Tom - At Rymal and Upper James, the CHCH transmitter isn't that far off compass from Buffalo and no more than 5 or so miles away. Wouldn't a pre-amp just make CHCH an even bigger obstacle to overcome?
I would recomend filtering out the VHF, before the pre-amp.
Plus, the C2 doesn't pick up VHF very well.

Dang I wish I was up on the hill with you guys. I'm pulling T.O. (CBLT @ 94%, CITY @ 82%) all local (11,15,36 etc), 28 (TVO) and 13 out of Kitchener all off of my front porch, aluminum sided house with metal awning rails etc. But do you think I can even get so much as a wavy line out of Buffalo?

I guess this weekend I'm going to have to bite the bullet and put up the tower so I can get high. heh heh. I just hope 40' of tower is enough cuz I've got no room to hang guy wires here.

Its always worth a try, except that TVFool cannot account for very local multipath or obstruction loss-contributors like large trees, the neighbour's aluminum siding, etc.
So it seems. According to what I'm reading, TVFool says I should be able to see two Buffalo stations even if they aren't watchable. I'm pulling Kitchener in which has an aluminum sided house between it and my antenna and probably shouldn't come in as well as it does, if at all. Kitchener comes in even better if I put the antenna in front of the door and leave the inside door open. ;)

Frankly at this point I'm at a bit of a loss. I can stand on my front porch and see the top of the CHCH transmitter, so I doubt that the escarpment is really interfering all that much.

I can see that this is going to turn into a fair bit of trial and error. I'm just glad that I can home brew it rather than throwing money at an unknown entity. It's time for some altitude.

Dang I wish I was up on the hill with you guys. I'm pulling T.O. (CBLT @ 94%, CITY @ 82%) all local (11,15,36 etc), 28 (TVO) and 13 out of Kitchener all off of my front porch, aluminum sided house with metal awning rails etc. But do you think I can even get so much as a wavy line out of Buffalo?

I guess this weekend I'm going to have to bite the bullet and put up the tower so I can get high. heh heh. I just hope 40' of tower is enough cuz I've got no room to hang guy wires here.
The channels that you are reporting- are they analog or digital? Keep in mind, all the main BUF channels only broadcast in digital now.

Thank you very much for your reply I will try it

I have 4228hd antenna with 7777 pre amp.Iam trying to get ABC,NBC andCBS but I can only get 17-1,17-2, 17-3(WHEN) 23-1,11-1,and36-1. I live near the Rrymal and Upper WEllington area . I see a big tower down by the lake when Iam on top of the roof (south from me). Which way do I go from there? Thank You

Hey patches:

You got some fine gear there!

If you are at Up Wellington and Rymal, the CHCH tower would be north east of you. I'm a little confused on a tower near a lake that is south of you- Lake Erie is south of Hamilton and is about 30 miles away.

Have you done a TV Fool report for your location and tower height?

Where is the antenna mounted and how high?

Any major obstructions near you?

The channels that you are reporting- are they analog or digital? Keep in mind, all the main BUF channels only broadcast in digital now. I get a healthy mix of both. Depending on the direction I'm pointing the antenna I can get 5 9 11 13 15 19 25 28 36 41 45 47 57 69 in analog and 5.1 9.1 11.1 15.1 25.1 36.1 45.1 47.1 57.1 64.1 in digital. Not too sure just how accurate the list is since I'm going from memory but it's pretty close.

Patches - Didn't you have a C2 a week ago? Have you tried using the 4228 without the preamp?

Buffalo is pretty much east south east of where you are, at the eastern end of Lake Erie. You really should do a TVFool for yourself.

Try this - Since the streets in this city don't run north and south the way we expect (I've started many an argument with that statement over the years), bring up an online map, and with an 8-1/2x11 sheet of paper placed on the screen over a correctly sized map, mark out the direction of Rymal and Upper Wellington streets as well as "true" compass points, particulary north which is the top of the screen. Then, zoom out the map so it is big enough to be able to plot out Toronto, Buffalo, etc. as well as the compass points. Using all of this info including your TVFool output, you should be able to aim your antenna quite accurately.

Finally got my SBGH up in the attic, and was very pleased with the results.

Buffalo came in very strong, where ABC was at 25db (out of 30) as the strongest, and MyTV was around 16db which was the weekest, and was sporadically freezing. This was just having the antenna sitting on top of the insulation, leaning against the trusses.

In the TO direction, I got CBC (English and French), CTV, and Omni 2. This was holding the antenna slightly higher. City, Global and Omni1 still elude me.

Of course I was picking up CH and SunTV, and those were peaking the meter. Almost to the point of overpowering the tuner (over 30db).

So now I just have to figure out a permanent mount setup, and point this antenna towards Buffalo. Then I have a second GH under construction which I will point towards TO.

This is so much fun and exciting.

Hey patches:

You got some fine gear there!

If you are at Up Wellington and Rymal, the CHCH tower would be north east of you. I'm a little confused on a tower near a lake that is south of you- Lake Erie is south of Hamilton and is about 30 miles away.

Have you done a TV Fool report for your location and tower height?

Where is the antenna mounted and how high?

Any major obstructions near you?
Last week I drove down Sherman toward Rymal on my way to Dunnville. There is a tower near Sherman & Rymal with what appears to be 4 broadcast antennas.

I thought the CHCH tower was on the brow near Centennial Pkwy.

