Can we get a sticky put up that displays the HDTV formats of all the major HDTV networks?

Here's what I've been able to find so far:
1080i is used by:
NBC, CBS, PBS, WB, UPN, HBO, Showtime, Starz, HDNet, Discovery, CityTV, TMN, CTV (not positive on this one)

720p is used by:
ABC, ESPN and I assume TSN (when it shows it), and Fox (coming late 2004)

Part of the reason there is no sticky is because it's constantly changing and some service providers change the format. Let's get a few corrections out of the way.

TSN is "broadcasting" at 1080i (even when "receiving" a programme from ABC/ESPN at 720P).

PBS is mostly 1080i, but PBS Detroit and several US stations have switched to 720P. This saves a little bandwidth, since many of the PBS stations are multicasting.

Fox is currently 480P and is switching to 720P. I hear that some affiliates in the US have already switched to broadcasting in 720P, but that their "feed" from the network is still 480P.

This takes care of how they are "broadcast", however, Bell ExpressVU "changes" some/all of the channels to 720P to save bandwidth. Since you're on BEV, this affects you.

I don't recall what Starchoice does.

The Cable companies do not change formats - what comes in, goes out.

Perhaps I'll make up an FAQ when I get the response for *C.

Where did you read about Expressvu converting to 720p for bandwidth reasons?

See the first page of this thread.

http://www.digitalhomecanada.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=13344&highlight=bev+720p

You beat me to the punch I just finished reading that after searching through the forums.

Thanks.

I e-mailed Expressvu directly asking for specific information on which format they are broadcasting each of their HD channels. I will post my findings if they get back to me.

They may not provide this information (although I don't see why not)

A few months ago I asked them what bitrate they used (broadcast utilizes up to 19.4 Mb/sec and cable "passes it through").

I'm pretty sure Satellite uses less, but they wouldn't tell me (proprietary information). It probably doesn't affect the PQ, but some of us just wanted to know...

TSN is "broadcasting" at 1080i (even when "receiving" a programme from ABC/ESPN at 720P).

Are you sure about this? I'm pretty sure that when they started broadcasting TSN HD it was announced as 720p. It was one of the big differences between Sportsnet HD and TSN HD. Can it be confirmed with your 3250HD box?

If they haven't changed in the last month since I checked, and since I disabled 720P on my STB, yes I'm sure. I did the checks when I first got my SA3250HD and also found PBS Detroit as 720P (someone else mentioned it).

PBS is mostly 1080i, but PBS Detroit and several US stations have switched to 720P. This saves a little bandwidth, since many of the PBS stations are multicasting.

Ah. I was wondering why PBS Detroit didn't quite have the punch it used to. Does anyone know what the PBS Seattle station is sending out?

A few months ago I asked them what bitrate they used (broadcast utilizes up to 19.4 Mb/sec and cable "passes it through").

I'm pretty sure Satellite uses less, but they wouldn't tell me (proprietary information). It probably doesn't affect the PQ, but some of us just wanted to know...

Typically 14 - 15 mbs, with some variation by channel. Occasionally they will shut off channels and output a higher bit rate (the oldtimers game was full atsc bit rates).

Are you sure about this? I'm pretty sure that when they started broadcasting TSN HD it was announced as 720p.

It depends on the feed they are picking up.

It depends on the feed they are picking up.
I don't agree. I believe they still push out 1080i, even when they receive stuff from ABC or ESPN originating as 720P.

Once a station decides on an output format, they don't switch back and forth, it's probably not an easy task.

Ah. I was wondering why PBS Detroit didn't quite have the punch it used to.
I've compared PBS Detroit (720p) and PBS Spokane (1080i) on simultaneous, identical programmes and did not notice a lack of punch on Detroit or a significant difference. Be sure you "test" on a true HD programme, a lot of PBS is simple upconverts.

I've created an FAQ that contains this information:

http://www.digitalhomecanada.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=97544#97544

They finally got back to me with this response. It suggests that they send whichever format they receive however I don't know why they tell me to make sure my format is set to 1080i?

Anyway here it is:

Thank you for your email inquiry dated 6/16/04 regarding our HDTV
channels. We apologize for the delayed response.

Bell ExpressVu broadcasts its channels in the format in which we receive
it. If you have a Model 6000 receiver, press the menu button on your
remote control, then select 6-1-9. Please ensure that under the heading
TV Type, your Model 6000 receiver is set to 1080i.

If you have any further questions or concerns please feel free to
contact us at our toll free number 1-888-SKYDISH. Our Customer Service
Department is available 24 hours, 7 days a week, for technical concerns
and activations. For all other inquiries, our office hours are Monday to
Friday 8AM to 9PM, and Saturday from 9AM to 6PM, your local time.
Thank you for choosing Bell ExpressVu as your satellite provider.

Original Message:
Can you provide me with the signals you are broadcasting for
each of your HD channels please. Either 720p or 1080i. I have read on
message boards that you are broadcasting most if not all HD channels in
720p format regardless of the format the network is originally sending
possibly to save bandwidth.

Hey 57... I don't know why you keep on saying that 720p uses less bandwidth...

here are my findings

HDTV is broadcast at 19.4 mb/s correct?

Well 720p uncompressed is 110.48 mb/s
and 1080i uncompressed is 124.29 mb/s (http://www.blackmagic-design.com/site/25support.htm)

So 1080i has to be compressed at 6.4:1
and 720p is compressed at 5.6:1

So the way I take it... 720p and 1080i are both broadcastes at 19.4 mb/s but it takes less compression for the 720p to reach 19.4 mb/s

So 1080i is a compression hog.. not a bandwidth hog.

As long as BEV broadcast at 19.4 mb/s ... Maybe they don't....

I might be way off here... if I am... I'm sure you'll correct me!

As long as BEV broadcast at 19.4 mb/s ... Maybe they don't....
They don't. And, in most cases, a broadcaster shoves an HD stream and at least one SD stream within that 19.4Mb/s signal. It's all about how much compression you can apply to the signal before it becomes obviously degraded. Since 720p compresses 'better', they can squeeze it more and use less bandwidth for it.

Please ensure that under the heading
TV Type, your Model 6000 receiver is set to 1080i.
Unless, of course, your HDTV is LCD or DLP which is most likely 720p. :roll:

Please ensure that under the heading
TV Type, your Model 6000 receiver is set to 1080i.
Unless, of course, your HDTV is LCD or DLP which is most likely 720p. :roll:

You can exclude "most likely" from your sentence and it will become even more correct. :)

This reminds me of "This movie has been changed from the original version. It has been modified to fit your screen". Well, isn't that a blatant lie - it has actually been " modified to NOT fit my screen", but then again, who am I statistically :)

Please ensure that under the heading
TV Type, your Model 6000 receiver is set to 1080i.
Unless, of course, your HDTV is LCD or DLP which is most likely 720p. :roll:

You can exclude "most likely" from your sentence and it will become even more correct. :)

This reminds me of "This movie has been changed from the original version. It has been modified to fit your screen". Well, isn't that a blatant lie - it has actually been " modified to NOT fit my screen", but then again, who am I statistically :)

Regardless I don't see why the rep would recommend this as he doesn't know how I'm viewing my High Def let alone that it has nothing to do with my original question. As it is I use a projector and can display either 720p or 1080i and I find it annoying that I must switch between this manually in the receiver depending on which station I'm on. Well I guess I don't have to but I'd rather not have the receiver up or down convert the original signal.