: CHCH Hamilton DTV Transition - Aug. 15, 2011 - update in Post #462
2011-08-16, 10:44 PM
I have just briefly read this thread regarding receiving CHCH 11. I am just south of you I believe you’re most likely in one of the apartments over looking the soccer fields? (Huron Park)
I just did a rescan and locked on CHCH 11 very good signal strength the best I have ever been able to receive CHCH at 79 % I am using CM 4228 (original).
I am not sure you are locking onto channel new channel 11 and think I was tuned to 18-1, previously. I am pretty sure you should get CHCH 11 as you have huge height advantage over me. (At least 50 ft.)
Try another rescan or even better editing your channels, add channel 11-1 and 11-2 its coming on 11-2 for me. If you are still not receiving CHCH 11 then it could be the Clear Stream vhf capability is very weak.
Hope this helps!
2011-08-17, 12:33 AM
In Nobleton, I can receive CHCH 11.1 (VHF) only after a complete reset of my Sony or Toshiba TV's. Rescanning to "add" a digital channel would ignore CHCH on VHF.
I'm using a VHF/UHF fringe antenna without a preamp. It is pointed south for Buffalo and Toronto. Hamilton is off side at about 35 degrees. CHCH analog had a strong signal with a minor amount of multipath. The Sony TV reports SNR and AGC. CHCH SNR is almost the same as before (on CH18 SNR was 26.8 dB) while the AGC shows a slightly stronger signal. AGC is unreliable due to tuner influence from other strong stations like CBC abd CTV.
I've recorded SNR and AGC levels of all the stations earlier this year and will be interested to see how the various stations fare post transition, especially CTV Toronto and Barrie with their lower powers on VHF.
2011-08-17, 05:59 AM
Since CHCH did not come in reliably at my location in Scarborough before this change over, I was assuming that it wasn't going to improve after the transition which it most certainly hasn't. I'm getting zero signal now. While it would be nice to receive the station, I'm not losing something I once had. More of a concern for me is what is going to happen with CFTO after the change over. I'm fully expecting that I'll be losing that station without a VHF antenna and with my 4221 antenna pointed at Buffalo. Right now with my current set up is about 90% reliable most of the time.
2011-08-17, 07:42 AM
Although I am hardly representative being well within the 60dBu contour for CHCH, here are my results. GOOD! With my GH10n3 with a CM7777 on a rotor, it locks in all 360 degrees on the rotor. CHCH on rf18 did not lock in all directions, but was very dependable.
TVfool places me at 26.4 miles from CHCH with a NM of 41.1 dB for rf 11.1. NM for CHCH on rf 18.1 was 46.7.
My next big test is after Aug 31 to see if CKVR on rf 10.1 locks (NM -13) and to see if the shutdown of CFTO analouge on rf 9 improves things for WBBZ on rf 7. Right now, WBBZ locks and is viewable about 10% of the time
2011-08-17, 08:15 AM
You are correct. I am in the tall condo building overlooking the soccer fields. I had lost 11, got it back, but now it's gone again and I haven't had any luck in getting it back. Needless to say, I am not happy. I will wait until September before I consider another antenna, but my CS2 has been very good to me. I did not expect to be receiving fewer stations after switchover than before.
2011-08-17, 11:39 AM
i'm in the north absolute building @ burhamthorpe/hurontario, 25th floor facing south. my 4221HD is sitting in a window, poiting directly at the building to my SE, which essentially splits and mildly impedes my LoS to the CN tower and buffalo.
decent 11-1 signl for the past year(90 percent of time it was watchable), always got 11. only difference for me sine the switchover has been no more 11.
moving to britannia/glen erin at the end of sept. hoping it doesn't take much, but enough to do some new tinkering, to keep my current line up.
2011-08-17, 12:17 PM
For any CHCH viewers or employees interested in a more comprehensive listing of U.S. VHF-high power increase requests for resolving viewer complaints of insufficient power/coverage, the following page provides plenty of additional helpful information:
Where the results of such power increase requests are incomplete, entering in the station call letters on the FCC's TV Database Query page can provide current licensed status and application information:
2011-08-17, 12:53 PM
The ERP for CHCH is lower than most LP stations in the U.S. and CHCH is considered a Full Power station.
Since CHCH did not come in reliably at my location in Scarborough before this change over, I was assuming that it wasn't going to improve after the transition which it most certainly hasn't. I'm getting zero signal now. While it would be nice to receive the station, I'm not losing something I once had.
No offence to the commenter above, but just to note, in case anyone from CHCH reads that and thinks they can therefore excuse themselves and skip providing a reliable signal to Scarborough...
I live in the far eastern corner of Scarborough, and I used to get SOLIDLY reliable CHCH reception with a just a simple indoor VHF/UHF Terk HDTVa antenna with the simple signal amplifier that came with it. I now get zero signal.
CHCH are obligated post-transition to replicate their previous coverage area. Current situation is therefore not acceptable.
