The following stations are now testing ATSC-MH...

CBLFT-DT ch 25 Toronto has " 5.2 CBC E "
CKCO-DT ch 13 Kitchener has " 13.1 CTV-1 "

Threshold of reception is lower than regular ATSC.

Sweet, thanks I will check this out...

Edit: Sure enough. Pretty cool...

http://digitalhome.ca/forum/picture.php?albumid=641&pictureid=5419

Thanks for the heads up, cxgy, this is great news.

I've moved this announcement into it's own thread here so that others can give their results and also tip us off about the status of any other ATSC-MH broadcasts happening in Canada.

If ATSC-MH becomes commonplace in Canada we can go back to just using the existing Station Status threads, but for now, being that this is so new and undergoing testing, we'll keep tabs on the status here.

All technical discussion of the ATSC-MH standard continues in the following pre-existing thread:

http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=63639

Seems that recording is disabled. Dunno if that's a function of Wintv while tuned to an ATSC-MH channel, or if it's disabled by the stream. It will record normal ATSC obviously. Currently WinTV is the only SW I have installed here capable of playing with this tuner (Hauppauge Aero-M) in ATSC-MH mode so no way to tell on this end.

http://digitalhome.ca/forum/picture.php?albumid=641&pictureid=5421

Yikes, are they implementing the evil Broadcast Flag (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broadcast_flag)? :eek: I sure hope it's just a glitch or some other cause. Hopefully someone can take a TSReader sample and check on that. If my worst fear is confirmed this use of it may not be legal but I would definitely want to ask Professor Michael Geist for his opinion on that.

Don't know.
Maybe someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm not aware of a TsReader Source capable of tuning the MH signal (yet). When ya tune with the standard ATSC source, that's what you'll get. The stream as demodulated in standard ATSC 8VSB mode. In other words it's transparent to the normal ATSC signal.

I may have to check up on the linux developers again to see if they made any more progress on this device adding MH support in linux. Far as I know the guts are in the kernel now, but SW tools have yet to be written to go along with it. Scanning, zapping and such have to do their piece as well.

Ah... good info. If anyone has a solution to dumping ATSC M/H streams for analysis it would be appreciated.

Okay, now I've got to go get an ATSC mobile device to test....as my local station is testing out mobile!

Is there any sites like tvfool or rabbitears that tracks M/H availability broadcast areas?

rabbitears has a good way of looking for where the MH stations are. probably the only place.
And likely not enough yet to warrant a tvfool like application.

WinTV has tons of ATSC-MH stream info in its log.

After doing an ATSC-MH Scan ... goto ...

Settings - Advanced Options - Logs - Open Logs Directory - log.txt

So, 'WinTV compatable' devices do or will have an application to check data that relates to coverage area and mobile broadcast sources? I don't have a handheld yet, but I was thinking of buying a mobile/handheld for my daughter. There seems to be some things that you'd have to look for when buying a handheld device though such as WinTV, recordability options, etc..

Stampeder mentioned Broadcast flagging. From what I've read so far, some units may not have "broadcast flagging' capability and thus they must abide by the ATSC M/H Rules 'flag all' and won't be able to record at all.

CHCH has not announced a date yet, other than to say "coming in the future". Hopefully many more free mobile broadcasts will come and without the burden of having to subscribe to another greedy third party provider. To me, having the CHCH local news source at hand is the greatest asset of having a mobile handheld.

One thing that's disconcerting in the US is that the NBC, Fox, Qubo, Telemundo & Univision mobile TV feeds are ENCRYPTED. You can only view the signal using a "Dyle TV" app on certain handheld devices.

Ah... good info. If anyone has a solution to dumping ATSC M/H streams for analysis it would be appreciated.

I have the only M/H dump tool that I know of, and I'm not allowed to distribute it. What I can do, though, is be sent full transport stream captures, approximately 50MB in size, and feed it through the software and send back the output.

For example, here's output from WDIV in Detroit back in August 2011. http://www.rabbitears.info/atscinfo/53114-0_0.htm

I list a lot of the details in the main RabbitEars listings, plus there is this page: http://www.rabbitears.info/market.php?request=atscmh

- Trip

Don't forget that the Win TV also does an info dump, as I mentioned in #11 above.

Note that the Hauppauge 950Q and WinTV v7.2d did NOT scan a 25.2 M/H virtual channel from Toronto when I tested it after updating to v7.2d of the software this afternoon. (It didn't before either)

Not sure if it's a hardware or software limitation.

Windows 7 x64 SP1

Cameron

According to Hauppauge's site, the Aero-M is the only tuner of theirs, supporting ATSC M/H.

That's right, and it's the only reason I bought one. Just to play around with it when the time came.

posts 79 thru 85 in the main MH thread.
http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=63639&page=6


Edit: went lookin thru that WinTV logfile directory and didn't see very much that looked useful to me.

snippet from WinTV's log.txt while tuned to 5.2
If anything in here is signaling, no ya can't record the program, maybe someone can point it out???
Personally, don't know anything about the standard.

