished, when I will plug in 2 more TVs).

BTW, where do you guys get your terminators? I was considering ordering some off eBay, assuming they're just simple cheap resistors so pretty much all terminators so an eBay source should probably be OK (hopefully). (There is an Ontario seller that sells them for satellite setups.) But then I wonder why the Ideal terminators are going for $8 EACH at Home Depot. Simply ripoff, nothing more, or is there a reason the Ideal might be better?

The Source has them and they're inexpensive.

Eug,

Terminators are at Save and Replay for 2 for a dollar.

That seems to be the standard price at stores other than Home Depot.

I just bought a whack of them last weekend.

They're in Mississauga. You might think about going to their website, putting a shopping list together, and making a trip over to them. They ship too.

They are very helpful and knowledgeable.

But then I wonder why the Ideal terminators are going for $8 EACH at Home Depot. Simply ripoff, nothing more, or is there a reason the Ideal might be better?
The 8 dollars @ home depot is for 10 terminators, The source is the most expensive @ 2 for 3.79

Oh OK. Anyways, I just ordered 8 for $5 off eBay (shipped). The guy is from Ontario and is shipping Canada Post, so I figured I may as well. It will save me the trip out to Save and Replay in Mississauga.

Well, learned something new today...

I knew I had a CM3414 under the workbench still in its box. Opened it up and, lo and behold, its a PCT-MA2-4P...

Put it on the SA/TG and there is a DEFINITE difference in the response curves with all outputs properly terminated (around 9+/-1 dB flat from 50 to 1 GHz. Removed the three unused ports terminators and it got a pretty "wobbly", varying from around 7-12 dB (or so from memory). If I have time tomorrow, I'll try to post a plot from it and a couple of other 4-port DAs I have on hand. I know I have one from Antennas Direct, one from PDI (?), and one from Radio Shack that I've had for many years. Not sure where the RS one is, it might lying in my attic or in a junk box in the basement...

The plot made it pretty clear what the effect of open outputs did to the frequency response.

That's great info, ProjectSHO89 - good to see it confirmed and proven on the test bench. :) As roger1818 and others have discussed in the past in the OTA Forum, unterminated ports cause internal signal reflections that disrupt the proper signal.

Here ya go:


http://www.mediafire.com/imgbnc.php/c6ae36815f68c1c22303644ebbaf89656g.jpg

One output with the SA attached and the rest either all open or all terminated.

Regarding issues with my new Kitztech powered amp, some new developments.

Jeffrey from Kitztech phoned me up to help debug the issue. He has excellent customer service, you can tell he really believes in his product. He suggested a couple of things, but at the end of the conversation he mentioned about FMFool and maybe try a FM trap.

Last night I was getting good reception on 17 digital stations including all the Watertown stations without any amp. With the Kitz inserted near the receiver, it was all zeros across the board. However with the Kitz and an old FM trap I found in my junk bin, all signal strengths improved from the amp free numbers! Not sure why, I never thought I had a FM issue previously, I guess my cm7777s always had the trap in. Now I am looking forward to trying the Kitz at mast level, but I need to find a bigger box to include the FM trap. Has anyone else experienced this situation with a Kitz amp? You would think this was a common issue.

Looking at FMFool, all the Ottawa FM stations blast out 10.1 miles from me. Interesting because Camp Fortune is 20.6 miles from me. Does anyone know where the Ottawa FM antenna farm is??

Looking at FMFool, all the Ottawa FM stations blast out 10.1 miles from me. Interesting because Camp Fortune is 20.6 miles from me. Does anyone know where the Ottawa FM antenna farm is??

I don't trust FMFool in Canada. Unlike TVFool which now uses Industry Canada data for Canadian stations, I believe FMFool still uses only FCC data, giving it inaccurate and incomplete information.

To answer your question though, almost all of Ottawa's FM stations come from Camp Fortune. Only one station comes from HC, and that is CHRI.

Thanks for the info and plot ProjectSHO89. Great stuff!

In the last two years I have had 2 signal amplifiers ( between antenna and receiver) fail.

Any recommendations for a good quality signal line amp around 20 to 30 db gain?

Larry

Well, what were the make and model numbers of the ones that blew on you? No sense in recommending an amp if that was the brand/model that failed on you before, right? Can you give us the conditions that they were installed in (example: constantly getting beaten by sleet and hail, constantly baking in the sun etc.)? This may help in figuring out what caused them to fail in the first place. What's your grounding like?

How much were you intending on spending $20, $100, $200?

Curious: Which two amps have failed?

Panamark -

About your recent pre-amp death in a storm, can we re-think the pre-amp location between antenna and set and protection from storms? What would change in S/N, signal strength, or durability?

Being unwilling to climb to my roof to replace blown pre-amps (esp. the urban Winegard 269 with a bad rep for burn-outs), I opted for a +8 dB distribution amp to replace a -8 dB loss 4-way splitter, in the house but 60 feet below the antenna. Very happy with the results since it doesn't overload with local stations (the special role of the 269) but delivers a good signal for weak stations.

Backpaster,

Using the Kitztech low noise with a UVSJ as a filter allowed me to get CBOT on a consistent basis, CBOFT most of the time, and CityTv and Omni half the time

im near Lancaster, about 80 miles from CF, in a very poor signal area

I currently need it for both VHF and UHF so I can't use a UVSJ. It is a very good idea as I am concerned about the insertion loss of my FM trap. If it is greater than 1db, I might as well keep using my old CM7777. I think I may use your idea and redo my whole setup, go back to the cm7777 on the combo antenna and use the kitztech with a UVSJ on a single cut UHF antenna.

Balm: what were your results of using the Kitztech without the UVSJ?

Panamark -

About your recent pre-amp death in a storm, can we re-think the pre-amp location between antenna and set and protection from storms? What would change in S/N, signal strength, or durability?

Being unwilling to climb to my roof to replace blown pre-amps (esp. the urban Winegard 269 with a bad rep for burn-outs), I opted for a +8 dB distribution amp to replace a -8 dB loss 4-way splitter, in the house but 60 feet below the antenna. Very happy with the results since it doesn't overload with local stations (the special role of the 269) but delivers a good signal for weak stations.

Yah it took me almost a year and a half but I finally figured it out. I just needed a low noise distro amp to do the trick. I had a KitzTech amp laying around and installed it to get by until the pre amp was back from repair. Guess what, the Kitz Tech works just as good.
Thanks for the suggestion.

Must be late in the day for me, but are you saying you used the Kitztech amp as a distribution amp and then the roof pre-amp was just as good as ??????

In some ways, the high-gain / low-noise antenna pre-amps make very nice urban distribution indoor amps because some of the strong local signals (with overload potential) have been reduced by passage down the downlead. So you get the gain and amp-S/N, with less fear of overload (but after downlead signal losses, of course).

(Of course, a purpose-built distribution amp with 4 outputs is a neater package sitting on the living room floor.)

Is it fair to say an amp used indoors is unlikely to die the way outdoor amps do?

backpackster,

so far the new Kitztech is doing very well, but only with the UVSJ filtering,

the UVSJ, or Kitztech each on their own are not sufficient to pull in some very weak 2nd edge Ottawa stations