@Martinus
Since you are using only a 4 bay aimed between Mont-Royal and Mount-Mansfield the antenna might not be catching the channels on either side all that well. I suggest you get a 8 bay and point it straight at Mount-Mansfield.

If you get CBS 3.1 and NBC 5.1 you should also get PBS 33.1 as well. Fox 44.1 is another matter as their transmitter is much weaker of the other three and need to have the antenna pointed squarely at Mount-Mansfield.

A preamp is used directly at the point of the antenna while a drop amp is used in between long cable runs. Quality drop amps are also less expensive than pre-amps so if there is no need for a pre amp then a drop amp will suffice.

Your CM4221HD has about a 12dB gain and the 50ft coax looses another 2.5dB giving you roughly a 9.5dB signal to your tuner. I pretty much like to balance out my system to have the same amount as the net gain of the antenna. With my 14dB CM4228HD after a 100 feet of coax and 3 splits I am able to balance out at least 15dB signal at each of those 3 ports.

i agree ATSC is very picky, and requires highly directional equipment, i said this before, and it hasnt changed since, southwest of montreal ATSC is way too much of a challenge for the average non OTA hobbyist

even with very high NM according to TVFool, reception is very spotty and unreliable

as for adds reaching much smaller market, i would say no, they dont care, less than 10% use OTA, probably much less in quebec

I'm new to this and have a 4221HD as well. In my attic I couldn't get much of anything. I bought a chimney mount kit and mounted it on a mast to my chimney and get great reception on 44, 33 and 57. If you can get yours outside that would help a lot.
I use a pre amp also, CM7778.

Next week I'm going to try another 4221HD, one pointed at Mt. Mansfield and the other at Montreal, hopefully that will work even better.

@Martinus, I start watching OTA 3 years ago, when I got from Motrak the powered antena they sell. I was getting all the channels from US besides ABC. Installed in the attic. For ABC I got a 4228HD antena pointed straight to US. Inside I had a switch to change between the two antenas.
After the transition, I get everything just with my first antenna, including ABC.
On the 4228HD antenna I cannot get SRC and CTV.
I can say for sure that 4221 is to weak to get the most channels. I recommend the powered antenna. At least for me it's getting me most of the channels

I don't get at all V and Metro14.

@ Vasiler
What kind of antenna you got from Motrak ?

When you say powered, do you mean amplified ?

@ Vasiler
What kind of antenna you got from Motrak ?

When you say powered, do you mean amplified ?

Yes, it's one of those with motor. You can change position. Like this one :

http://importbestbuys.com/catalog/motrak-outdoor-amplified-hdtv-antenna-motorized-p-2029.html

But I don't have to do that. I found a sweet spot half way between mont royal and us and i get everything.

@vasiler

Where are you located?

NDIP, StJoseph/VirginieRoy, close to de la samare school.

To be 100% fair, you still need a dedicated antenna for ABC to be sure you're getting it all the time. Right now it's pixelated on the amplified antenna but a full lock on the 4228HD.

Day two of my OTA experiment.

Having read some of the comments, I went back to the store and got a second CM4221HD. The idea was to have one pointing towards Mount Royal, the other towards Mount Mansfield.

Well, the end result is worst. I've now lost 5.1., 5.2, 15.1 and the PBS channels. Yesterday I was briefly getting the ones in the 33.1 + range and, depending on the antenna placement, the ones in the 57.1 + range.

I forgot to mention, that I still don't get SRC from the attic or 74 (which I briefly got from the back yard as an experiment)

I'm not going back in the attic for a while, aside from the dust from the cellulose it's too hot (+/- 40)

I was told that an amplifier would not help from the people at the store...

MARtin

I was told that an amplifier would not help from the people at the store...



Canadian Tire GE amp is 20$. Although it isn't a proper antenna pre-amp (it can't go outside, it has a high noise level (5dB, not 2.5 like real antenna pre-amp). Still, it helped all my channels, giving me access to new channel I could not get without a pre-amp. And I installed it in the attic (so no problem with being outside). If it doesn't work for you, you can always return it to Canadian Tire. (but you see, they made a sale with me...)

jf

@Martinus
Having 2 CM4221HD is not going to help because the gain from Mount Mansfield is still limited to 12dB and by using a two way splitter you even reduced the the gains from both antenna by another 3.5dB plus you will also have the problem of the antenna causing cross interference.

