...your CM4228 should be aimed at 140 degrees to pick up Buffalo. In your case, all the Buffalo channels are pretty much in a straight line.

The Toronto channels are about 100 degrees for you.Thanks for that info Intrac. If at all possible I think it would be great if posters to this GTA Results thread will try to include compass bearings for the strongest signals they get from the CN Tower, other GTA stations, Buffalo stations, and perhaps Rochester stations too. Thanks in advance! I think we'll be able to define a GTA sweet-spot of +/- a few degrees azimuth for each target so that people initially setting up their antennas will have a good head start. BTW a properly calibrated Channel Master rotator should give you the exact azimuth on its STB's front panel at any given time. I think some other brands have that feature too.

Have you looked into any of the winegard antennas? I personally have not tried them, but they do have a set for urban areas. Try looking at the squareshooter http://www.winegard.com/offair/squareshooter.htm

It might give you additional signal from Buffalo or improve your Toronto signal. Just a thought.

mjm

The situation with Peter is his ATI card and he's been consulting in the home computer forum about it too. Its not about an antenna issue.

For the record, a Winegard Square Shooter is not a good option for GTA reception of Buffalo signals. Stick with what works (i.e. what you see in the GTA Results thread) so that you don't get disappointed. Remember folks, there's a world of difference between what a lab test or company website says and what happens in reality. From GTA the options for Buffalo will be clear to someone reading through that thread and the specific antenna threads here in the OTA Forum.

I personally suggest a Channel Master 4228 but I acknowledge that there are a wide variety of situations that would affect a person's decision. That's why this forum and its information threads are here: just read through, and if you don't get your answer, ask.

Isn't it great? No more OTA guesswork needed anymore! :)

Well, I should be getting my Zenith SAT-HD520 any day now, as well as an HD plasma, so I thought I would get a head start on my OTA antenna question. I'll first try the RS 1880 indoor antenna that I currently have but am strongly considering either a CM4221 or Winegard PR4400 for my balcony.

Here's my dillema, if anyone has any thoughts. I'm currently in an apartment, 5th floor balcony facing west (therefore with an unobstructed south view as well), at the corner of Bloor/West Mall, which is a few meters west of the 427. I'm at the south end of the building but there is still about 30-40 feet of wall south of me (and therefore that much of the apartment obscures my easterly view to the CN tower, as well as 2 floors above me). I would very much like to get CBC HD for the hockey games, as well as CTV HD. The stations are only about 10-15km away.

Do you guys think I'll be able to get those with either of the above antennas? (leaning towards the 4400 since it has a little more sensitivity below channel 25 where CBC is) I am assuming that the Buffalo channels should be no problem. Any thoughts would be appreciated.

...
Do you guys think I'll be able to get those with either of the above antennas? (leaning towards the 4400 since it has a little more sensitivity below channel 25 where CBC is) I am assuming that the Buffalo channels should be no problem. Any thoughts would be appreciated.

Congrats on the Plasma. CBC-HD is easy to get...I wouldnt be surprised if you are able to receive it with a whip-antenna indoors!!!

But for Buffalo because of the distance, thats where you'll need to look at better antennas, the CM 4221 & 4228 seems to be acclaimed antennas. Theres a great thread about them.

Looks like we're neighbours. I live in one of those little bungalows at Bloor/Renforth, just a block or two from you. I can't actually see the CN tower from my house, but it doesn't seem to matter as the area appears to be able to receive the Toronto stations quite well. Initially, I just put a little indoor loop antenna on top of the TV and was amazed it pulled in almost everything from Toronto and Buffalo, with the exception of City-TV and CKXT (SunTV) from Toronto. The Buffalo stations were OK, although NBC and ABC were inconsistent. Then I put a CM-4221 on the roof, played around with pointing it between Toronto and Buffalo, (ended up somewhere in the middle) and all the stations are coming in perfectly. I read the entire 4221/4228 thread, and concluded that the 4221 was the better choice for me, as even though it's not as powerful, it seems to do a better job pulling in both Toronto and Buffalo. This should work for you too, especially since your east view is limited, but south is good.....go halfway and you should be fine.

Thanks for the replies guys. I walk by those bungalows all the time these days with my new kid.

I saw the 4228 at Hosick today and it wasn't as big as I expected - I could easily use it. However, like you said Zooka, the 4221 would probably do a little better bringing in both T.O. and Buffalo. Tough decision as there are no returns.

