Obed, Their broadcast license states post transition is VHF 11, so therefore it's necessary.
I will try and optimise what I can here, not because I have to or need to, but because I can.
For me it's the thrill of the chase. Bring it on...

@Obed,

I understand your frustration. I really do, the thing is that you won't be just purchasing a VHF antenna for just RF11. Remember, CFTO is reverting back to RF9. CKVR on RF10, CKCO on RF13 (might not be possible from your location though), and don't forget the future possibility of WNGS/WBBZ on RF7.

So an investment into a VHF antenna may actually be a good idea.

I agree, I am in IT and when ever we perform major projects their is always a period of adjustments afterwards. Can someone post what the CHCH licence says about power?

Can we compare what power they had on UHF 18 and what they are allocated for 11?

I am not really going to make any conclusions until Sept1. Maybe that is why they did the transition early to give themselves time to work out the kinks. Just conjecture I know.

Originally posted by Obed:
I'm no expert but what has happened today with the loss of my DTV signal was entirely expected with the switch to VHF 11. I suspect the folk at CHCH have been well aware that they were going to lose many of their GTA viewers.

It's their choice to lose their viewers, and their advertisers' audience. I'm certainly not going to invest in a VHF antenna just for CHCH.

Apparently they had this VHF issue in the US when they turned over to DTV two years ago and stations made changes right after that happened so I agree they must have known about the issue.

I don't even know if buying a VHF antenna would make a difference but even if it did my PVR only has one antenna in jack and getting CHCH and CTV isn't worth losing the rest...nor do I really feel like figuring out, what sounds like a complex idea, of combining antennas.

Thanks for the heads up. Just did a re-scan in north Miss and 11-1 digital comes up (no problem). Almost as strong as rf 18 was. Mind you rf 18 was coming in with a 13 inch RG 6 bare cable in my basement.

I have all indoor antennas (attic) of various lengths (combined through a splitter in reverse). At the moment, the TV that I scanned is through a double splitter. The other TV is on its own. I will scan later.

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I have done some testing (probably should post in Area 51) with two metal (steel) side-of-the-road advertising sign frames. Flipped sideways and then attached a UHF / VHF balun (dollar store). No probem for VHF 9,10,11, 12 and 13. Held with sideways against wood.

The difficulty is when combined (in reverse) through a splitter with UHF -- part of the signal deteriorates to 70%. Not sure if either the metal that I already have in the attic is causing some reflection 1in VHF signal or 2) other analog signals -- which will be gone after the 31st are causing interference.


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Just FYI Combining VHF and UHF antennas are usually made easy when you have a preamp that handles both as it usually has separate inputs :D

nakedgord,

Some Vhf antennas come with ujsv combiners one input for vhf one for uhf. the frequencies are separated, this is the route that I might have to go.

Still no word from anyone in East York? Anybody East of Toronto picking CHCH up?

With respect to opinions concerning VHF vs UHF. Those decision were made several years ago, before the implications were known. There was much that should have been learned from the 2009 US transition regarding their VHF failures. Unfortunately for Canadian OTA viewers, IC and the CRTC are slow learners.

See Stampeder's post#50:
http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/showpost.php?p=1296445&postcount=50

CHCH is still tuning and reviewing OTA concerns as they arise. It's only been a few hours since their transitioning of their DTV signal to the VHF 11RF, so give them a break!

Hi Major Tom,

I appreciate that they don't have permission to broadcast on RF18 post transition, that's why I said they need to seek permission. Permission they should have sought a long time ago if they wanted wide coverage for viewers in the GTA. All very predictable.

Hi Marbles,

Thanks for your observations. CTV analog 9 is currently a blow torch so I am expecting I will still get it DTV post transition.

I have a VHF/UHF Terk indoor combi antenna.
It works fine for VHF analog 5,9,11 broadcasts.
It also works fine for channel 10 and 13 DTV broadcasts whenever there is tropo from Rochester (solidly consistent with the times when I get Rochester UHF transmissions.)

CKVR has never come through for me on RF3 analog due to the terrain, so I don't expect to get it on RF10 digital. And given it would interfere with Rochester I don't want it.
CKCO and WNGS/WBBZ are too far for me to worry about and I don't see people around here with more elaborate set ups getting them either on these forums.

So, investing in a specialist VHF antenna just to point at CHCH simply does not appeal.

That's all for now, I'm off to watch the blues. :cool:

Hmmm both those sound like good ideas and thanks for the fyi (esp since I've been toying with getting a pre-amp to see if I could grab anymore Buffalo stations)

But I dunno...if I couldn't also get in more Buffalo stations it may not be worth the bother and cost to get a pre-amp esp for rolling news CHCH.