@EdT

So I have two too many CM4221HD and I would be short a CM4228HD and a drop amp?

Any recommendation as to what kind of drop amp would be a good one?

If any one is interested in a CM 4221HD, I know a guy with a few too many! More seriously, I imagine that there is no guarantee that any one set up will pick up everything, right?

At the rate I'm going, the cheapest of the cheap Satellite or cable package is starting to look attractive...

@Martinus

Yes, a CM4228HD will give you more range than the CM4221HD 60 miles vs 45 miles as well as a wider beam width so that you can aim it straight Mount-Mansfield and still be able to pick-up Mont-Royal and Lyons Mountain on either side without having to move the antenna. The CM3410 is a great drop amp with low dB noise and relatively inexpensive and can be found locally.

OTA is relatively inexpensive if you take into account that once you have it set-up it will give back forever. I can proudly say I have never paid a penny to those cable and satellite subscriptions.

If you take even basic cable which is around $35 +taxes with a bundle:
$40 x 12 = $480/year.

You can do wonders with $480 on OTA equipment and your pay back is less than a year plus the satisfaction of knowing that you are not one of those 90% of Zombies that pay to those greedy cable and satellite companies !

Uh oh, my second 4221hd arrives Tuesday, I'll try it anyways. Hopefully I'll have better luck.
If that doesn't work what about pointing them in the same direction so you have an 8 bay.

So I don't want to Jack a thread and I have been searching but this seemed tp be the best place to post...

I am in Pointe Claire and have been setting up a basic sytem for my mother in law and have no problem getting PBS in VT and channel 6.

Channel 12.1 is a nightmare, but doing some searches I saw that Mt royal is a problem.

Do some antenaes aim to 2 areas at once? My mother in law has trouble with call waiting never mind aiming an antenae.

Any ideas?

Also I am thinking of setting up an OTA setup along with my satelite.

Would an attic setup work for me? My dish is ugly enough outside!

Thanks!

@Goodtohave

There some clone 8 bay bowtie antennas that split in half, but they are not on the recommended antenna list and have been found to be more of a problem than anything else. Just search these forums on it !

An attic set-up will limit some gain on your antenna and also depends how high it is.

Day two of my OTA experiment.

Having read some of the comments, I went back to the store and got a second CM4221HD. The idea was to have one pointing towards Mount Royal, the other towards Mount Mansfield.

(...)
I was told that an amplifier would not help from the people at the store...

MARtin

Day three of my OTA experiment

After getting some more advice from some of you guys (thanks in particular to Vasiler and EdT), I went back to the store today to get an amplifier.

Martin

Here are my results with the amp installed :

SRC 2.1 at 50%
CBS 3.1 at 60%
CBS Weather 3.2 at 60%
NBC 5.1 at 55 %
THIS 5.2 at 55%
CBC 6.1 at 82%
TVA 10.1 at 78 %
CTV 12.1 at 70 %
Global 15.1 at 60%
Télé-Québec 17.1 at 90%
PBS 33.1 at 70 %
PBS 33.2 at 72%
VPT 33.3 at 70%
VPT 33.4 at 67 %
FOX 44.1 at 42 %
CW 44.2 at 38 %
PBS 57.1 at 60 %
PBS 57.2 at 58%
PBS World 57.3 at 65 %
MTL Metro 62.1 at 55 %

Not Bad!

Any idea on how I can get ABC? I`ll be going back in the attic to tinker with my directions for my two antennas.

Martinus, are you using both 4221's?

If I can get both mine working together I might try adding a Winegard YA-1713 for ABC since my 7778 pre-amp has a separate VHF input.

@johnvan

Yes, I am.

Since my previous post, my channels at less than 60% have started to come and go.

I might go up and work on the directions, move the amp closer to the antennas and/or disconnect one of the two antennas.

Martin

@Martinus

What kind of amp did you get ?

Problem with the antenna in the attic is that signals can often bounce off the the walls giving unstable locks.