: ON - Vaughan/Richmond Hill/Markham/North of 407 - OTA
2010-08-04, 04:17 PM
Canuck. You're doing pretty good for channels.
My tuner picks up far more channels than are usable. I get 3, 4.1, 7.1, 29.1, 29.2, 36, 39.5 (wiki; HSN from New York city), 49.1
If I aim this antenna better I hope my canadian channels are all sorted out. Also hoping when the analogs shut down or switch to digital that those other problems go away.
For Buffalo a fixed aim roof mounted antenna is my only hope. Haven't decided on an A-B switch of combining antennas. Depends on the ultimate signal strenegth.
2010-08-04, 05:08 PM
Steve Smart: Odd that you went with a VHF-HI antenna to get CKVR on channel 3. Though you're obviously close enough to get good performance nonetheless.
I too own a C5, and I'm impressed with it's performance as well. It does have a greater beamwidth than what I've used before. IMO, that's not a bad thing, as it allows me to pick up a perfect channel 11 (Hamilton) while pointing at Toronto.
2010-08-04, 05:09 PM
ubern000b: That's not a NYC channel. 39.5 is one of those PBS data virtual channels for OTA firmware updates.
2010-08-05, 03:48 PM
That's a reasonable point. Truthfully, I don't watch CKVR a lot. I was more interested in solidifying analogue 9 so that my DVR didn't keep screwing up the TV Guide downloads (gotta love those full listings!), ensuring 9.1 & 11.1 would be good after the changeover, and improving my chances for catching Rochester's 10 & 13 on a good day. Also, the C5 is a nicely compact unit compared to the full-range VHF antennas I checked out. My neighbor's been pretty good about my little antenna farm, but 30 or 40 inches of boom hanging over the hedge might have been pushing it. :)
As I suspected it might, an improved CKVR came along for the ride. A win, win, win so far.
2010-08-05, 04:31 PM
My **** 2084 (4221 clone) receives NOTHING.
I think there's something weird with the 'balun'. I opened it up, looking for potential problems and found nothing but a plain circuit board. I mean, *nothing* but a square pcb (about 2"x2") with a couple of holes for the bolts to hold the 'balun' to the feedlines. There's no caps/coils/wire in this thing. I didn't bother to check for continuity (can't find my meter.)
Can this function properly as a balun? Is this the reason for my problems? Can I remove it and try one of the baluns I've seen with leads on one side and a coax fitting on the other?
The CM4221, which you state your antenna is a clone of, has a 300 ohm output at the feedlines which of course would not match the 75hm input of your tuner.
I'm not sure what the else is inside the *balun* that you opened up as I never seen one of those, but the F-connector output of the balun must also be connected to the PCB board somehow. It is possible the the PCB is merely being used as a connection point, but unlikely. There are some printed circuit board baluns out there - the balun is actually just printed on the PCB itself - like this one (http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/showthread.php?p=875405&highlight=balun#post875405). Any chance the otherside of the PCB board is actually the balun?
Of course I must ask, is it also possible the balun components are entirely enclosed in the F-connector end? How big is it? Some of the cheapo baluns use really light wire internally. It might also be shorting out internally as well depending upon the build quality. Not all baluns are created equal.
If all things seem to be working but you suspect the balun, try swapping it out. It will only cost you a few bucks to test. Even Walmart sells them.
You could also try making your own; see the balun thread (http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=100512).
2010-08-06, 10:12 AM
Listen, yesterday for fun I hooked up a small 12" x10" -looks like the bones of fish tail -antenna, to the back of my Panasonic TV in the 2nd floor bedroom. I used the tv's internal tuner andI couldn't believe what I was receiving.
Antenna - placed next to TV on 2nd floor facing CN Tower (south).
Reception - ABC HD, CBS HD, CBC HD, Omni, French CBC, CITY TV HD, CW HD and 2 others I can't remember.
The incredible thing was the PQ! WOW!! Listen, I have a KURO, Pioneer BD etc, I know good HD when I see it, and these channels just blew me way. I mean with the exception of CITY TV which had the worst PQ of all of them (go figure), the rest were amazing.
You would think that CITY TV would be the clearest given its location!!
2010-08-06, 10:39 AM
Hi Paulo, we OTAers here at this site have been bragging about the better PQ for years, but until someone actually sees it they don't know... :)
This thread has a ton of information on which OTA antenna and gear to use so just use the Search This Thread tool to the upper right beside Thread Tools and put in "Vaughan" and then later try local street names as search terms, and you'll see results already posted from where you live so you can compare and make the best decisions. :)
When you're ready to buy some gear see this thread: OTA: Ontario Parts, Sales, Service, Installers (http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=23984) and of course check out our OTA Forum Sponsors, Save and Replay (http://www.saveandreplay.com) in Mississauga.
See these links too in my signature:
2010-08-09, 10:55 AM
Hi guys, I just wanted to let you know that I put up a DB8 Multidirectional HDTV Antenna, see the link -http://overtheair.saveandreplay.com/Antennas_Direct_DB8.asp. I got it at Save & Play - thanks Stampeder for the link.