I rather doubt CHCH could keep 18, but I'm not sure because I'm not familiar with Canadian interference rules. Using the US rules, I suspect CHCH-18 would cause too much interference with CICA-19 and prevent them from using 18.

Now if CKVR hadn't sought 35 for their new transmitter, they could have asked to use the channel 35 allotment that CITS is preparing to abandon in favor of 36.

- Trip

Thanks for your observations. CTV analog 9 is currently a blow torch so I am expecting I will still get it DTV post transition.


My understanding that CFTO-DT on RF9 will be a fraction of the current analogue power. So I don't know if I'll get it in my location, due to heavy foliage obstruction.

CHCH is easy for me as it's less that 20kms from my house. I could probably get it with a coat hanger.

I think for now we should post on who is getting what signal where type of thing. I will start my ranting after Sept1 if things are not looking good :)

Again a question for the experts, could the blow torch analog from the CN tower 9 and 5 be affecting the other vhf signals like CHCH. Perhaps the CHCH signal has been calculated for when the airwaves are free of analog?

I am using an older Samsung T451, the signal change required a complete rescan of channels which I have experience in the past with significant channel updates. Channel 11 normal here (Confederation Hts).
Original 4228 on a 30 ft tower (broken rotor:mad:). My advise, if you are having trouble, try a tuner rescan rather than just adding a channel.

I think for now we should post on who is getting what signal where type of thing. I will start my ranting after Sept1 if things are not looking good :)

Again a question for the experts, could the blow torch analog from the CN tower 9 and 5 be affecting the other vhf signals like CHCH. Perhaps the CHCH signal has been calculated for when the airwaves are free of analog?
9, maybe. 5, probably not.
FM on the other hand...

I'm at Hwy 400 and Sheppard. Used to receive the old RF18 CHCH broadcast without any problems on a Sony.
Rescanned after the changeover and I'm getting the broadcast on RF11 fine.

Right now I'm hovering between 38 and 43/100 on the reception scale, which is 19 to 23 dB SNR.
Back when I last checked RF18 (Oct 25, 2009) I was getting a solid 32, which was about 20 db SNR.
Hepburn is forecasting a whole load of Tropo today, so I'll have to wait to see if the slight performance gain I seem to have is real or not.

I had to do an "Auto Program" as the "Add Digital Channels" option did not add the new RF11 channel. The Auto Program option erases the channel table stored in the TV and does a fresh scan of all Analog and Digital channels.

ps. I still have a classic CM4228 antenna on the roof, but the CM7778 preamp mentioned in my signature here is NOT in place.

scruffy416 makes a good point... could tropo be adding/hindering reception today...???

Still receiving CHCH-dt on 11 with 92 to 99 % solid with my homemade yagi UVJ with my Toronto UHF antenna feed.You guys were expecting 6kw to match 316kw analog or 60kw on 18 to match 6kw on 11.Glad I set up before hand for a perfect picture on analog 11.

From reading this thread top down, it seems (generally) as if everyone east of Pearson airport (which is right around where the 60dBu dies out on the CHCH contour map on their site) are the ones who are having trouble, whereas anyone within that 60dBu contour has maintained or improved their reception.

Anyone posting who says they are 'in Toronto' really needs to qualify that statement. Mississauga DHCers are still seeing a signal. Those who are midtown (south North York/north Leaside) seem to be having issues.

Hi,

I am just South East of Woodbine & Gerrard, behind mature trees but 50m above the lake (antenna is about 40ft above ground level at my location); 2 x 4221HD (partially modified*) lower one pointed at the CN Tower and upper one pointed to Buffalo joined using a Winegard CC-7870 2-Way Splitter/Joiner (http://www.winegarddirect.com/viewitem.asp?p=cc7870&d=Winegard-CC7870-2Way-TV-Antenna-Joiner-Coupler-(CC7870)&post=). This is then distributed around the house using a Channel Plus H838HHR (http://www.linearcorp.com/product_detail.php?productId=309) distribution amp.

* I reversed the balun and removed the plastic end clips but didn't cut the bow ties!

Just want to report as of 16.11 CHCH on 11.1 is no longer available due to switch to VHF. As of last night channel 18 was working, signal strength around 50%, but solid.

I see from this coverage map that I should still be getting a signal - but right now nothing http://chch.com/CHCH-TV-0-HAMILTON.jpg. We'll see if anything changes after dark.

This is my TV fool report (http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d3e47a26380f939) - but I've not found this to very accurately predict my experience (for example right now I have no City-TV-DT [53.1/57.1] and no CBLTF-DF [24.1/25.1] although both ought to be easy to get in my location)

Hope others have better experience than me! Not sure I know what I'm going to do. Guess wait until things "settle down" in September.