: ON - City of Toronto Metro Area <OUTDOOR Antennas Only> - OTA
El Gran Chico
2011-10-12, 09:51 PM
My problem channels are OMNI2 and CITYTV. Having some issues with signal for them.
Don't forget these are moving from FCP to the CN Tower in November (was supposed to be October bt now delayed a few weeks). The 200 meters increase in height should make a huge difference in signal strength.
2011-10-12, 09:53 PM
From what I heard today at work, Rogers is still prepping the CN Tower facility.
I spent some time this evening playing with my rotator now that the weird tropo has passed.
WPXJ ION is still coming in strong for me at around full strength. I think I'm in a lucky location.
WBBZ is still coming in without any problems but the signal strength is back down to where is makes me sweat when I look at it. For the last several days, WBBZ has been a near perfect appearing to be at near maximum reception. This shows how the rotator is a big help. Without it I would have been getting dropouts. With it, I need to use the rotator to find the strongest sweet spot to make it work.
It's pretty much official now. I'm not catching even a sniff of CKVR from my place even with the rotator. As such, I have eliminated it from my reception reports. I used to get a watchable signal on analog 3 off the back of my 4221hd believe it or not. Now I'm like everyone else waiting for CTV2 CKVR to start broadcasting from Hamilton, if it ever happens.
Phybersplice, you might want to consider a pre-amp, but not a very strong one. Look at my TV Fool. We're practically neighbours. I'm about two miles closer to the CN Tower than you are and I have a 7778 and it's not causing much trouble as far as I'm concerned. I own a spare Kitztech that you could try out. Eventually I will buy a Winegard 269 because I'm very curious about it. If I were you, I'd start with the Winegard pre-amp. Without a pre-amp, I get drop-outs of WGRZ, WNYB, WPXJ, WBBZ. I wouldn't be without one. I know there are other experts here on DH that suggest trying to go without the pre-amp if you can, but I only ever had frustration without the pre-amp.
Speaking of CityTV, Omni 1, and Omni 2 with poor signal strength...I installed an Antennacraft HBU55 and a 20foot tower and ten foot mast (35ft), with 7777 and rotator in Jackson's Point last weekend (see my post in the Barrie thread). The resident did not get City, Omni 1, and Omni 2. I told them to to wait and see. I hope this move happens soon. With the addition of those channels, that guy is going to have a pretty awesome free TV setup pretty far away with every Toronto channel plus Barrie, Midland, and Peterborough.
2011-10-12, 10:28 PM
I am getting Ion channels most of the time with help of the rotator , but not on the days like today.I think my next step will be replacing my distributor amp with channel master preamp. Not sure what should I get 7778 or 7777 My location is mississauga east , so I am pretty close to the CN tower , but I would like for Ion channels to be more reliable.
Don't get a 7777. Research Stampeder's pre-amp chart. I went with the 7778 but there might be a better choice for you. Any gain above 10dB is probably all you need to lock-on to WPXJ if the signal is present in your neighbourhood. a brand name pre-amp might work better than your current distribution amp because it is closer to the antenna and because it has a slightly lower noise figure than most distribution amps.
2011-10-12, 11:21 PM
Just guessing, but 49.3 and 49.4 are probably the "actual" channels and get remapped to 49.1 and 49.2. A lot of stations in the States are on the .3 sub-channel, perhaps to avoid conflicts with another station's .1 virtual channel number. I get much the same situation with Rochester's WHAM - I can see the main channel on both 13.1 and 13.3 and the secondary channel on 13.2 and 13.4
To confuse us even further there are those data-only channels PBS transmits, so at some point you may pick up 43.8 and 43.9 (not sure from memory if those are the correct subs),
El Gran Chico
2011-10-13, 12:15 AM
With it, I need to use the rotator to find the strongest sweet spot to make it work.
Totally agree with HWP. It can be a very useful fine tuning aid. Also fun to experiment with for tropo nights. :cool:
...but I only ever had frustration without the pre-amp.
Again, 100% agreed with HWP. No signs of overload here either.
Well, it's raining again tonight, and my problem station WNYO 49.1/.2 is back again. I've been watching the weather fairly closely for the past several weeks and the pattern holds nearly 100% of the time. Clear, its missing. Rain, I receive it. Sort of like the rain kills something interfering on 680 to 686 MHz. :confused:
El Gran Chico,
Maybe you can solve your channel 49 problem once-and-for-all by installing a water tap for your hose in your basement beside your TV!
2011-10-13, 10:27 AM
El Gran Chico,
49 is the station I'm most likely to lose after Ion. That being said, i get Ion about 50% of the time in the evenings (very little during the day), but I get 49 about 95% of the time.
Can't say I ever noticed much of a pattern to when 49 drops out. It came in just fine rain or shine this week.
2011-10-13, 03:23 PM
For some odd reason, I had lost all US stations and Hamilton this afternoon at lunch, and only the strongest stations from the CN tower were coming through. I wish I had time to investigate but had to run back to work.
As for 49.3& 49.4, pretty sure there was a 49.1 and 49.2 in addition to 3 & 4, but I just couldn't tune into 3 & 4. I would have thought the tuner would ignore/not display untuneable data streams.
2011-10-13, 08:23 PM
Everything is working great for me including ION and WNYB and all the others, but no WBBZ unfortunately. Even WXXI is still coming in.
2011-10-13, 08:35 PM
"I would have thought the tuner would ignore/not display untuneable data streams."
