Investing in high definition in Canada is a very expensive proposition indeed.

If you take into account our current tax load and the very high cost of equipment (+CAN$ exchange rate)... to also have to deal with internal squabbling over the availability of high def signal in such a relatively small market is simply disgusting. (The entire Canadian population barely matches the population of the state of New York).

This sickening state of affairs overseen by an incompetent C.R.T.C. is another fine example of the abuses, over-taxing, bait and switch scams we have always complacently dealt with and will continue to deal with because we are a lame uncomplaining, docile bunch here.

Just drink that @$#n MooseHead and put on your stupid winter hat :rolleyes:

Season greetings to all :cool:

Pronut,

For your post # 6, are you trying to impress us with a philosophical report on the state of HD in Canada? Do you have an agenda?

To start with you live in what City (should be added in your profile by clicking "User CP" on the top menu bar)

Then if your signature file contains your STB make and model, we can usually figure out who your provider is.

As for the DiscoverHD situation, we will see if you are in the Videotron/Shaw group of clients who feel cheated, or, the Rogers/Bell group who still have DiscoveryHD but may be facing a possible monthly charge in the near future.

As for the CRTC, sure you can put blame there like many others do. But to my knowledge, DiscoveryHD is a specialty channel not available OTA and a provider can elect to offer it or not just like the PlayBoy channel. It's a business decision on the part of the provider and it's an option for the client when it is offered. Or, are you suggesting that the CRTC should specify what channels providers are to carry? Should we elect federal candidates who propose that the Government, through the CRTC, nationalize all cable and satellite providers that cover Canada?

I am very disappointed for the lost of DiscoverHD from my provider Videotron. But I recognize it's a business decision. My own recourse is very limited because I have over $1,200 invested in 2 cable DVRs. However, my HD present situation is immensely better than in September 2002 when I took delivery of my HDTV and had ExpressVu installed so that I could get their demo channel with some travel tours of Europe in an all day loop.

Just drink that @$#n MooseHead and put on your stupid winter hat :rolleyes: Season greetings to all :cool:


Your profile doesn't say where you're from but now that I know what kind of beer you are drinking, gives me a good hint lol Merry Christmas to you too :)

Pronut....However, my HD present situation is immensely better than in September 2002 when I took delivery of my HDTV and had ExpressVu installed so that I could get their demo channel with some travel tours of Europe in an all day loop.

Well, of course, reaction to Videotron's decision can vary depending on the interest for such a channel an individual has or, as yourself, where he came from since the purchase of his HDTV. Of course, looking at it that way, the availability of HDTV programming has improved a lot since 2002...This being said, I totally disagree with you when it comes to the CRTC...I too, feel they do a poor job. First, as I understand it, they have no standards established for the quality of broadcasting forcing providers of service to maintain a certain level of quality by limiting the compression level they can use. Secondly, when they give a licence such as the one Discovery got, it should be to make that station available to all Canadians through either satellite or cable service. That licence wasn't granted as a private internal circuit, it was granted for general public and yes, they should force all suppliers to offer it but every provider should be able to get it for the same conditions, same price etc....Then, what the providers want to do with it, offering it as part of a package or individually for a fee, or even free as part of their basic service is up to the providers themselves.
Why I feel it should be like that ??? Simply because cable service is an exclusivity for a given region...The usual laws of free market business do not hold true here and that is exactly why the CRTC should force every provider to offer a channel that was granted a licence for public programming...I would agree with your position if I had a choice of cable providers. Then, if I wasn't happy with the selection of Videotron, I could decide to go with Cogeco...but I cannot do that...If I could, then free market business decisions would hold true. In this case, it doesn't and that is why CRTC has to be there to insure every canadian has access to the stations they gave a licence to....

hi Mfabien,

...back in 2002, HD was a mystery to most and it's no surprise that your situation today is better than back then....so, with all due respect, it's irrelevent.

...more disturbing is the fact that people that bought equipment lately when videotron had great HD and sound from Detroit and promises were flying all over for the "upcoming" 16:9, dolby 5.1 rush of HD channels...

One would expect a rapid increase in quality and content...but hell NO....it's the opposit....

...Sherbrooke lost PBS, everyone loses DiscoveryHD, degraded signal from Buffalo....loss of 5.1 dolby sound....when is this downhill crap gonna stop...

....and mr. Pronut, we're just a tiny bunch here complaining and screaming out loud, but soon the masses will get screwed and very dissapointed by Videotron's HD and only then will these bastards will give us "early adopters" some satisfaction.

....this is the way Videotron says thankyou for investing our money and trust in them....

....sheesh...I think I'd rather deal with the competitor's billing problems than this....just don't give them automatic access to your bank account and deal with the bill when it comes in the mail....

(The entire Canadian population barely matches the population of the state of New York).Never let the facts stand in the way:

Population of NY state 19.0M (according to http://encyclopedia.laborlawtalk.com/New_York_State)
Population of Canada 32.4MM (according to http://www.statcan.ca/english/edu/clock/population.htm)
(Both numbers above rounded to 1 decimal place)

Therefore barely = 13.4 M. It would be more accurate to say that Canada has twice the population of NY state as you would then be off by only 5.6M.

http://www.crtc.gc.ca/eng/LEGAL/BDU.HTM

Alteration or Deletion of Programming Service

7. A licensee shall not alter or delete a programming service in a licensed area in the course of its distribution except

(a) as required or authorized under a condition of its licence or these Regulations;

(b) for the purpose of complying with subsection 328(1) of the Canada Elections Act;

(c) for the purpose of deleting a programming service to comply with an order of a court prohibiting the distribution of the service to any part of the licensed area;

(d) for the purpose of altering a programming service to insert an emergency alert message in accordance with an agreement entered into with the operator of the service or the network responsible for the service;

(e) for the purpose of preventing the breach of programming or underlying rights of a third party, in accordance with an agreement entered into with the operator of the service or the network responsible for the service; or

(f) for the purpose of deleting a subsidiary signal, unless the signal is, itself, a programming service or is related to the service being distributed.
____________________________________________________________ __

The DiscoveryHD vs Videotron event of deletion comes, I would suggest, under item (e).