OK! set up:
- I am @ around the Major Mackenzie/Islington area (Vaughan):
- Antenna placed in the Attic Aprox 35-40 feet from ground level.
- Antenna feeds 2 TVs - TV1 Panasonic in Master bedroom & TV2 KURO in Living Room.
- I ran 16' of RG6 directly from Antenna to TV1 in Master Bedroom (2nd flr) .
- Just before connecting to TV1 cable is split. From splitter, cable runs 1' to (TV1bedrom) & from splitter 60' to (TV2 Living room).
- Pointed south East as best as I could (no compass) 1st try!!
Well, let me say I was very sceptical about how successful it was all going to be considering the instructions on the antenna manual stating that I would lose 30% signal by going to attic as opposed to outside, another 20% loss by using a splitter & 2-3db loss for >50' cable runs.
To my surprise, I received all of the following channels (see below) in the MOST BEAUTIFUL HD I HAVE EVER SEEN! Yesterdays Cowboys/Bengals game was incredicble to watch!
I know, I may sound a little over the top but I kid you not, the PQ was STUNNING on all the HD channels, SD were great but still SD.
I believe that alot of reception good/bad has to do with the built in tuners on the TV's. The reason I say this is because the Kuro which has about a 60' cable run actually has a stronger per channel strength than the same channel on the Pany. Also the Kuro has a built in TV guide that I actually shows me all the shows, times, Channel logos, show descriptions info etc....:p:p
I checked all the channels that were coming in to the TV's since the day I installed (Saturday) and they are all still coming in strong as of this morning. Even during yesterdays major downpour (rain storm) I still got all the channels.
Here is what I get on my Kuro:
2.1, 2.2, 2.3
Here is what I get on my Pany:
2.1, 2.2, NO 2.3
The only glitch I have is with 29.1 Fox it was coming in & out from 2-6pm.... after 7pm the PQ came in crystal clear - & I didn't touch a thing !!. Is this normal? :confused:
I want to know if there is something else I can do to better the FOX HD 29.1 reception. I am hesitant to go to the attic and move the antenna, since all the other stations are perfect right now!! Any suggestions would be great!!
Stampeder..... YOU THE MAN!!! Thanks again!!
2010-08-10, 06:27 PM
Yes, that kind of behavior is normal for many of us. Whether it's WUTV's transmission pattern, the CN Tower being almost between you and Grand Island, or your attic install I can't say for sure, but WUTV can be a bugger to solidify for many of us to the North/East. Tweaking your system - better cabling, an outdoor antenna, or peaking your aim for WUTV might help - but it might not. I've made many of those same changes, yet WUTV remains elusive. It's there, but not dependably so, especially during the daytime hours. It seems counter-intuitive that WUTV is shaky or gone when you can pick up ION or WGRZ from much further away, but that may be the reality of the situation for you.
Welcome to the OTA hobby. Keep reading and let the tweaking begin!
2010-08-10, 07:47 PM
I have been OTA for 3 years now. For me WGRZ is the problem station. Until this summer I have never had any of the reception difficulties that I have seen in the last 2 months. 4.1, 7.1 and 29.1 have always been rock steady. Not now. Some times they are perfect and other times they are completely gone. I feel it is due to this summer's weather. I am waiting for the cooler Fall weather to arrive before I start making changes. It might be worthwhile for you to do the same as this may all change for the better in the next few weeks. Good luck.
Welcome to the OTA hobbie.
I can understand your hesitation to mess with a set-up that is 98% working for you.
You may not care about this, but it appears you're also missing reception on 44.1 (Omni2) 51.1 .2 and .3 (ION, qubo, ION Life) and 49.1 (MyTV Buffalo). ION might not be possible from your area, but I imagine that the others should be working for you.
All you can do is fiddle with the variables that you know might help.
- quality cable
- quality connectors
- antenna location (outdoor is much better than roof)
- antenna quality
How much money do you want to throw at the problem to get the extra channel?
If you're convinced that the antenna location is optimal and if you're not ready/willing to do an outdoor install, then I guess you have to go back to re-inspect your cable and connectors and/or add a preamp (a pre-amp may help or hinder).
Now that you know about the superior quality of the picture and know that you know that free OTA gives you leverage with your cable company, you might consider investing in a proper install. Perhaps have someone else install it for you? The total cost is equivalant to only a few months of cable bills. You can check out my previous posts to read about my antenna install experience.
2010-08-11, 10:18 AM
Thanks Bman72s, Steve & HWP, for your inputs. I actually spoke to a few other people and they said the same thing....... that they too found it weird that I can pick up a solid signal on NBC 2.1 WGRZ, & ION 5.1, but that FOX was weak.
Anyway, I was thinking about what you said Bman72s, that besides FOX 29.1, which was in/out but solid in the evenings, that I did notice that after the weather got muggy these last few days, that I do see on some channels the odd "pixel blocks" briefly appearing.
I believe I may go into the attic to tweak the antenna, I was pressed for time the day I set it up and I literally just turned it facing what I thought would be the correct angle. I must have gotten lucky considering my results.
