Do you think the 4228 has better VHF Hi reception than the newer model? I really wish there was a way to determine if I could get CHCH off of a 4228HD from my location. Scruffy, I assume that you would be letting us know if you are in a high rise.. I'm a Keele and St. Clair, so I'm quite a ways down the hill.. from you..

My antenna is chimney-mounted on my bungalow, so about 20 to 25 feet above the ground.

From what I can see on Ken Nist's HDTV Primer site, the new 4228HD has a bit of an issue at channel 11RF (about 3dB less gain than the classic 4228 for a "modified" 4228HD) so no real good news on that front. Check his site for all the info. Maybe that'll help you decide.

Do you think the 4228 has better VHF Hi reception than the newer model? I really wish there was a way to determine if I could get CHCH off of a 4228HD from my location. Scruffy, I assume that you would be letting us know if you are in a high rise.. I'm a Keele and St. Clair, so I'm quite a ways down the hill.. from you..
I know somebody receiving CHCH with a 4-bay UHF clone mounted outside at Dundas&Roncesvales with a clear view towards the transmitter. The antenna is aimed at Buffalo nonetheless.

This is all very encouraging, I'm not far at all from Dundas and Roncesvales, I'm actually quite a bit higher up at St. Clair and I have a very clear view in all southern directions. My location is 40 miles from the CHCH tower and CM advertises the 4228 as having a VHFhi range of 45 miles... based on these facts and your comments, I feel very confident that I will be able to lock onto CHCH with the 4228, I have heard of other poeple on here being able to consistantly acquire WPXJ with the 4228, so the only real wildcard for me here is WBBZ... would love to pick up the 30 or so Yankees games and ThisTV... has anyone here ever picked up this stations with a 4228? I'm only 60 miles to the transmitter with around half of that being over water... It doesn't sound impossible that I would get a somewhat consistent signal?? especially in the summer when I want to catch the Yankee's?

Jakeman,

I'm afraid that the only people I know of in Toronto that have picked up WBBZ are people that have gone to the measure of getting either a combo antenna with aim or a ten element high-vhf yagi, outside, with aim. I have not even heard of any WBBZ success with a C5 from Toronto.

Hoping to get rf7 on a 4228hd without even aiming sounds overly optimistic.

If you want to maximize your chances of watchable reception of WBBZ during baseball season, you'll probably need a pre-amp, rotator, and a high gain VHF antenna.

If any readers here have ever locked on to WBBZ with a 4228hd for a long enough stretch to watch a baseball game, please let us know.

Please read through the WBBZ/WNGS-dedicated thread that chronicals our may efforts to get WNGS from Toronto.

I know you won't like this, but I see a tripod or tower in your future. ;>)

Hi,

I am new to OTA and I'm looking to purchase an Antenna and Receiver (my tv is not equipped).

My TV fool results are as follows:

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d60b5ffc1cc9e25

I live in a two-story house with a flat roof, and I plan on mounting my antenna to my chimney using a pole, it's really the only place I can get a secure mount. I also have a large tree directly in my front yard that will be directly south of the antenna which I imagine will cause some problems.

I'm looking for recommendations for an antenna that will get me Toronto channels and then I guess either Rochester or Buffalo. I'm close to the CN tower so I figure if I aim to the States then I should be able to pick up Toronto with the rear or side lobe of the antenna. From the guide it looks like maybe a Winegard HD7078P could do the trick

Any recommendation for a receiver would also be appreciated.

Thanks,
Alex

I've pulled in WBBZ with a couple of 4221s (stacked vertically) and a CM7777 pre-amp long enough to watch a Yankees game (I'm at Kipling and Bloor).

However, overall the WBBZ signal isn't very reliable.

My issue is finding a reliable signal for WGRZ (2-1 and 2-2). My antenna's pointed directly south (titled slightly to the east). I've tried everything but for some reason the signal is very unreliable. All of the other Buffalo and Toronto channels are perfect.

Here's my TV fool report:

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d60b54c31a712fa

Any suggestions?

Speaking of WBBZ it's been coming in strong since last night and again this morning. I wish it was more reliable.

I'm happy to report that WBBZ has continued to stick around for me quite reliably from when I put my vhf antenna up in June until now in early October.

I'm still not holding my breath for when the winter comes though.

I did some more playing today.

Left my CM4221HD as is (not messing with a good thing), but changed my WG Y10-7-13 previously pointed at Barrie (didn't get CKVR very much) and pointed it at Hamilton instead. I removed the CS5 that was pointed at Hamilton for some testing.