High Definition camarades,

Post your complaints to the CRTC:

http://www.crtc.gc.ca/eng/welcome.htm

let's kick these arrogant, shameless and monopolistic #%@&* in the butt! :cool:

http://www.crtc.gc.ca/eng/LEGAL/BDU.HTM

Whatever the reason, let the CRTC fix the problem, under present legal conditions or through new regulations... Period

Whatever the reason, let the CRTC fix the problem, under present legal conditions or through new regulations... Period

..or new legislation. Why don't you contact all candidates in your riding and see if one of them will make you this promise in return for your vote.

The Bill could be called:

Act to make it an obligation for all cable and satellite providers to carry DiscoveryHD in their service.

Under this Act, the CRTC is instructed to oblige licensees, distributing broadcasting under cable or satellite services, to include, as an option, DiscoveryHD, presently classified under discretionary service, therefore changing DiscoveryHD to a "mandatory programming" offering. It is furthermore provided that the CRTC shall approve the monthly amount to be paid by users of the service to ascertain that such amount be deemed reasonable. All agreements between distributors and DiscoveryHD will be subject to CRTC approval.

Would that do it, Michel?

I called Videotron today to cancel my HD extra. Discovery HD was the main reason I kept it, since I don't watch the other HD channels much (I'm not a football fan and there isn't much on the others). The service rep said: "the Discovery channel stopped providing it to Videotron". He had no other information about the change.

I thought cable channels received revenue based on the number of subscribers. Even if the number was small in Quebec, why would they give up the market here? Do they also get payment from the cable supplier to carry a channel, or is this information confidential?

..or new legislation. Why don't you contact all candidates in your riding and see if one of them will make you this promise in return for your vote.Why not go farther and have the candidate promise to deregulate the broadcast/cable industry so that governmental approval was not required for channels and/or satellite/cable companies.

Act to make it an obligation for all cable and satellite providers to carry DiscoveryHD in their service
Would that do it, Michel?

You obviously totally misunderstood what I said. It is not only about Discovery....but all future HD producers.....No MPs, nor the CRTC will make special legislation for "Discovery" and I did not suggest that either....I did not say either that the CRTC should regulate the amount charged to the end user of the service as you say. I said that the CRTC should regulate that the price charged by Discovery or any other companies alike is the same to all the providers, namely the price of their service to Bell, Videotron, Rogers, Cogeco, Shaw etc....What Videotron (for instance) wants to charge the end user is their business as I clearly said. Don't twist my words...And yes, I think that once a licence for a public station is granted, it should include an obligation that it is made available to all canadians through all service providers. and I never said it should be mandatory for canadians to get it free or at a price set by the CRTC....You twisted my opinion.....I find your post not only condecending but arrogant....You can disagree without being disagreable....

The service rep said: "the Discovery channel stopped providing it to Videotron". He had no other information about the change.


They seem to have a different answer depending on who you talk to. No one says the real reason and no one knows (except maybe Mfabien)....

Would that do it, Michel?
Furthermore, what would do it for me is less unecessary sarcasm, condescence, patronizing and arrogance....Respect of other's opinion would definitely do it for me....Enough said... One footer note, I'd certainly be for an totally open free market as suggested by Wayne....

Michel,

I hope you have a very good Christmas day.

Today, let us think about the good life that we have
and the reasons we should be more happy than sad.

I think we would be more effective if we directed all our energy towards solving this problem as opposed to arguing amoungst ourselves.

As captqbec suggested go to the CRTC website and post your complaint:
http://www.crtc.gc.ca/RapidsCCM/Register.asp?lang=E


Here's my contribution:

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
I am a subsciber with Videotron cable TV service including the High Definition service for an additional monthly fee.

Recently, Videotron removed the Discovery HD channel from all subscribers. My complaint is based on the following two points:

1) My contract with Videotron was modified without prior notification or reimbursement in the form of alternate channel replacement or financial compensation.
2) Due to lack of an alternate cable provider in my area I believe that publicly licenced channels should be at least made available to all Canadians. Due to contract obligations, subscribers are not at liberty to switch service providers or add other services without incurring great personal cost just to acquire said channels.

Your attention to this matter is respectfully requested.

Thank you.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

Maybe not that articulate but it'll get the point accross. And even if there is no legal leg to stand on at least it'll raise awareness for future CRTC decisions as more applications for HD channel are made.

Ok.. then the entire population of Canada barely equals the population of the state of California..

http://www.50states.com/californ.htm 33,871,648

Happy Holidays guys,

....we're all in this together....all we really want is some kind of satisfaction from videotron...together we're a force...arguments will only serve the opposition.

Complain to the CRTC:

http://www.crtc.gc.ca/RapidsCCM/Register.asp?lang=E

I've done it.

Do it :cool:

Any videotron members having trouble accessing google for the past two days?? Incredibly when I called the techs, they told me they were aware of the issue!

Its affecting many pages that use google for their adservers.
Jeez.
Sorry to break the thread topic, but I am new here, and don't have sufficient permission to start up a thread apparently.

If you are experiencing this pls blurb it here, or im me. Thx

Seph

now back to our regularly scheduled feature:
re population density .. whats so great about being over-populated?