I actually recall having one side of the antenna (DB8) with a 2 by 4 right in front of one set of the bowties. This could be a factor YES? I didn't really adjust it at the time because all was good!!
So,to tweak it, would I take the channel with the lowest signal strength & make my adjustments to bump up the signal from there or take the channel with the best signal and try to improve on that?
2010-08-11, 01:01 PM
Here is my experience on tweaking. As I said WGRZ 2.1 is my problem channel. After my initial install I tweaked to WGRZ. I lost both OMNIs, Sun TV and made CITY TV a bit "iffy". I turned my antenna 1/8 of an inch, on the pole, and got everything back with no change in 2.1. It is a hit or miss channel for me. I would say I get it 50% of the time but I wouldn't want to count on it. In fact the 2 OMNIS are now at 100% signal strength. My most powerful reception stations of all. I guess what I am saying is OTA is not an exact science so some experimenting is to be expected. For your info I have an original CM4221 antenna, a CM7778 preamp and a chimney mount. I am in the HWY 48 and Hwy7 part of Markham so a bit different location from you. Again I would be very tempted to leave things as they are until after Labour Day. If the humidity has calmed down and your problem remains then you can start playing around with things. Check out this website. http://www.dxinfocentre.com/tropo.html. From my experience the more intense the tropo the more likely we are to have "strange" reception patterns
2010-08-11, 01:36 PM
I'm practically due North of you about 6-7 miles and I aim my antenna which is attic mounted with a pre-amp, at ION in Batavia, and never have issues with WGRZ or ION for that matter. I know my elevation is a little higher than you. All the other Buffalo's work great for me too with the exception of WNYB.
2010-08-11, 01:48 PM
Have to agree with Bman72s. It's all a compromise. Peaking for 29.1 causes me to instantly lose OMNI-1 and usually CITY as well. And the next day 29.1 is gone again anyways! Weather patterns or even summer growth on the trees in your area can make a difference in day-to-day reception. As has been noted, winter is often the best time for experimentation. The signals might not as strong but they tend to be more stable.
Peaking to your weakest channel is a good place to start, but you'll have to recheck the effect it may have on your other channels. You can use TVFool,com to obtain a compass direction from your location to the various transmitters as a start, or even Google Earth to draw a line between the two, which can show you local landmarks - the corner of a neighbor's house or the like - to aim with. The DB8 is a good antenna, but many of us north of the city have found a pre-amp to be helpful in solidifying weaker signals.
Let's look at the good side. You're getting quite a nice array of channels while you tinker, and you always have the option of moving to a rooftop install - which will give you an increase in signal strength to play with.
Good luck. It's worth the effort.
2010-08-12, 01:18 PM
I actually spoke to a few other people and they said the same thing....... that they too found it weird that I can pick up a solid signal on NBC 2.1 WGRZ, & ION 5.1, but that FOX was weak.
Paulo, 5.1 is actually CBC Toronto (CBOT-DT, rf channel 20)). ION is actually 51.1 (rf channel 23). I assume you made a typo, since it is unlikely that you would get 51.1 and not 5.1. If you are getting channel 51.1 (ION) and not FOX 29, you might be aimed to far East.
As for FOX 29.1, many people forget that the transmit frequency is rf channel 14. Although generally speaking signal attenuation through cable is significantly lower at lower frequencies, a lot of commercial UHF antennae out there don't fare as well for frequencies that approach the VHF range.
2010-08-13, 01:25 PM
Thanks guys for all the input, I think I may hold off on the tweak of the antenna until the weather gets a little crisper.... its funny, these last two days all channels are solid as they have been from the start & Fox 20.1 has been coming in strong, go figure!! Yes, 99gecko that was a typo, I meant 51.1.
2010-08-13, 09:09 PM
I decided to move my CM 4228HD higher on the roof (basically moved it up to the top of the 10 foot pole on a tripod attached to the second story of the house). I have a 4 port channel master distribution amp. With some aiming help with my friend, (basically South South East pointing) I was able to get in WPXJ at 100% signal most of the time (or so the Samsung and the Westinghouse TV says), the other times it goes down to 75% but still watchable. As well, I get all of the other Buffalo, Toronto, and Hamilton stations. Rochester is in and out.
Anybody know of a good TV Tuner card. I have a hauppauge 1650, which isn't bad but only 1 tuner. I also have a HDHomerun box, but find it is unreliable as the signal seems to go in and out (oscilates between 40 - 80% on WPXJ which drives me nuts). Was thinking of trying a 2250?
2010-08-14, 02:35 AM
jerschmidt14, are you using all 4 ports on that CM amp? If not, terminate any empty ones to keep the signal as clean as possible.
Regarding tuner cards for PC, please use these threads in the HTPC forum:
TV Tuner Cards For HTPC Discussion (http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=42094)
USB2.0 Digital TV Tuners (http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=49381)
2010-08-14, 08:24 AM
Yep, using 3 of the 4 ports and the last one is terminated.