I actually put the CS5 outside. I have a balcony that has a westerly/northerly exposure. Tried pointing the CS5 right at Barrie and got...zip. I got a whiff of CKVR a few times, but couldn't lock it. I then pointed the CS5 at Hamilton expecting to see a 100% signal since the antenna was now outside as opposed to in my attic and....it made no difference! Still ~70% SS.

So, I've given up on CKVR, removed the CS5, and will just used the WG Y10-7-13 to get CHCH and CTV Toronto.

Final scientific conclusion after much tinkering: these VHF stations suck! :)

CHCH and CKVR are only 40 miles away. I can get ION (95 miles away) much easier than I can get CKVR.

I'd conclude that unless you have a good outdoor yaggi VHF setup, you're not going to see much of CKVR in the GTA.

I'm near College and University (just moved from Vancouver) and the landlord has an antenna on the roof. I don't know what kind of antenna as I haven't been up to the roof yet.

I get all the Toronto channels (I'm a mile from the CN tower so...) and I get the following from the US:

WUTV-DT FOX
WKBW-DT ABC
WGRZ-DT NBC
WNYO-DT MyN
WNLO-DT CW

I don't seem to get PBS or CBS though.

Anyone having any issues with WGRZ this evening? I had remounted my CM4221HD on a taller mast which clears my balcony glass and metal railing. My lower bowtie is not blocked anymore.

Earlier this afternoon, I was pulling WIVB 4-1 at 95% and WGRZ 2-1 was 80%.

Tonight I am getting 0%-20%.

I'm not sure what is different for WGRZ -- this is one of the hardest for me to receive for whatever reason. So intermittant.

Yes, WGRZ was acting up for me yesterday too.

It doesn't happen often, but from time to time it drops out for a short while When it's here, it's strong.

Backyardguy the only thing you could try is using a single 4221 at a higher height or moving the antenna to find a stronger signal .Moving an antenna as little as 2 feet sometimes makes a big difference.Your WGRZ is 2 edge so no LOS which usually means unreliable.Try inputing 40 feet in your tv fool an see if this changes your WGRZ to atleast 1 edge.

Ok ... thanks Schmerpy for confirming.

Question to all.

My mast seems like it has enough room to fit a 4220HD. I already have an unmodded 4221HD.
I am having some reception issues getting OMNI 1 and CHCH. New development is that CityTV is now unreliable (it was working before). I can't seem to hit that sweet spot between WGRZ and CHCH. Would setting up the existing 4221HD and pointing it somewhere in between the CN Tower and Buffalo along with using a 4220HD and pointing it towards Hamilton be a smart move?

I have a flat coax wire strip and one 2 way splitter in the mix as well. I am not sure if a pre-amp would be needed in this case either.

Also to note, I do not have a clear view to the CN Tower ... I must be getting reflection from the condo in front of me.

I'm surprised you're having trouble with a 4221 mounted outside on a balcony. What floor are you on and do you have a southerly line of sight that's not blocked?

I'm on the 6th floor at 135 Wynford Drive. The CN Tower is blocked by the Forrester's Building at Don Mills and Eglinton.
I have the blue Tridel Accolade blocking the true southern view.
Do you want to see a picture?

OK, finally getting around to making my post here.

First order of business, TV FOOL (http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d60b5339eb7b8f3).

Just moved to around Kipling and Horner (halfway between QEW and Lakeshore). During the summer months, I can see a straight shot at the lake itself, and can see the CN tower from the edge of the flat roof (about 30 feet high). My challenges are:
1) I am right beside an active railroad. I mean, if I dropped a penny off the roof, it have a chance at hitting a train. I have noticed signals go squirly whenever trains go by, even though the antenna is above them.
2) Two Heating/AC Units spread apart (one east, one west)
3) Lots of trees (40-50 feet), the biggest one blocking the Hamilton Line of Sight ($#@!), and some smaller ones that block the CN Tower with strategic placement. Helps me avoid overload in some cases.
4) Possible interference from a big water tower, but it's not in the path of Hamilton or US stations.

The gear:
Good:
-----
-CM-7777
-Potential access to some RG-11 soon, plus necessary tools and fittings. Currently on neglected RG6
-Some CM 4 Port Distribution Amps (currently out of the loop).
-Some Power Passing splitters to route power to the CM-7777
-CM7000PAL on one TV
-Samsung UN40D6000 (really great tuner performance wise, just low on features)
-DIGIAIR 2 meter
BAD
----
-Piece of Excrement (PoE) 4228 clone. Attached to a J-Pole which is screwed down to some 4x4 concrete curbs (x3 short lengths, ziptied together... *sigh*).