How about the Rochester stations, are any of those coming in with the 4221? And what are you guys doing for regular NTSC (VHF) - for example CTV HD doesn't broadcast all day does it? My wife wouldn't be happy if she couldn't watch a few programs during the day on channel 9.

DTV stations broadcast in digital 24 hours a day, and so there is no switching back and forth between ATSC and NTSC on those channels. What you do see is switching back and forth between SD and HD, depending on what the original program has been recorded in.

Regarding analog stations, you'll get lots of them where you are. As for Rochester, make sure to read through the threads here, especially the ones on Tropospheric Skip and DXing. Rochester reception will be extremely rare for you in most cases.

In that case it looks like the 4221 it is. (maybe the Winegard version)
Perfect!

In that case it looks like the 4221 it is. (maybe the Winegard version)
Perfect!

A 4221 5 floors up at Bloor/West Mall's even aimed at Buffalo is going to pull in the Toronto channels without any problem. ;)

In that case it looks like the 4221 it is. (maybe the Winegard version)
Perfect!We haven't had much discussion here about the Winegard PR-4400 4-bay Bowtie Reflector so if you go for that one we'll need to get your details. The CM4221 is a very well known quantity here at DHC.

Zooka,
I too live in a bungalow in Renforth/Bloor area. I don't have an OTA setup but am looking into it half-seriously (I kick myself for taking down the antenna tower years ago). I'm curious to see how your roof antenna looks. Are you on Bloor or Renforth? Also what tuner do you have? You can PM me.

Thanks,
MarcD

I set up my antenna, CM4221 and Zenith HD520 receiver. I get the following:

23-1 good
5-1 good
66-1 good

29-1 interruptions
9-1 heavy interruptions

Not promising. My antenna is pointed pretty much directly south (5th floor), but I guess the side of the building is killing me, as just 20 degrees more south-east is blocked. Oh well. My receiver might not be the best at multipath rejection but that shouldn't affect the buffalo channels.

seememom sorry that you did not get all the stations you wanted properly.

From your location you need to point to antenna south east for the Buffalo stations that 20' more east at least.

Cn tower you need almost east.

Can you get reflected signals from the other buildings near by ?

I tried some adjustments of the antenna, but no location better than simply south. Pointing it south east puts it right into the side of the building. I will try to adjust things a little more, but I don't think it's going to work unless I move. The roof would be ideal. We'll see. Maybe I'll have to move.

Maybe I'll have to move.Now that's somebody who really WANTS their OTA!!!! Right on seememom! :D Er... um... sorry OTA didn't work out for you there. ;)

Well a quick update. (and yes I really want OTA - growing up without cable made me real cheap - and I already asked about the other side of the building - there is a spot available)

Anyway, at lunch per Yaamon's suggestion I pointed the antenna due west, right at the 5-story building accross the street.

Result - I get all the Toronto channels 100% - of course no Buffalo channels

I would be relatively happy about this if Global and CH broadcasted in HD.

I will be probably go ahead and pick up the plasma with only the T.O. stations for now. I must say that the antenna is excellent (the highly touted RS indoor antenna picked up absolutely nothing), and I think the HD tuner is pretty good too since it's happy with the reflected signal.

All in all time well spent during lunch.
Thanks for all the suggestions.

seememom Iam glad that you were able to get a good strong reflected signal from the other building nothing wrong with that. :)

I think Global HD should be online sometime in the spring to early summer with Omni 1 and 2.

I have been able to pick up about four or five DTV channels with a cheap indoor antenna, that was not amplified. I live in a condo near Spadina and Richmond. My condo has a north facing balcony with no exposure to the south. Is it even remotely possible to think of getting any stations outside of Toronto, maybe something from the U.S.?

From my knowledge gathered so far it is great to have southern exposure with a clear view, which is not happening. Is there a way to compensate for that? Will amplification help or would a Winegard Squareshooter help? I know a squareshooter is designed to catch reflected signals but I am just not convinced it would work in my case because there does not seem to be any surface for a signal to reflect off of when I look out from my balcony.

Any help or ideas would be appreciated. Or even a firm, no, hope post would help,lol I just wanted to make sure I have not missed anything before I stick with a basic antenna to receive my Toronto stations.

thanks

A Winegard Square Shooter is for local stations but is not designed for fringe reception of the kind you are facing. Some of the GTA folks will give you some good info, but for now don't investigate metro/urban antennas. Don't put much stock in marketing blabber found on commercial web sites either.

http://www.digitalhomecanada.com/forum/showpost.php?p=210931&postcount=1