Spech,
With an ATSC tuner, you have a choice: you can watch SD (on any TV) at far higher quality levels than NTSC can deliver, or with an HD display, see yet another leap in image quality from SD to HD for the limited subset of programs broadcast in HD.


Thanks for the explanation, fbov. I had no idea I could use an ATSC tuner on a regular SDTV.

If this is true, then which combination would produce the best quality:

* HDTV with ATSC tuner on analog cable
* SDTV with ATSC tuner on digital cable

I've been doing some more testing with my ZSS clone. A couple of things I've noticed, it's very sensitive to the direction you point it.

With the pHDTV3 that I have, I usually get the best result when the antenna is standing upwards like a x-mas tree and the top is facing the direction of the antenna. Sometimes just moving the antenna a foot to the left or right can also make a difference. I'm quite surprise to see how sensitive it is compared to rabbit ears.

Another thing I noticed which greatly affects my DTV reception are the rabbit ears that come with the pHDTV3. I've noticed everytime I raise and expand those 2 antennas, it seems to interfere with my DTV reception and drop my reception by about 30%-50%. Does this make sense? I thought the antennas would mostly affect VHF and not UHF reception. So far I've had to retract those antennas and fold them underneath the ZSS type antenna (triangle).

Spech,
You're still confusing things. There are three stages to this:
Signal source >>> Tuner >>> Display

Signal sources are OTA and Rogers Cable, both analog and digital.
Displays can be SD (ED) or HD and they may or may not include a tuner.
Tuners can be NTSC (analog), ATSC (digital OTA) or QAM (digital cable).
(Rogers may use encrypted QAM requiring a set-top box to decode.)

So ...
- HD and SD displays work with ATSC tuners for OTA only, but give the best quality
- Displays with cable-ready (NTSC) tuners can use analog cable directly, but you get analog quality
- Displays with QAM tuners (neither ATSC nor NTSC) can use clear digital cable
- Displays need a STB if there is any encryption in the cable signal, analog or digital
(Cable image quality will vary with bandwidth allotted, but never better than OTA today.)

A bit more complex, perhaps, but I hope you can see that the tuner must match the signal source, regardless of display.

Frank

I just noticed that Channel Master now makes a Silver Sensor clone. The model number is CM-4040 (http://www.channelmasterintl.com/pdfs/Channel%20Master_4040_Indoor%20Antenna_20080515.pdf). One interesting feature is they designed it to be wall mountable.

It looks different enough that I wouldn't consider it an SS clone. It might not even be an LPDA - the spacing of the elements doesn't adhere to the LPDA ratios and it doesn't appear to use the SS vertical offset trick to cross wire the elements together.

The wall mount is a good addition, I wonder if it swivels left/right when wall mounted?

I was thinking the same thing, but if they've spaced it as an LPDA (ZSS clone) covering just channels 14-51 then I think it would look scrunched the way it does. It would be interesting to get the measurements of the elements to see if that's what they did.

The wall mount is a good addition, I wonder if it swivels left/right when wall mounted?

I can't tell for sure, but it looks like it does swivel.

I have a Hauppauge 950 USB tuner and Phillips silver sensor clone (phdtv1). I live about 3.5km from the CN tower on the 17th floor of a 20 floor apartment building, facing north (away from the tower).

I can't get any stations. I think the antenna is working, because I do pull in all the regular analog transmissions. If I fiddle with the antenna, I can sometimes pull in a single digital station.

Is there some trick to this? I've tried moving the antenna around. Stupid question: should the narrower end be pointing towards the station or away from it? Either way it doesn't help much though...

Stupid question: should the narrower end be pointing towards the station or away from it?
Not a stupid question.
The narrow end faces the direction the signal is coming from.

It looks like The Source will start selling the Terk HDTVa soon, for $80. I realize the price is ridiculously high, but the opportunity to buy a ZSS/clone here in Montreal with the option of easily returning it (if things don't work) is worth it for me.

I'd like to thank everybody at this forum for all that I learned from reading your posts, especially stampeder.

I tried a couple Nexxtech antennas from the Source, but didn't like either one very much. After reading this forum I came to the conclusion that I should try the Silver Sensor clone by Philips from Dell for the 34 bucks and if that doesn't work well enough I'll try the SharpShooter from somewhere (any suggestions?). Anyway, even though my problem is not yet solved, I'm much happier with what I've learned from you guys so thanks! :)

kq76, thank you for the nice props and also thanks to everyone who helps out here.

Looking forward to seeing how things go for you!

I was testing a couple of USB ATSC tuners and wanted to see how good of a reception I could get with a powered antenna vs. the small portable ones included with the tuner. I connected a Philips Silver Sensor PM-HDTV3 to both a Hauppauge Wintv HVR 950 and a Pinnacle PCTV HD Pro Stick, and to my amazement, I got fewer channels with that than when connected with the portable antennas that came with the tuners.

I should note that my Silver Sensor was purchased used off Ebay, and I did notice that the little metal wire was originally bent (I had to bend it back in order to screw it on properly). Would that have made a difference? Or is there a proper way of setting these things up that I don't know about?

Thanks!

I know from experience that poor connections do affect quality of a signal.

You should check around and see if whether the wire was suppose to connect to something important. Maybe part of a circuit board.

Good Luck,
Emerald_Boar

I'm sure the wire makes contact with something important. If you look at this image, the wire is the thin one that comes out from the middle of the ends:

http://www.computingsolutions.ca/catalog/images/5ft.%20coaxial%20cable.jpg

It was bent in, but I just unbent it before screwing it onto my tv tuner card.

Assuming that coaxial cable is short (meter or 2) it can be easily replaced.

If its much longer or permanently attached to silver sensor. Then you may have issues.

I would try using attaching another Coaxial cable to the silver sensor and TV tuner card. And see if that improves quality of the image.

Good Luck,
Alvaro Marques

PS. I dont have any certifications what so ever. In fact you probably know as much about this stuff as i do.

Hi all,

Thanks for all the great info here...

Is there a retail location in the greater Toronto area where the zenith Silver Sensor or one of its clones (Philips PHDTV3) is available?

I see that some have asked the question in this thread, but I'm not sure if it was ever answered; maybe its only available online (I'm a bit loath to order from Dell)...

Thanks

See the various OTA supplier threads in this forum:

http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=164

cheers

Dumb question, but could a Silver Sensor ever be stacked??

I'm thinking on buying one off a friend and wonder how & if they work indoors at all or by a window at best.

Ideas??

Not a dumb question! :) You can gang Silver Sensors for better gain. Here is Ken Nist's "Two Antenna Trick" over at hdtvprimer:

http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ANTENNAS/silver.html