<signaling>
<table_id>db</table_id>
<section_syntax_indicator>0</section_syntax_indicator>
<private_indicator>1</private_indicator>
<SMT_MH_protocol_version>0</SMT_MH_protocol_version>
<ensemble_id>1</ensemble_id>
<version_number>2</version_number>
<current_next_indicator>1</current_next_indicator>
<section_number>0</section_number>
<last_section_number>0</last_section_number>
<services>
<num_MH_services>1</num_MH_services>
<service>
<service_number>0</service_number>
<MH_service_id>1282</MH_service_id>
<MH_service_id_virt>5.2</MH_service_id_virt>
<multi_ensemble_service>0</multi_ensemble_service>
<MH_service_status>2</MH_service_status>
<SP_indicator>0</SP_indicator>
<short_MH_service_name>CBC E</short_MH_service_name>
<MH_service_category>1</MH_service_category>
<MH_service_category_desc>TV (Informative only)</MH_service_category_desc>
<IP_version_flag>0</IP_version_flag>
<service_source_IP_address_flag>0</service_source_IP_address_flag>
<service_destination_IP_address_flag>0</service_destination_IP_address_flag>
<components>
<num_components>2</num_components>
<component>
<component_number>0</component_number>
<component_source_IP_address_flag>0</component_source_IP_address_flag>
<essential_component_indicator>1</essential_component_indicator>
<component_destination_IP_address_flag>1</component_destination_IP_address_flag>
<port_num_count>2</port_num_count>
<component_destination_UDP_port_num>10012</component_destination_UDP_port_num>
<component_destination_IP_address>239.1.1.8</component_destination_IP_address>
<component_desc>
<num_descriptors>1</num_descriptors>
<MH_component_descriptor>
<descriptor_tag>bc</descriptor_tag>
<descriptor_length>20</descriptor_length>
<component_type>37</component_type>
<component_desc>HE AAC v2 audio stream component</component_desc>
<component_encryption_flag>0</component_encryption_flag>
<ISO_639_language_code>eng</ISO_639_language_code>
<RTP_clock_rate>48000</RTP_clock_rate>
<constant_duration>0</constant_duration>
<sampling_rate>3</sampling_rate>
<audio_service_type>0</audio_service_type>
<audio_service_desc>main audio service: complete main (CM)</audio_service_desc>
<audio_channel_association>0</audio_channel_association>
<num_configs>1</num_configs>
<audio_config>
<profile_level_id>15</profile_level_id>
<num_audio_channels>2</num_audio_channels>
<config_size>4</config_size>
<config>eb098800</config>
</audio_config>
</MH_component_descriptor>
</component_desc>
</component>
<component>
<component_number>1</component_number>
<component_source_IP_address_flag>0</component_source_IP_address_flag>
<essential_component_indicator>1</essential_component_indicator>
<component_destination_IP_address_flag>1</component_destination_IP_address_flag>
<port_num_count>2</port_num_count>
<component_destination_UDP_port_num>10010</component_destination_UDP_port_num>
<component_destination_IP_address>239.1.1.8</component_destination_IP_address>
<component_desc>
<num_descriptors>1</num_descriptors>
<MH_component_descriptor>
<descriptor_tag>bc</descriptor_tag>
<descriptor_length>6</descriptor_length>
<component_type>35</component_type>
<component_desc>H.264 AVC video or H.264 SVC base layer stream component</component_desc>
<component_encryption_flag>0</component_encryption_flag>
<profile_idc>66</profile_idc>
<constraint_set0_flag>1</constraint_set0_flag>
<constraint_set1_flag>1</constraint_set1_flag>
<constraint_set2_flag>1</constraint_set2_flag>
<AVC_compatible_flags>0</AVC_compatible_flags>
<level_idc>13</level_idc>
<AVC_24_hour_picture_flag>0</AVC_24_hour_picture_flag>
<AVC_still_present>0</AVC_still_present>
</MH_component_descriptor>
</component_desc>
</component>
</components>
<MH_SMT_desc>
<num_descriptors>0</num_descriptors>
</MH_SMT_desc>
</service>
<ensemble_desc>
<num_descriptors>0</num_descriptors>
</ensemble_desc>
</services>
</signaling>

<private_indicator>1</private_indicator>Bingo, no dice for recording. Welcome to the Broadcast Flag!!! :mad: Importantly it is the first flag set, so even if the tuner can easily handle the subsequent signal it cannot bypass that flag... That's all she wrote, and there is no point in trying to get it to resolve the subsequent broadcast requirements.

Having said that, there are ways around this supposed entry gate but we will not be able to discuss that here in this forum.

Again, I hope that Professor Michael Geist will be alerted to this new situation and will be able to help us understand whether it is legal or not.