: Guantánamo Bay - a human rights scandal


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os
2005-05-30, 07:48 PM
Amnesty International report:
http://web.amnesty.org/pages/guantanamobay-index-eng

<<Hypocrisy, an overarching war mentality and a disregard for basic human rights principles and international legal obligations continue to mark the USA's "war on terror". Serious human rights violations are the inevitable result.>>

Act now, please read the "What can you do?" section.

buritto
2005-05-30, 10:09 PM
I could honestly care less about Gitmo. Tell Amnesty to start with China and work there way down the list.

mightymike
2005-05-31, 10:14 AM
Dad? Dad? Is that you? I thought you died?
Well buritto, lets hope you or your families human rights, basic human rights, are never infringed upon!
mightymike

pjreid
2005-05-31, 10:18 AM
Umm...Amnesty already has a good track record of calling out China's human rights violations, among others. So...because the offences allegedly taking place at Guantanamo Bay are "minor" by comparison, they shouldn't be dealt with?

Tell me, if the house next door to you is being robbed, do you decide not to call 911 because there's a riot in the downtown area? Do you understand that you can deal with more than one issue at a time?

Further, do you understand how hypocritical it is of the US (and any other supporters of Guantanamo) to be prepretating human rights offences while at the same time denouncing other countries who do the same?

If so, then I don't get why you don't care about the issue.

buritto
2005-05-31, 01:01 PM
I can't believe you all care about those people in Gitmo, it's not like they jay-walked and off they went to Cuba. I don't give a ratts behind about them.

If you care about them send them an aid package or something.

EDIT:

Actually no need to send an aid package but you can give them your money...

http://web.amnesty.org/pages/guantanamobay-toolkit-eng

And Amnesty said that it's a gulag over there. Hmmmm....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulag

That's a gulag.

pjreid
2005-05-31, 01:18 PM
I can't believe you all care about those people in Gitmo, it's not like they jay-walked and off they went to Cuba. I don't give a ratts behind about them.

If you care about them send them an aid package or something.

a) Some of them didn't do _anything_ other than being in the wrong place at the wrong time.
b)Some of them were not terrorists but were fighting an invasion of their country.
c)IT DOESN'T MATTER WHAT THE F?CK THESE PEOPLE DID; THEY STILL SHOULD BE TREATED HUMANELY. Doesn't it strike you as wrong that the US is keeping them outside US borders so that they're free from the restrictions they would have if the prisoners were located on US soil?

buritto
2005-05-31, 02:03 PM
a) Some of them didn't do _anything_ other than being in the wrong place at the wrong time.
b)Some of them were not terrorists but were fighting an invasion of their country.
c)IT DOESN'T MATTER WHAT THE F?CK THESE PEOPLE DID; THEY STILL SHOULD BE TREATED HUMANELY. Doesn't it strike you as wrong that the US is keeping them outside US borders so that they're free from the restrictions they would have if the prisoners were located on US soil?

a) Yes I'm sure there is.

b) If your holding an AK-47 and not dead consider them luckey to be a live and in Gitmo.

c) They are treated as humanely as possible all's NOT fair in love and war. Do you think it is? They could send them to the moon for all I care.

Did you send them your donation yet? Timmy the Taliban could use your money to free himself.

Face it, I don't care about them and most people don't either.

os
2005-05-31, 02:21 PM
Face it, I don't care about them and most people don't either.
You don't care about human rights in general, or only in this particular case where the offender is US?
How about the long list of other human rights violations by US:
http://web.amnesty.org/report2005/usa-summary-eng ?

Nanuuk
2005-05-31, 02:33 PM
I'm with Buritto. If you find yourself there chances are your weren't walking down the street minding your own business. Chances are you were involved in a terrorist activity directed at the U.S. They're lucky they're not on bread and water.

ken0042
2005-05-31, 02:46 PM
I have to say I'm with Burrito as well.
Tell me, if the house next door to you is being robbed, do you decide not to call 911 because there's a riot in the downtown area?

That is a great analogy. Myself, I likely wouldn't call 911 if the police were busy with a riot. I remember during the LA riots in 1992 (or was it 93) they showed police officers just watching looting going on. Why? The cops were more concerned with public safety.

If I have a choce between supporting Amnesty or the Red Cross Tsunami relief; I'm putting my money on the Red Cross. (And I already did too.)

The US is dealing with it's military officials who are breaking International law; from what I've seen in the news.

Maybe if Amnesty had stepped in when Saddam was in power; the US wouldn't have invaded in the first place.

biglyle
2005-05-31, 03:05 PM
I am with Burrito as well. All this US bashing makes me ill. If terrorists strike on Canadian soil you can bet your last dollar will be will be kissing many an American ass begging them get involved.

