: Global Ottawa DTV Transition - Aug. 16, 2011 - update in Post #331


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flavoie
2011-08-20, 08:33 PM
Thanks for reporting derek I happen to have a pretty similar setup except for not getting the Global signal. You should call them, you're the first one that might be using 7mc with Global Ottawa around here.

charettepa
2011-08-20, 09:01 PM
i must admit
even though my tv's are able to display global
none of them are able to detect it
i had to add it manually
something has to be wrong with the psip or something
my pc detected it but has a hard time with it

OTAJuncqui
2011-08-20, 09:10 PM
if your using a PC get "TSReader" to aim your antenna

mike infinity
2011-08-20, 09:31 PM
Thanks for reporting derek I happen to have a pretty similar setup except for not getting the Global signal. You should call them, you're the first one that might be using 7mc with Global Ottawa around here.
I have been trying to give it a go...but no detection so far in 7mc.

Here are my findings with rabbit ears:

1. put rabbit ears direct to my pioneer tv atsc tuner. I picked up cbc french and english and several others (digital and otherwise), no global.

2. same as number one except put the rabbit ears on the roof. Everything vanished...even cbc. For whatever reason the rabbit ears work best ~15 feet below the peak of my roof.

3. Tried the rabbit ears routed through my cm7777 vhf input (in separate mode) along with my cm4228. Nothing on the roof for VHF...picked up the usual suspects 15feet below roof line.

4. Tried my old RCA powered rabbit ears (which includes a rotatable circular loop in middle both through the cm7777 and direct to TV...same results with a bit better reception on the analog stations.

just wondering...is global analog off the air? I get nothing on channel 6 at all.

I was wondering if its something to do with wmc. I am going to try direct to my pioneer and see if that works next.

EDIT: I don't know how to add 6.1 manually to the pioneer or to wmc...looks like I have some tinkering to do.

flavoie
2011-08-20, 09:46 PM
I can't scan Global Ottawa on rf 6 - 6.1 on either 7mc and the Hauppauge tuner software. This sounds like you have a signal power issue like I do. Maybe I should probably try my Sony TV for comparison.
Might do it Monday...

roger1818
2011-08-20, 11:12 PM
People nationwide have been having problems with Global and Win7MC. Check out the thread Global's Transition PSIP Issues Explained (http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/showthread.php?p=1300864) for more info. My advice, avoid Microsoft. ;)

mike infinity
2011-08-21, 08:19 AM
I tried ts reader last night. It detects global on a scan. The signal lock reports 65% 7.500 dBm. I am not sure how to interpret the number. I tried manually adding 6.1 RF6 to wmc...no luck. I am not sure if it's a signal issue or a wmc issue.

Thoughts?

OTAJuncqui
2011-08-21, 08:47 AM
Since the Global transition to digital is affecting Win Media Center users,
you may consider NPVR:
This will make it easier for you:
NPVR wiki page-
http://www.gbpvr.com/nwiki/pmwiki.php
download latest version-
http://www.gbpvr.com/NPVRSetup_2_1_5.exe (http://www.gbpvr.com/NPVRSetup_2_1_5.exe)
Install it!
download these patches and copy into NPVR directory-
http://forums.gbpvr.com/attachment.p...1&d=1313531213 (http://forums.gbpvr.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=31361&d=1313531213)
Start NPVR and work your way though config.
Theres no SQL involved and I can use it with a P4

Oh and you can scan Global with it

(I know this is HTPC but it is directly related to this thread)

mike infinity
2011-08-21, 09:11 AM
Fiddling with my rabbit ears I managed to get the signal lock to 75-80%. I will try again to manually channel in wmc when I get a chance. Now I am wondering about a better VHF antenna. I was also wondering about retesting my 4228 alone since I did not try ts reader during my previous tests.