GOALS
------
-I want consistent signal access to CHCH, ION, and the CN tower stations. I sometimes get overloaded by 23-1, 17-#, earlier I had issues with 9-1. Currently 5-1 drops out for some weird reason, and most mysteriously, 29-1 and 49-1 goes from 100% to dropping out
-I am going to split it amongst many units in the building. Being on one of the longest run, I think I am getting killed on the high end (ION!).
-Currently servicing 4 TVs, going to increase once I get the antenna situation corrected
-Setup

8 Bay ->CM7777-->6 way splitter. have tried 3 way & 4-DA to 3 more TVs. Lengths of the farthest TVs (all RG6 currently) are about 125 feet.
......................|->One unit, with Preamp PS

I'm thinking of getting an Winegard 8200u, simply because I'm struggling with CHCH VHF out the side of the antenna past obstacles, although I'm tempted to get 7698 to make it safer from a wind perspective (winds are pretty wicked coming off the lake, and the trains don't help). Haven't been here for a winter yet.

Due to landlord restrictions, I can't penetrate the roof. Thinking of a wallmount with a telescoping mast, sticking out 10 ft over the rooftop to clear the Heating/AC units.

I realize my CN tower issues are due to antenna location/pointing. Currently aimed south, in a position to barely get CHCH while losing out on CN tower signals.

TV Signals
2-1, 2-2 (strong to medium)
4-1 (medium to weak)
5-1 (Dropping out 50% of the time)
7-1 (medium to weak)
8-1, 8-2 (recent addition, out most of the time)
9-1 (medium)
11-1 (Dropping out 50% of thE time)
17-1,2,3 (Strong)
19-1 (currently weak, used to overwhelm)
23-1 (Strongest)
25-1 (medium to weak)
26-1,2,3,4 (Dropping out 50% of thE time)
29-1,2 (varies from strong to dropping out)
36-1 (Strong)
41-1 (Medium)
47-1 (Strong to medium)
49-1,2 (varies from strong to dropping out)
51-1,2,3 (I get it sometimes if I am lucky)
57-1 (Strong)
66-1 (medium to weak)
69-1 (Strong to medium)

Insahnity, I know the area well--lived there as a younger man, and I still have family there.

You need to remove the CM7777 from your setup. That's too much power for your location, and it's over driving the strongest stations. This is evidenced by "weakness" on the strongest stations like CBC, TVO, etc. Too much signal is just as bad (if not worse) than not enough. This is especially true with tuners that are sensitive to adjacent signals, such as the CM7000Pal.

If possible, I would use the distribution amp only--and only one of them! You won't need to install 11U coax; RG6 is fine.

You may wish to read through the ganging thread. One antenna pointed at Toronto, the other Buffalo/Hamilton, joined together, should be all you need at your location.

Nothing can be done about the trains. That's the busiest rail corridor in Canada. Maybe a slight up tilt to the Toronto antenna could help.

I've actually already tried having just a CM 4-DA with no CM-7777, and no amplifiers whatsoever. I start losing distant Buffalo stations. I may get them in the summer, but past rain storms have shown that it's not guaranteed. It's kind of difficult with a suspect antenna setup.

To give some perspective on strong signals, the strongest station is either 9-1 or 23-1 (usually 23-1). After the CM-7777 it's sitting at a whopping 50 dB over the background, whereas 51 is about 5. If I remove the CM-7777 then i get the 23-1 down to more reasonable levels, but I lose ION.

The loss in CN tower signals has to do with the trees I have hidden my antenna behind. If I put it out front where I have LoS to both CN tower and buffalo, then yeah, the CM-7777 blows the signal right out of the water. By moving it 12 feet back from the southern edge of the roof, I can get the weak buffalo stations without being overwhelmed by the CN tower. In a cheeky way, it's my poor man's version of a notch filter.

Currently, my setup is quite portable. I want to figure out where is the optimal location and put a proper setup with a decent antenna. I figure I can't get worse than driveway curbs holding a clone antenna on a rooftop.

As for ganging, I m toying with the idea of pointing a Wineguard at the US, and trying (somehow) to pickup CHCH with the 8 bay bowtie clone. Although the CN tower stuff is quite low, I'm not to concerned about that, as I know it's just a matter of placement. I won't know until I try, but the major worry is in combining the two signals properly. Once I get the Wineguard I'll start fiddling around for an optimal setup. By the way, this 8-bay bowtie has that flex in the middle to turn it in to two 4-bays pointed at different directions, I could potentially work something in that to catch local signals.

As for the multiple 4-DAs, it's in anticipation of the multiple TVs I will be supplying. By my calculations, some of the runs could potentially end up being almost 300 feet from the antenna. I think my final setup will eventually have at most one 4-DA to service the furthest TVs (if absolutely necessary), although they introduce a lot of noise. The CM-7777 helps with all the long wire lengths and the splitters. Just hoping i can find a way to preserve the high-end ch 51 across these lengths.