2011-08-17, 01:14 PM
I would hope that all Canadian broadcasters involved in the GTA and surrounding markets will take note of the popularity of this thread and the viewership numbers of it and the OTA Forum during the DTV transition. No more B.S. about how nobody watches OTA TV anymore!
To stay on topic, I sincerely hope that the staff/owners of CHCH will take this thread as being a credit to the station's popularity. Advice offered here is made with the very best of intentions and respectfulness. :)
Keep up the great discussion, OTAers!
2011-08-17, 01:31 PM
I too have been following the discussion especially what happened when CHCH switched to VHF 11.1 yesterday.I too use to get channel 11.1 on MY LG 50' Plasma at Meadowvale/and Sheppard Ave east,(The Toronto ZOO is my backyard)and ever since the change i am not able to view the channel anymore.I have already sent two feedback to the station explaining the lost of the channel and that something must be done to increase power and soon.Lets keep up the pressure on them,and CTV 9.1 will be the next challenge at the end of the month,i hope most people fear better.:(
2011-08-17, 01:34 PM
I agree that if it "just worked" before, it shoulda been designed to "just work" after.
However, has anyone besides me had much better results at night than during the day?
Has anyone tried any fine tuning at night, say from 8 PM onwards. Two nights in a row since the switch, VHF 11 booms in here all night long on 4 of 4 tuners, with SNR in low to mid twenties, very acceptable. Meanwhile three days in a row it's marginal on two of 4 tuners and unusable on the other two during the daytime.
Note: Keep in mind I'm near Buffalo, nowhere near the intended service area.
But still would find it hard to believe If I were the only one with better results at night.
2011-08-17, 01:40 PM
Hello from Toronto.
I read this forum often. I joined the forum to vent about CHCH. With no problem (antenna in almost any direction since they went HD) I've always received CHCH on 11.1 with my Panasonic QAM tuner. Now it is gone. Don't make me move my antenna, I'm happy where it is.
Thanks for the vent.
OTA freak :cool:
2011-08-17, 01:51 PM
I've already fired off some e-mails to CHCH. I hope all of you that lost the station like myself, lets them know about it. It only takes 5 minutes. You also might want to let the CRTC know as well. 6KW is ridiculous for a Full power station. I don't know who made that awful decision.
From about 10pm through 8ish (have to leave for work) I can get CHCH with my DB8 pointed at Toronto. Mind you, the past few mornings I've been getting almost everything from Toronto so I think it is Tropo more than anything else.
But yes, I *can* get it, just not at any time convenient to actually watch for more than an hour.
2011-08-17, 02:05 PM
My 2 cents:
I am 27 miles east of their tower.
I am using an old CM4228 aimed at WGRZ.
I have a wingard UHF only preamp.
At max, 180 ft of RG6 to the upstairs TV.
CHCH DT 11-1 is now my strongest station.
It shows more dB on my Samsung TV than WNLO.
WNLO is 10 bars with 30+ dB.
CHCH is 10 bars with at least 32 dB.
Before shut down CHCH RF 18 was around 26 dB.
I am one of the few happy customers.
2011-08-17, 02:43 PM
Good day, I have been a loyal viewer of this extremely informative forum for years. I've used a lot of the information contributed by the many dedicated members here to fine tune my OTA equipment, many thanks & please keep this great forum beaming with information.
As this is my first post I wanted to let you know that I just E-Mailed CHCH letting them know that since the switch to VHF high I've lost their signal during the day & been spotty at night. My location is Browns Line & Evans Ave. & always received a reliable signal till the switch over.
2011-08-17, 02:57 PM
Knowing the CRTC the decision was probably made with full knowledge of what was going to happen. :(
2011-08-17, 03:13 PM
To stay on topic, I sincerely hope that the staff/owners of CHCH will take this thread as being a credit to the station's popularity.
And we have determined that CHCH is indeed operating at its final alloted power of 6.1 kW. So, this is it...for now.
I have three questions (albeit from afar but as an interested observer):
1). What's the digital signal like for CHCH now on RF-11 in Richmond Hill? Along with Scarborough, that's a part of GTA that I'm fairly familiar with. Back in the analog days, I was able to get CHCH reliably with a portable television with a whip antenna near Yonge and Elgin Mills.
2). What is the procedure for CHCH (or looking ahead, maybe CFTO) to file for increased power as a possible remedy?
3). Are there any "boots on the ground" from either the CRTC or IC to help troubleshoot the current CHCH reception problems?
When WLS-TV in Chicago transitioned to RF-7, the FCC sent staffers there to investigate. In fact they even visited viewer's homes to see the problems first hand. Within days, that resulted in an immediate, emergency power increase granted to WLS-TV (since made moot by moving to RF-44).
2011-08-17, 03:20 PM
About your question #2: as the DTV transition happens in Canada, with the expectation that other results will be similarly disappointing, we are gathering as much info as possible into specific threads.
In the aftermath of the DTV transition, as patterns and situations become clear, the OTA Forum will focus on how and when to intervene in CRTC proceedings to address the poor signals by making use of the accumulated data in those threads.