El Gran Chico,
Whenever I have such questions, I typically refer to the manufacturer for answers. In this case, Channel Master or their website doesn't offer any guidance whatsoever. Even the product video is ambiguous.

I suppose the reason for this ambiguity is that there are so many variables at play in this type of installation.

For example, if the mast were to extend to the ground, the brackets wouldn't be carrying the weight load. This would allow for a longer mast above the top bracket.

If the brackets are handling weight and lateral force load, then you must shorten the mast length accordingly. Increasing the wind load by going with a larger antenna will thus increase potential lateral force load, which also must be factored into the installation.

Guy wires could also be used in a wall bracket installation to increase mast length.

Further complicating installation variables is that this product is sold in several lengths; allowing for different spacing from the wall as needed.

Given the small screws they provide, I certainly wouldn't stress the installation by too much--even if you replace them with heavier-duty masonry screws.

Good luck.

Thanks Jase88. I saw a note on another product our sponsor sells had a sort of rule of thumb of "20 % of mast length". I guess for 10' mast that would mean about 2 feet between the top and bottom and about 8 above to the top (I imagine I'd have to leave a few inches below the bottom one). Maybe this would be ok for a smallish antenna like a 4221??

I need to stabilize my rig, and am wondering where to get something to attaches to the post that has eyelets to attach guy wires to?

I remember umpteen years ago I helped someone with his C-band dish, he had something that looked like a collar that went at the top of his post - it had three eyelets on it.

I know where to get cables, buckles and whatnot, but I don't know about the actual attaching to the post part.

Maybe this would be ok for a smallish antenna like a 4221??

It should be fine. What type of wall will you be mounting onto? (ie. brick, aluminum siding, etc?).

Brick. Thanks for your advice Jase88. When there is no guidance from the manufacturer, it's better to learn from others experience to prevent a trial-and-error disaster. :D

Maybe we need a antenna mast calculator on this site to guide people as to what is too much for their particular setup. :cool:

something to attaches to the post that has eyelets to attach guy wires to?Antenna suppliers usually carry collars for that, but you can achieve the same thing by drilling holes into the pole at the chosen guy-wire points and installing eye bolts using lock washers on the nuts, such as these:

http://www.stanleyhardware.com/default.asp?TYPE=CATEGORY&CATEGORY=HDW+EYE+BOLT+W+NUT+ASSEMBLED

I thought about that, but was worried that would weaken the pole with 6 holes in it.

After an hour of googling and wading through forums I found the channelmaster 3076, I've left a message with 4DTV_HD to see if he has them.

It might depend on the pole's wall thickness. If it is really thin you would be best to buy some small pipe sections that fit snugly over the pole as a sleeve to double or triple the wall thickness at the connection points. Drill the first hole about 1 inch from the top with the loop emerging at 0°. The second hole would be drilled about 1 inch below that with the loop at 120°, and the third one about 1 inch below that with the loop at 240° giving you three connection points. If the wall thickness is big like EMT you can make those holes another couple of inches apart if you like and you would not need to put a pipe sleeve on it.

I want to improve my own setup now. After reading past posts for hours, I've come up with the plan below. I hope the some of learned people here can critique this proposal in case I'm still not getting it. :confused:

I have an overhang that exceeds 18" so I'm looking at Ronard 124 wall mounts. The wall rises to about 10 1/2' above ground level. I'm thinking of using 4x5' Winegard swaged masts (that this forum's sponsor sells :cool:) that will be attached to a large patio stone at the base. I'm planning to use the lower wall mount just about to top of the 1st mast segment and the upper near the bottom of the 3rd segment (near the top of the wall - note I lose 6" on each segment due to the swaged part fitting in to the segment below it).

At the top of the mast will be my original 4221. I calculate that the top of the antenna would be about 21' above ground level and about 10 1/2' above the top mount.

Given that it will have a base and have mounts about 5 feet apart, will this setup be strong enough?

If so, I have 2 follow up questions:

1) Since I have a rotor, would I need to drop it down to 3x5' masts to support the extra weight of would the 4x5' be able to withstand it.

2) I'm also thinking of adding one of those turnstile-type FM antennas (eg. AntennaCraft FMSS). Would this also be able to go on the mast without causing any structural issues.

Thanks for any comments!! :D

Hey Jase,

I live in Waterloo and have been considering a tower for a while now as my current roof mount tripod just isn't cutting it. I'd love some info from you on where to purchase a tower, if you installed or had help or if you know of a local(ish) company that could do it?

The above message was sent to me via PM. I've decided to respond here, as others may benefit from the discussion.

Mindspin: I installed my own tower, for two reasons: (1) I enjoy doing this sort of work myself (I enjoy the challenge); and (2) saving money is always a good incentive.

It's good to have a helper when putting up a tower. Someone that can tie off new sections on the ground for you...or send up tools/parts via rope that may be needed. Thus eliminating the need to frequently ascend/descend the installation yourself.

Kitchener-Waterloo is a mandatory market for digital come August 31st of this year. This means that local stations such as CKCO (CTV), Global Paris, and TVO Paris will be digital. Further, the Toronto stations will be increasing their ERP once they go digital only. My point here is that the performance of your current roof install may improve dramatically for you after the transition.