charettepa
2011-08-21, 09:28 AM
@mike infinity

nice to see another person able to get global with rabbit ears
its still very weak and almost impossible to get indoors/attic though
i was only able to pick up global by strapping rabbit ears to the longest dipole on my vhf hi
my next step is to buy some aluminum tube to replace the rabbit ears
i'm sure it will perform better

towerDB8
2011-08-21, 09:44 AM
I'm receiving Global with the use of rabbit ears near a window on two TVs. In the living room it's a Sharp Aquos with rabbit ears combined with a 4-bay. The bedroom TV is older and has a Tivax digital converter and there I have the rabbit ears combined with an old bow tie attached (performs better for UHF than the loop if you can find one). Signal strength is generally only around 50 % for both and I spent hours fiddling. My apartment faces north/west and I imagine on the other side of the building I'd have no luck.

mike infinity
2011-08-21, 09:49 AM
I am trying to figure out how to built a single channel yagi for global. Would that do better than the rabbit ears?

I am still trying to understand why the rabbit ears don't do better on my roof compared to on my deck ~15' lower elevation.

spargopolis
2011-08-21, 10:11 AM
I called the Global Toronto 416-446-5311 number and I expressed my concerns about the low power of the Global channel 6 in Ottawa. The person I spoke to was quite dismissive, but did say they have had "around 200" calls about the issue. When I asked to placed on some sort of list he said they didn't have one.

About the only useful peace of information he mentioned was that Global was looking into "fixing or raising the power" of the signal. When asked he said he couldn't provide any status of this. I'm not convinced that he wasn't just making this up in order get me off the phone, but I just wanted to pass this tidbit along.

Personally I'm going to wait and see if there are any improvements over the next couple of weeks before going to the trouble of buying and installing new antennas, moving antennas from the attic to the roof, etc.

BCF
2011-08-21, 12:04 PM
Hopefully Global will also increase the ERP of CIII channel 6 from Paris,ON after they switch to digital in a few days. They currently list an ERP of just 4kW. :(
This will be the same issue Global currently has in Ottawa.

Humbar
2011-08-21, 12:15 PM
They can't just increase the power. They will need to apply to Industry Canada to get approval, and that may require co-ordination with the FCC. Who knows how long that may take.

flavoie
2011-08-21, 01:37 PM
Mike a channel cut yagi for ch6 would give you great gain. Next in line would be VHF low antenna like the y-5-2-6, but I really like my VIP-302sr which is bit lower gain on VHF low but very respectable but also good gain on VHF hi.
Of all those the channel cut would be the smallest of all.

I found 2 threads for single cut yagis. Check for 5y6s.

Trip
2011-08-21, 01:45 PM
They can't just increase the power. They will need to apply to Industry Canada to get approval, and that may require co-ordination with the FCC. Who knows how long that may take.

They can seek to operate at higher power via TO though. WRGB operated at 30 kW under STA while awaiting Canadian concurrence on a permit to boost to that level on a permanent basis.

(TO in Canada = STA in US, from what I understand.)

- Trip

roger1818
2011-08-21, 03:59 PM
I am still trying to understand why the rabbit ears don't do better on my roof compared to on my deck ~15' lower elevation.

It all depends what the root cause of your problem is. If it is FM interference, in increasing elevation won't help. Are you using an FM trap?

roger1818
2011-08-21, 04:07 PM
I get it about 95% of the time (though it is too early to say for sure).

My reception has been quite reliable for Global over the past few days. The only issue I had was caused by a power failure (my HTPC is on a UPS but my amp isn't).

mike infinity
2011-08-21, 10:15 PM
It all depends what the root cause of your problem is. If it is FM interference, in increasing elevation won't help. Are you using an FM trap?
I am using a cm7777 with fm trap set to "in". I attached the rabbit ears to the VHF in and set the mode switch to "separate". I have tried both unpowered rabbit ears and powered ones. I have had more luck with the powered ones with the gain set to minimum. I got 80% signal for a minute or two on my deck but I have been unable to duplicate this condition since.

Right now I have switched back to cm4228 alone in combined mode and I can get 65% locked on ts reader but the stream is chock full of errors. I get that same result with the rabbit ears 99% of the time on separate mode so the rabbit ears seem pointless for now.

I am wondering if it's worth all the hassle to try a single cut or 302 (which would have to be in my attic)...especially when many are having mixed results with that antenna as well.