Last week I drove down Sherman toward Rymal on my way to Dunnville. There is a tower near Sherman & Rymal with what appears to be 4 broadcast antennas.

Isn't that possibly the XM satellite repeater location?

I thought the CHCH tower was on the brow near Centennial Pkwy.

It is. :-) Also has 95.3 FM, tower cams etc. It had an amateur radio repeater antenna there too but not sure if that's still in place or not.

Cameron
VE3GVG

I would like to send out Thank Yous to goforit and Dead Short. The help was well done, I now recieve most of the Buffalo stations . the TV Fool Report help me very much. Thank you again for pointing me in the right direction.:)

Okay, I will have two antennas, one facing east to south east picking up Buffalo. It can also pickup CH and SunTV just fine. The second antenna will point towards TO, but it will also pickup CH and Sun as well off its side lobes. They will be separated greater than 2' in hopes that they won't interfere with each other. As an extra precaution, I'd like to filter out CH (18) and Sun (15) from the TO antenna, and was looking at a Channel Plus NF-469. This should filter out the UHF frequency range, right? Or should I shield the side of the TO antenna so it does not even pickup CH and Sun?

I've also started to add up signal loss in my proposed signal routing (http://sites.google.com/site/maycreates/my-home-network/newsatsetup.png), and was considering going through a 3x4 switch and combining the signal with my Sat signals...but after reading the specs on the switch...with a 14db Insertion loss on the antenna input...dang, I'm better off bypassing the switch and combining/splitting via diplexers alone (minus the SW-21 as well).

Thanks for all the wealth of information guys.

Okay, I will have two antennas, one facing east to south east picking up Buffalo. It can also pickup CH and SunTV just fine. The second antenna will point towards TO, but it will also pickup CH and Sun as well off its side lobes. They will be separated greater than 2' in hopes that they won't interfere with each other. As an extra precaution, I'd like to filter out CH (18) and Sun (15) from the TO antenna, and was looking at a Channel Plus NF-469. This should filter out the UHF frequency range, right?

I don't have any first hand experience with the Channel Plus NF-469, but according to the spec sheet (http://www.smarthome.com/manuals/7822E_spec.pdf), it should notch out UHF 14-19 very effectively. Word of warning though, it will also distort channel 20 and even 21 a bit.

Thanks Roger, I saw that graph and wondered that too. Not to worried about 21 as I have nothing broadcasting around me on that channel. CBC (20) will be affected, but as that signal is coming in so strong that it may also help attenuate that signal a little.

Thing I'm wondering now. Using two antennas, if placed to close in proximity to each other, is it the interaction between the two which can effectively cancel signals or is it when the signals are combined together? If indeed its caused by the proximity of the antennas, then the notch filter won't be of any use.

Another question, has anyone have any experience with Holland Electronic splitters? I'm looking at their GHS-2FC models, and though they aren't as good as the Regal ones mentioned above, they have some pretty impressive numbers compared to other splitters I've looked at, and can be had for a little bit cheaper than the Regal ones. Here's the datasheet on them:
http://www.hollandelectronics.com/Holland_Catalog.pdf (page 91/92)

If you are going to use the notch filter Channel Plus NF-469- which will block out 14 to 19, you will probably not get Fox 29 (RF 14.1), it's weak as it is. You might not be able to get TVO 19.0 either- or clearly.

If you are going to use the notch filter Channel Plus NF-469- which will block out 14 to 19, you will probably not get Fox 29 (RF 14.1), it's weak as it is. You might not be able to get TVO 19.0 either- or clearly.

Not worried about Fox as that is on the other antenna. The notch would only be on the antenna pointing towards TO. But you are right about TVO...post 2011, they will most likely be broadcasting at 19 still. Hmm, didn't think of that one....looks like I may have to shield the side of the TO antenna then. Would be nice if they stayed at 51 when/if they ever transition to digital before 2011.

*EDIT*
Also just reading that SunTV from that transmitter will be moving to channel 45 post transition, so it won't even cover that channel in the future anyways. Man, lot's of things to keep up on.

I have two XG-91's stacked and combined with an EagleStar Pro 53-3021 multi-signal mixer.
The anteanna array is roughly set at 70 feet.
The RG-6 cable is connected to a Samsung dtb-h260f.
I previously had the Channel Master Titan 7777 preamp connected but removed it after
discovering that the signal strength improved without it.
I live in Hamilton, Ontario, and can easily receive WIVB (CBS) and WKBW (ABC) in Buffalo over 70 miles away. Signal strength for these
two stations is over 70%.
The problem is receiving WGRZ (NBC) and WUTV (Fox). I receive a choppy 10% signal for WGRZ's subchannels (33-2 & RTV).
I receive no DTV signal at all for Fox which was the strongest signal from Grand Island prior to analog shutdown.

I understand after reading through these threads that NBC's signal is one of the most difficult to
receive reliably.

However, I would like to know if I use a two pre-amp setup would this improve my signal? Would positioning
two pre amplifiers (i.e. one for each XG-91) prior to the combiner boost the signal. Most preamps
only have one connection for UHF resulting in a combiner/splitter being place prior to the preamp resulting
in signal loss. Could this be negated by using two preamps?

Also, are distribution amplifiers worth having for the distribution of signal to multiple TV's. If so,
what is the best distribution amp?

What is your nearest intersection? Any obstructions? Have you tried one 91XG on it's own? WGRZ is one of my strongest BUF stations; WNYO and ION are the weak ones for me.