However, if you can't wait and need a tower, you can check this forum:

OTA: Ontario Parts, Sales, Service, Installers (http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=23984)

Websites such as Kijiji are also a great resource for used tower equipment, rotors, and antennas. Unfortunately I cannot recommend anyone for install work, as I've always done my own work.

Good luck, and keep us posted on your install!

Thanks for that Jase88, and members should keep in mind that this is a discussion forum in which we all benefit from each other's questions and answers. PMs are fine for many things, but I know that I personally cannot assist all the folks who PM me so I ask that they post here in the threads instead. I hope that all members who are unsure about posting in a thread will bear in mind that it is the best thing to do. :)

Well, I tried my idea from post 1469 and it was a total disaster (even without the 2 add-ons I was contemplating). :( The 24" wall mounts allowed my mast to clear my eavestrough by a whisker, but even a 4221 at 10' above the eaves through was no match for mother nature. The winds weren't expecially strong on the weekend but the antenna was rocking enough that pixellation made tv viewing impossible.

I removed one of the 5' sections of mast (Winegard TB-0005 from SandR - anybody need one?!? ;) ) and it's much more stable, but of course the lower height affects reception on a number of channels at my location, the very problem I was trying to find a solution to.

I'm guessing the very long wall mounts are generally less supportive than the shorter ones, meaning the height allowed above the top mount will be less.

Does that make sense?

I think I'm at the end of the road for improving my reception. :( Not sure I can get my antenna mounted stably more than 15' off the ground/5' above the eavestrough without a very expensive solution.

El Gran Chico: You could try guy wires. This would certainly add stability. However, guy wires aren't practical in all installations.

Would a tripod mount be possible in this situation?

Thanks Jase88 and mr weather for your comments. I don't think I have the space for guy wires (I can barely get a step ladder in between my wall and the fence) and we aren't crazy about the tripod at the peak idea either - actually anything that involves me going on the roof (I don't want to digress into why :o) or anything higher than a step ladder really.

I think I've resigned myself to getting the mast as high as possible while being stable while MY feet are relatively close to the ground (if I can find someone elses's feet to go on the roof, the whole plan may change :cool: ).

Of course with an antenna at the top, the mast will be top-heavy. I did some experimenting and made it bottom-heavy instead (previously the mast just went to the ground after going through the upper and lower wall mount), and it seemed to stabilize it a lot. Perhaps once the weather gets a bit better I can add back in the extra 5' mast piece and see what happens?!?

Unless the learned folks here have advice to the contrary?!?

I don't think I have the space for guy wires (I can barely get a step ladder in between my wall and the fence)

Even 2 guy wires to the eves at the corners on either side of the antenna would be an improvement, though obviously not as good as 3 or more.

actually anything that involves me going on the roof (I don't want to digress into why :o) or anything higher than a step ladder really.

I can understand. :) I have a 2 story house and while I don't mind being on the roof of a bungalow, I don't like the idea of going on my roof.

Of course with an antenna at the top, the mast will be top-heavy. I did some experimenting and made it bottom-heavy instead (previously the mast just went to the ground after going through the upper and lower wall mount), and it seemed to stabilize it a lot. Perhaps once the weather gets a bit better I can add back in the extra 5' mast piece and see what happens?!?

I was going to suggest something similar. Let us know how i goes. Photos of what you have done would also be helpful.

Another option would be a bracketed tower. You just stake it into the ground, attach it to the eve. Get one with a rotor plate that lets you put the rotor inside the top mount. Most of the assembly can be done on the ground and shouldn't require you to climb any higher than you did for this installation. It should be much more stable than a single pole.

Sadly a Canadian soldier died Monday when installing an antenna 15 meters high. Just a reminder that installing your own gear can be dangerous work.


CFB VALCARTIER, Que. — A Canadian soldier died after he fell nearly 15 metres from the roof of a building at Canadian Forces Base Valcartier in Quebec on Monday.

Cpl. Jean-Michel Deziel, a member of the headquarters and signals squadron, was installing a telecommunications antenna when he fell at about 10 a.m., said public affairs officer Capt. Jeanette Champagne.



Read more: http://news.nationalpost.com/2011/01/18/soldier-dead-after-fall-at-cfb-valcartier/#ixzz1BWHoO856

That's tragic, and obviously upsetting to hear.

And while I haven't read the story or possess any knowledge of the facts involving this situation, there may have been a lack of safety equipment here or a catastrophic failure of safety equipment, or both. Most accidents of this nature are preventable.

A young family member is in the same line of work and has done a tour in Afghanistan. Those guys are amazing, training for how to rig their gear under the most adverse conditions, including being under fire. My heart goes out to that young soldier's family. His service to our country is heroic.

Everyone... be safe when up there in the wind!

EL Gran Chico,

Will 25' above ground provide good reception in your location?

How about get two sections of tower (they come in 10' per section, about $100/section last I heard from a local shop) which will give 20' above ground. Add a 10' EMT to the tower which will provide at least 25' above ground (give and take).

This way it will give you the stability of mounting the antenna or adding a rotor down the road. I have seen folks mount CM4221 or 4228 on one of the legs of the tower in my area.