In an ideal world with consistent signals, yes. Most likely, at some point channel 49 was strong enough to be decoded but not strong enough to be correctly remapped to .1 and .2
This, of course, is conjecture. It might be a problem with the station's PSIP generator...or ghosts.:p
2011-10-16, 02:45 PM
I just bought a house in the long branch area of Toronto, near Kipling and lake shore blvd and I need advice on a setup for my location. I am hoping to get all the Toronto channels and most of the Buffalo ones. Some suggestions on what equipment will get me results would be greatly appreciated.
My tvfool is here (http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d60b5615840a119)
2011-10-16, 04:54 PM
Welcome to the forums, MikoZango!
I think it's amazing when you see a report that shows a station 80 miles away as LOS (line of sight). Only in the great lakes...
What type of set up were you hoping to establish (what's your budget)? Does your home already have a tower/roof top antenna?! I know many homes in that area already do.
2011-10-16, 06:06 PM
The house does not have any pre-existing antenna or tower. What I was initially thinking of doing was getting a 4221HD and a J mount and mounting it to the roof or side of house. Is there a specific combo you could recommend me? Will I require a pre-amp, which would you recommend for my situation?
2011-10-16, 09:21 PM
HWP suggested I get a pre-amp to improve reliability so I picked up a pre-amp (7778). I felt the Winegard 269 wouldn't have offered me much gain considering I already have about 10-12db of loss with the two splitters I have. I have it all setup (jeez, it's getting cold on the balcony) and did some fine tuning of the 4221 which is pointed due south.
Here's my findings so far this evening after repointing my Buffalo Antenna:
WGRZ 2.1 is coming in stable at 63-68% (which has been my problematic channel) - can this be improved?
WIVB 4.1 100%
WKBW 7.1 93%
WNED 17.1 100%
WNYO 23.1 93%
WUTV 29.1 93%
WNYO 49.1 100%
Cool TV 49.2 100%
iON 51.1 38-40% (how can this be improved)
quobo 51.2 40%
iON Life 51.3 40%
I'll retune my CN Tower antenna tomorrow and report on my findings.
Wondering if I would also need a Drop Amp as well...
2011-10-16, 10:06 PM
My Bbrother--in-law lives in etobicoke and is interested in OTA.
TV fool: http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d60b500fc3537c7
Today I brought over a my leftover Y5 7-13 and did some experimenting. Based on my reading of Toronto reception threads, I thought that the Y5 7-13 would guarantee stable CHCH reception. So I mounted it on a rake and pointed it it east towards the CN tower just to make sure that his 6 year old SAMSUNG TV was equipped for digital signals. To my surprise it picked up CHCH even though the antenna was pointed in the wrong direction! Other channels caught were: CFTO, CBLT, Global, CITY, and Omni. He was impressed with the sharpness and the clarity of the picture.
Our next step is to mount and combine the Y5 7-13 with a UHF antenna on a chimney mounted mast. The job of the UHF antenna will be to snare reliable Buffalo signals of the major networks. We will be using 50 feet of rg6 and the signal will be split 4 different ways in the house.
My short list of UHF antennas includes
Antennas Direct DB 8
What UHF antenna would you suggest?
Would a pre-amp be needed to make Buffalo reliable?
Would a drop amp be needed?
All opinions will be appreciated greatly!
2011-10-16, 11:01 PM
chinadog - Are you including in your 50 feet of RG6, the distance to each TV?
You probably will need a drop amp for sure.
I am now a believer of pre-amps -- my previous post above is helping me get a number of channels - especially iON. If I unplug the pre-amp power block, I see No Program Available on my TV. Plug it in, and I get the channel. Seems like it's doing what it's supposed to do.
Do you have any obstructions or can you see the CN tower?
I'd do a 4228HD and point it halfway in between the CN Tower and Buffalo and see what you'd get. Even setting it up on a rotator might be beneficial considering you have SouthWestern Ontario channels available too. I'd be more curious if you can pull in WROC.
2011-10-16, 11:24 PM
Thanks for the reply Phybersplice!!! You're so right about the drop amp as there will be at least another 25 feet of RG6 in each of the 4 drops.
I was planning to aim directly at Buffalo as the CN tower signals should come in by default. I can't see the CN tower but I know that Global and City came in on VHF antennna 5 feet above the ground on a rainy day so I don't expect any problems. I am worried, however, that a pre-amp might overheat the CN tower signals and cause problems. Are you in the Etobicoke area? Is your set up similar?
Hey El Gran Chico, What do you think of my plans? (post 1837) I see that you are in the same neighborhood - Royal York and Bloor.
El Gran Chico
2011-10-17, 11:02 AM
Hi Chinadog, my DB-8 (chimney-mounted,aimed directly at Buffalo)/7778 setup works fairly well for that area. Going to work even better when CITY and the Omni2 go to the CN Tower (they are a bit of a problem for me from FCP at my loation). :cool:
There are lots of 4221s in this area but I fear all these people lost CHCH. I can't comment on a 4228 since I've never owned one. FWIW, this forum's sponsor recommended the DB-8 over the 4228 and I'm not disappointed.
I also split my signal 4 ways - first split right after the pre-amp power injector, then at both TVs (one to the TV, one to the DVR). I have about 40' of cable to the 1st splitter, then about 20' to one tv and about 60' to the other.
Hope that helps.