Is the US always right, hell no.
Am I glad we are neighbours. You bet your ass I am.

buritto
2005-05-31, 03:29 PM
You don't care about human rights in general, or only in this particular case where the offender is US?
How about the long list of other human rights violations by US:
http://web.amnesty.org/report2005/usa-summary-eng ?

I care about human rights. Absolutely! But not these guys. And the consences seems that most don't either and I don't think Amnesty will get much money from these board members.

os
2005-05-31, 05:09 PM
So you guys agree with the torture of POWs? Because it seems it was an official policy directive coming from the US War Secretary, Rumsfeld :
<<"We have documented the use of torture and mistreatment, widespread throughout the world. We have documented that the U.S. government is a leading purveyor and practitioner of the odious human rights violation," says William Schulz, executive director of Amnesty International. >>

I'm just sad, that a country that I once admired is slowly becoming a new Soviet Union. Under this mask of a "war on terror", they are becoming one with the terrorists they are claiming to fight against.

booth44
2005-05-31, 06:37 PM
I'm just sad, that a country that I once admired is slowly becoming a new Soviet Union. Under this mask of a "war on terror", they are becoming one with the terrorists they are claiming to fight against.

Oh, give us a break already. There's no "evidence" in that Amnesty report, only accusation.

At Amnesty, they're blinded by their hatred of Bush, just like you.

os
2005-05-31, 06:43 PM
At Amnesty, they're blinded by their hatred of Bush, just like you.
That's what the Soviets used to say, that Amnesty International hates the communists that's why they are spreading lies about them.

[Or alternatively you are blinded by your love of Bush (and by the US news media).]

Nanuuk
2005-05-31, 07:18 PM
OS these guys aren't covered by the Geneva convention and are therefore not considered to be POW's. They are religious zealots and terrorists. One of the ones they let go a few weeks ago was back at it in Afghanistan fighting with the Taliban. Torture (many definitions) has been part of warfare for the last 6000 years. While we have human rights sensibilities, we can't be naive enough to assume that it won't go on or that just because we're the 'good guys', it won't happen.

johnp'in'bc
2005-05-31, 07:22 PM
Oh, give us a break already. At Amnesty, they're blinded by their hatred of Bush, just like you.
Oh, give 'us' a break already!! IMHO, that's a crock of crapola!! If it wasn't for the work/research done by agencies like Amnesty, we would hear/read little about the atrocities being conducted 'here', 'there', and 'everywhere'.

os
2005-05-31, 08:08 PM
OS these guys aren't covered by the Geneva convention and are therefore not considered to be POW's. They are religious zealots and terrorists. One of the ones they let go a few weeks ago was back at it in Afghanistan fighting with the Taliban. Torture (many definitions) has been part of warfare for the last 6000 years. While we have human rights sensibilities, we can't be naive enough to assume that it won't go on or that just because we're the 'good guys', it won't happen.

(1) Why are they "not covered" by the Geneva Convention? As far as I know US was attacked and started a war (against Afghanistan) as a result of that attack. So the prisoners they made are POWs. If US say they aren't and they can be held indefinitely in prison without any defense or trial, then that's a clear human rights abuse.
(2) So what if torture has been used for over 6000 years. Right now there is an international convention that says it is illegal to use it and those who use it are to be prosecuted as criminals of war by the International Court of Justice.
If we really are the "good guys" then it won't happen. I never see Canada for example practicing torture or sending some criminals to be tortured in other countries like Uzbekistan. US on the other hand has stopped being part of the "good guys" when they invaded a country based on lies and when it's obvious they are violating basic human rights.

Nanuuk
2005-05-31, 08:52 PM
OS, no war was declared by anyone. Perhaps the U.S could have declared war on Afghanistan for an act of war, but it wasn't clear (and still isn't) whether the government of the day orchestrated the September 11 attack. This is new territory for the world. A tightly knit well organized terrorist organization without boundries. As far as the 'torture goes', the terrorists didn't give any consideration for all the nationalities killed the September 11 attacks. I won't lose any sleep over whatever fate befalls them. They can hang them up by their thumbnails or throw them in a dungeon until they rot for all I care.

os
2005-05-31, 09:20 PM
They can hang them up by their thumbnails or throw them in a dungeon until they rot for all I care.
How about throwing all the criminal suspects in US in a dungeon and keeping them there without a trial? There are a lot of murderers in US too. The number of people killed in US each year is superior to the number of people killed by the terrorists. What about the brothers, the friends and/or the accomplices of the killers. Should those be denied defense and be thrown to jail as well without any trial.
And why some of the detainees at Guantanamo were freed after years of detention without any trial? Were they perhaps innocent?